recirculating ball vs rack pinion

[yao500e]

E500E experts,

I was told rack pinion is far far superior to recirculating ball steering.

I have zero issues and complaints about the w124 e500e and w202 C36 recirculating ball steering. totally fine and ok for me.

I drove a w203 C55 back to back against my C36 and both felt fine.

Any thoughts and opinions?

 

[gsxr]

Depends on your definition of "superior". R&P can provide a bit more feedback at the steering wheel and feel more "connected" to the tires. However, the 124 (and 500E) were never designed to be track cars to attack twisty roads, but rather they were intended to be autobahn missiles. Recirculating ball works quite well for this use case.

FWIW, I was never super impressed with the steering feel of the W210 which had the allegedly superior R&P steering. The 210 feel is way too light. @Jlaa owns both, I'm curious what his opinion is on this (think he's posted before on this topic).

While I wouldn't mind a quicker ratio (fewer turns lock to lock) on the 124 / 500E, I have zero complaints with the steering feel, for street use. @jhodg5ck has track time in these cars at Road Atlanta, he can comment on how much of a hinderance the old steering box is on a road course.

 

[sheward]

I have never been able to find fault with the recirculating ball steering on the 500E. It provides good feedback, it's precise, and has just the right weight to it. I have another car with variable assist rack and pinion and although I like it, I find it a bit too light at times and the car does not re center itself like the 500E. That could be steering geometry in play as well.

 

[Rouven036]

I also state that there is nothing wrong it is merely a matter of the setup - as how much comfort is wanted during the development process.
DTM 190s also had always the (more direct) recirculating steering box...
For road use it has by far enough feedback on the sportier E5E or on a 201-16.

 

[gerryvz]

E500E experts,

I was told rack pinion is far far superior to recirculating ball steering.

I have zero issues and complaints about the w124 e500e and w202 C36 recirculating ball steering. totally fine and ok for me.

I drove a w203 C55 back to back against my C36 and both felt fine.

Any thoughts and opinions?

MB was probably a bit later than most manufacturers to move away from recirculating ball steering, when they introduced the W210 models in 1995 (roughly the 1996 model year). At one time, many many manufacturers used recirculating ball.

Never seen any issues with recirculating ball steering in any of the MBs that I've owned, and to be honest I can't tell the difference between it, and rack & pinion steering. I'm just not that discerning. I mostly care about:

1) the car going where I point it by turning the steering wheel
2) no play or slop in the steering, especially in the "center" position (factory spec for recirc ball is generally 1" or less play)
3) no hoses, reservoir or steering box fluid leakage or seepage

As long as the car turns and goes where I tell it to, I don't care if it has Flintstones steering. My 2007 E63 AMG has rack and pinion steering and I can't tell the difference between it and my E500.

Cheers,
Gerry

 

[Glen]

'Far far superior' is a pretty massive exaggeration. Both systems can provide nice feedback and overall feel. Where I notice the difference is "on center" while driving down a straight road. Recirc-ball steering in this case can be slightly vague, that is, you can move the steering wheel very slightly in either direction without affecting the direction of travel. In a good rack and pinion system, any movement of the steering wheel can be felt in a direction change of the car. Personally, I don't think the difference is worth worrying about.

 

[gerryvz]

I agree with @Glen.

The one area for recirc-ball steering that is demonstrably inferior to rack-n-pinion is probably going to be the on-center feel at the neutral position. With recirc-ball there is usually always a small "dead spot" in the center, a lot of which depends on the wear and tear, and adjustment, of the steering box. I've driven some pretty dreadful older Benzes (seem like they are always 123s and diesel 126s) that have a 2-inch dead spot when the car is going straight ahead down the road. It's a pretty weird feeling to move the wheel 1-2 inches and have no reaction. But, often this can be partially adjusted out, or the box can be rebuilt (or a rebuilt box can be installed).

With a box that isn't worn, as @Glen said it's negligible in terms of comparing the two.

I haven't seen/experienced this with a r-n-p steering car.