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Royal Purple
- Thread starter gerryvz
- Start date
Funny you should ask. I just switched back to it last weekend.
As some of you know, my last car was a historically significant 190E 2.3-16. Using Mobil-1, it would always burn about 1/2 quart every 1500 miles. Everyone I knew with one of these cars confirmed that this was normal behavior for the 16V engine - even noted in the specs - and it didn't trouble me. I would change the oil, have 1/2 quart left over, then put that 1/2 quart in after 1500 miles, and when it needed another 1/2 quart, it was time for another change. At one point I decided to try the Royal Purple, and after 1500 miles the low oil light was not coming on. I wondered if the light was broken. Checked the oil, and it was still spot on. I never had to add oil between changes again when using RP.
I had been using Mobil-1 in the 500E only because I couldn't find RP in the correct weight, but last weekend when preparing for an oil change I saw RP 15W-40 at AutoZone in gallon jugs. Score! Maybe my imagination, but the 500E seems to run smoother. Also maybe coincidence, but my gas mileage for the 2 tanks since the change has been 1.5-2 mpg better, now sitting right around 20.
As some of you know, my last car was a historically significant 190E 2.3-16. Using Mobil-1, it would always burn about 1/2 quart every 1500 miles. Everyone I knew with one of these cars confirmed that this was normal behavior for the 16V engine - even noted in the specs - and it didn't trouble me. I would change the oil, have 1/2 quart left over, then put that 1/2 quart in after 1500 miles, and when it needed another 1/2 quart, it was time for another change. At one point I decided to try the Royal Purple, and after 1500 miles the low oil light was not coming on. I wondered if the light was broken. Checked the oil, and it was still spot on. I never had to add oil between changes again when using RP.
I had been using Mobil-1 in the 500E only because I couldn't find RP in the correct weight, but last weekend when preparing for an oil change I saw RP 15W-40 at AutoZone in gallon jugs. Score! Maybe my imagination, but the 500E seems to run smoother. Also maybe coincidence, but my gas mileage for the 2 tanks since the change has been 1.5-2 mpg better, now sitting right around 20.
Interesting! I'm definitely going to drop by their HQ one of these days when I'm working from home and talk to them. I believe Scott Shell (owner of 500X.com) also uses their oils in his car, IIRC.
I'm just interested to know whether their stuff is quality or not. I use Chevron dino oil in my E320 wagon, 560SEC and 560SL, and M1 Euro formula in my E500. Love to support the home-town team, so maybe I'll give the Purple a whirl. Thanks for relating your experience !
Cheers,
Gerry
I'm just interested to know whether their stuff is quality or not. I use Chevron dino oil in my E320 wagon, 560SEC and 560SL, and M1 Euro formula in my E500. Love to support the home-town team, so maybe I'll give the Purple a whirl. Thanks for relating your experience !
Cheers,
Gerry
Prime, what weight of Mobil-1 was burning a 1/2 quart between changes? I experienced similar behavior (on a different car) but only with certain viscosities of Mobil-1, not all Mobil-1. I believe that Mobil has cheaped out and switched to a Group III base stock on some of their M-1 products, which would explain the increased consumption over time. Again, only some varieties of M-1 seem to do this. I currently use the 5W-40 with no problems.
BTW - 20mpg on the 500E is pretty darn good, especially if that's not all freeway cruising. Synthetics can improve your fuel economy a bit but usually it's around 3-5%, your results are better than average. The only time I've gotten over 20mpg on my E500 was with the stock wheels & tires... peak was 23.1mpg, second best was 22.8mpg (reserve light came on at 460 miles). Both were long freeway trips with the cruise set at 70-80mph. I haven't been able to break 20mpg under any circumstances with the fat 18" iForged wheels though.
BTW - 20mpg on the 500E is pretty darn good, especially if that's not all freeway cruising. Synthetics can improve your fuel economy a bit but usually it's around 3-5%, your results are better than average. The only time I've gotten over 20mpg on my E500 was with the stock wheels & tires... peak was 23.1mpg, second best was 22.8mpg (reserve light came on at 460 miles). Both were long freeway trips with the cruise set at 70-80mph. I haven't been able to break 20mpg under any circumstances with the fat 18" iForged wheels though.
Dave,
I'll bet my head that if you set your cruise control at 55mph you will easily break the 20mpg barrier.
Cheers,
Orazio
I'll bet my head that if you set your cruise control at 55mph you will easily break the 20mpg barrier.
Cheers,
Orazio
It's a shame the large wheels/tires come with such a penalty in fuel consumption. Even swapping to 2.65 gears didn't break the 20mpg barrier at 75mph with the 18's.
I used 15W-50 Mobil-1 in the 16V. Switched to a thicker oil in the winter, but always experienced the 1/2 quart burn-off in about 1500 miles until I switched to RP.
My near-20 mpg is driving to and from work every day. Some highway driving, but not all. Can't complain. I think I've gotten some VERY full fill-ups that might be swaying those results, but I was getting 16-17 with Mobil-1, and I'm sure there has been some increase, if only to 18-19.
My near-20 mpg is driving to and from work every day. Some highway driving, but not all. Can't complain. I think I've gotten some VERY full fill-ups that might be swaying those results, but I was getting 16-17 with Mobil-1, and I'm sure there has been some increase, if only to 18-19.
That is very interesting. The problem I had was also with 15W-50 and went away when I switched to 5W-40 (or 15W-40 Amsoil). It kind of confirms my suspicion that Mobil-1 15W-50 ain't what it used to be years ago.Prime said:
Hey, anything near 20mpg on a 500E is darn good - I'd be thrilled with that. Just curious, what size wheels/tires are you running?Prime said:
+1 for Royal Purple in both the E500E and Suburban, PO used M1 exclusively in the 500E.
I've had similar experiences with consumption of Mobile 1 the one time I put it in the Suburban.
Off topic, on the mileage issue, both of my primary vehicles have been up almost 2 MPG the last two tank fulls. Possibly they're jacking with the gas formulas?
OBTW, welcome to Texas I hope you and the family are finding life in Houston to your liking!
Mark
I've had similar experiences with consumption of Mobile 1 the one time I put it in the Suburban.
Off topic, on the mileage issue, both of my primary vehicles have been up almost 2 MPG the last two tank fulls. Possibly they're jacking with the gas formulas?
OBTW, welcome to Texas I hope you and the family are finding life in Houston to your liking!
Mark
Guys,
I think Prime is on to something. Take a look at the Oil Test I posted. Note that it is only one test but I think one that is very important.
For me I switched to Mobil 1 15-50 last year and am not happy with it at all. I never had to add oil when I used Valvoline 20-50 Dino oil but after 3K over over the past year I was down a quart with the Mobil 1.
After seeing the results Prime brought up about his 16 Valve I think I have found what I want to use next, providing it doesn't cost an arm and a leg per gallon. For sure I will not be using M 1 for this oil change.
Gerry, after seeing your cam lobe was it? on your 560 rebuild you should be interested in these results also because your cam lobe looked like part of this oil test.
There is only one better or equal in this test Penrite but I have never seen it in CA.
There is a ton of info online about this stuff but this particular article struck a nerve with me.
This is just a portion of the oils tested I could not upload everything.
You can find it whole test by googling Royal Purple vs Mobil 1
This ought to muck up the picture a little.
I think Prime is on to something. Take a look at the Oil Test I posted. Note that it is only one test but I think one that is very important.
For me I switched to Mobil 1 15-50 last year and am not happy with it at all. I never had to add oil when I used Valvoline 20-50 Dino oil but after 3K over over the past year I was down a quart with the Mobil 1.
After seeing the results Prime brought up about his 16 Valve I think I have found what I want to use next, providing it doesn't cost an arm and a leg per gallon. For sure I will not be using M 1 for this oil change.
Gerry, after seeing your cam lobe was it? on your 560 rebuild you should be interested in these results also because your cam lobe looked like part of this oil test.
There is only one better or equal in this test Penrite but I have never seen it in CA.
There is a ton of info online about this stuff but this particular article struck a nerve with me.
This is just a portion of the oils tested I could not upload everything.
You can find it whole test by googling Royal Purple vs Mobil 1
This ought to muck up the picture a little.
My 560SEC has run on Chevron 20W-50 dino oil (which is highly rated in most tests I've known of). I don't believe that my cam issue is at all a lubrication issue with the properties of the oil itself, but rather due to a lack of lubrication by the lube system. It is also VERY common for the right-side of M117 engines to be starved of oil and suffer from this type of wear at higher mileages. I've researched this quite a bit.
As far as my examination could tell, my oiler tubes and fittings were not clogged and were working just fine. I think it's just a normal mileage/wear and tear issue as far as my cam issue.
Cheers,
Gerry
As far as my examination could tell, my oiler tubes and fittings were not clogged and were working just fine. I think it's just a normal mileage/wear and tear issue as far as my cam issue.
Cheers,
Gerry
Note that this test was conducted outside the USA, possibly in Australia. The oils sold there are not always the same as what you buy in the USA, particularly for the big name brands (i.e., Mobil). Meaning, the Mobil-1 0W-40 formula they tested may not be the same as the M-1 0W-40 you'd buy in the USA. I couldn't find a date on that test, I'm curious how old it is.
I'm also not convinced their test methodology is appropriate, i.e. does it really mimic any real-world operating conditions? I've seen other tests where M-1 was near the top of the charts and RP was at the bottom. It's tough to say either way. I'd want to look at more tests from other labs to get a broader viewpoint.
For the record, I don't have any problem with RP products.
:sports:
I'm also not convinced their test methodology is appropriate, i.e. does it really mimic any real-world operating conditions? I've seen other tests where M-1 was near the top of the charts and RP was at the bottom. It's tough to say either way. I'd want to look at more tests from other labs to get a broader viewpoint.
For the record, I don't have any problem with RP products.
:sports:
, 
Royal Purple does cost an arm and a leg. Autozone in CA $8.99 qt. No price break for the gallon containers either. Even the 4 gallon case has no price break.
Wall Mart 5-30 for $8.47 qt but no gallon containers or other viscosities.
Another note most of the other oil brands sell a 5+ quart container giving a pretty good discount for the large container.
Example Mobil 1 15-50 5qts about $23.00 @ Wall Mart little higher at AutoZone vs Royal Purple at $35.96 for 4 quarts.
Not sure I am prepared to spend $87.59 just for the oil to go 3K miles in a year.
Anybody found this stuff at a better price?
I may have to find a plan B.
Yeah, you've found why I've been still using M-1, despite my misgivings about their product, marketing, etc. FWIW - Red Line is priced in the same neighborhood, around $9/qt.
Note that with any of these good synthetics you can *easily* go 5kmi between changes, and with normal service (not severe service, no racetrack usage, etc) you could safely extend this to 7.5k or longer. In some of my cars I've gone 2 years between oil changes. Only dino oil needs to be changed every 3k. I get oil analysis with each change to prove there is no issue with the longer drain interval.
Note that with any of these good synthetics you can *easily* go 5kmi between changes, and with normal service (not severe service, no racetrack usage, etc) you could safely extend this to 7.5k or longer. In some of my cars I've gone 2 years between oil changes. Only dino oil needs to be changed every 3k. I get oil analysis with each change to prove there is no issue with the longer drain interval.
In regards to the Royal Purple resistance to wear being so high I found this article online posted from the Mobil website from a inquiring customer:
Ask Mobil
Oil Film Strength of Mobil 1 Compared with Royal Purple
Ask Your Stickiest Question. . . Or ask us something you’ve always wanted to know about using our products. We’ll sort through all the submissions and present the best questions to our automotive experts. We'll share the questions and their answers here.
Question:
Oil Film Strength of Mobil 1 Compared with Royal Purple
Does Mobil 1 have less oil film strength than Royal Purple? I have seen many times the friction test of oils using the machine that test the oil film, test result shows that Royal Purple has more friction protection that Mobil 1 does, seeing these results makes me think that Mobil 1 is lacking some benefits, therefore Royal Purple has the better protection of all.
-- Guillermo Tristani, Miami, OR
Answer:
There are certain oils in the market today that use EP (extreme pressure) additives in their engine oil that are really designed for gear oils and not engine oils. Extreme pressure additives are typically not used in engine oils for a number of reasons but the most important is because they can cause engine corrosion over time. The rigs being used in these demonstrations are primarily designed for industrial applications like gear oils where extreme pressure is an important performance feature you need. These demonstration rigs have very little to do with modern engines and that is the reason that market leading oils in the industry perform poorly in these tests.
Also, I saw another article from the Street Commodores Mag that was a followup to the Oils Aint Oils artical that stated that their test was probably irrelavent for basically the same reason Mobil-1 gave.
Ask Mobil
Oil Film Strength of Mobil 1 Compared with Royal Purple
Ask Your Stickiest Question. . . Or ask us something you’ve always wanted to know about using our products. We’ll sort through all the submissions and present the best questions to our automotive experts. We'll share the questions and their answers here.
Question:
Oil Film Strength of Mobil 1 Compared with Royal Purple
Does Mobil 1 have less oil film strength than Royal Purple? I have seen many times the friction test of oils using the machine that test the oil film, test result shows that Royal Purple has more friction protection that Mobil 1 does, seeing these results makes me think that Mobil 1 is lacking some benefits, therefore Royal Purple has the better protection of all.
-- Guillermo Tristani, Miami, OR
Answer:
There are certain oils in the market today that use EP (extreme pressure) additives in their engine oil that are really designed for gear oils and not engine oils. Extreme pressure additives are typically not used in engine oils for a number of reasons but the most important is because they can cause engine corrosion over time. The rigs being used in these demonstrations are primarily designed for industrial applications like gear oils where extreme pressure is an important performance feature you need. These demonstration rigs have very little to do with modern engines and that is the reason that market leading oils in the industry perform poorly in these tests.
Also, I saw another article from the Street Commodores Mag that was a followup to the Oils Aint Oils artical that stated that their test was probably irrelavent for basically the same reason Mobil-1 gave.
By the way, those tests didn't look very "real-world applicable" to me either. All I know is what results I have achieved first-hand, and for me the Royal Purple has been the best oil I have used. For those bemoaning the cost, I calculate that the improved gas mileage has saved me about $25US in just 3 weeks and 4 fill-ups, so over the 5-7k miles between oil changes, the RP will more than pay for itself in fuel savings.
Prime,
What you say about the mileage vs oil cost does make sense. At the cost of todays premium fuel at around $3.25 gallon a 2 mpg increase over 3000 miles would net you around $68.00 in fuel savings.
"No whammy here - 4th tank gave me a best all-time (for me) at 21.76 mpg."
I am curious how lightfooted you are (and Gerry for that matter) to get that high mileage.
I and most of us on this board can't resist putting the hammer down a few times between fillups that pretty much kills any high mileage claims.
You have to be very patient man.
Please keep us informed as to your mileage and other performance aspects of this oil.
I still haven't ruled out using it but I would be using the 20-50.
Take Care
What you say about the mileage vs oil cost does make sense. At the cost of todays premium fuel at around $3.25 gallon a 2 mpg increase over 3000 miles would net you around $68.00 in fuel savings.
"No whammy here - 4th tank gave me a best all-time (for me) at 21.76 mpg."
I am curious how lightfooted you are (and Gerry for that matter) to get that high mileage.
I and most of us on this board can't resist putting the hammer down a few times between fillups that pretty much kills any high mileage claims.
You have to be very patient man.
Please keep us informed as to your mileage and other performance aspects of this oil.
I still haven't ruled out using it but I would be using the 20-50.
Take Care
Here is a graph of the last year of my mileage fill-ups in the E500. You can see that my lifetime mileage for the car is 17 MPG.
I am not particularly heavy on the throttle, but I tend to do a lot of suburban and stoplight-to-stoplight driving, and less on the freeway. If I do heavier freeway driving, my average is generally 18-19, and can be 20-21 on longer trips.
17-18 MPG is about right for typical commute/errand/weekend driving for me, though.
Cheers,
Gerry
I am not particularly heavy on the throttle, but I tend to do a lot of suburban and stoplight-to-stoplight driving, and less on the freeway. If I do heavier freeway driving, my average is generally 18-19, and can be 20-21 on longer trips.
17-18 MPG is about right for typical commute/errand/weekend driving for me, though.
Cheers,
Gerry
Attachments
Gerry,
I knew that mileage comment would get a rise out of you. I do commend you for that mileage average regular synthetic M1. It is M1 that you have been using isn't it?
My only bitch about the M1 is I never used oil before but for this last 3K miles when I switched to the M1 15-50. It is not setting well with me. I may just go back to the Valvoline 20-50 I was using.
You brought up the Royal Purple. Are you going to get a chance to check out the stuff in person? The stuff has my interest with my next oil change coming up this week and Prime's claims of increased mileage it would make it possible to use it.
Take Care
I knew that mileage comment would get a rise out of you. I do commend you for that mileage average regular synthetic M1. It is M1 that you have been using isn't it?
My only bitch about the M1 is I never used oil before but for this last 3K miles when I switched to the M1 15-50. It is not setting well with me. I may just go back to the Valvoline 20-50 I was using.
You brought up the Royal Purple. Are you going to get a chance to check out the stuff in person? The stuff has my interest with my next oil change coming up this week and Prime's claims of increased mileage it would make it possible to use it.
Take Care
I happened to look at it today (10W-30) at an auto parts store I was at over lunchtime, getting a hose clamp. I wouldn't use that weight but I am seriously thinking of trying it with my next 2 or 3 oil changes and seeing if it has any differences in mileage or pressure characteristics over the Mobil 1 0W-40 Euro Formula I've been using for the past few years. The 0W-40 idles the car with very low pressure - the oil pressure needle on my car is on 1 when then engine is warm/hot. It's pegged at 3 when there is load on the engine.
Cheers,
Gerry
Cheers,
Gerry
TerryA said:
Believe me, my foot is not light, although it has gotten more so after the $250 speeding ticket I got in September! Still, I punch it when I get the chance, and have even raced some other fast cars during the time I've been listing mileage (all completely safely and legally of course...ahem). I will say that the 21.76 mpg tankful happened to include two two-hour-long drives on the urban highway when the traffic gods favored me (that NEVER happens). I find that the biggest gas waster in this car is shutting it down and restarting. It seems to use up about a quart of gas just to crank it over.
Well,
After realizing it took me 23 months to accumalate 3,000 miles on my Mobil 1 15-50 oil which I did not particularly like I took the plunge and spent $87.60 for 9 Qts of ROYAL PURPLE 20-50 weight oil.
I put it in Sunday after R&R the oil pan to replace the 2 cheap ass 'O' rings in my oil level sending unit.
I am not sure about the mileage claims especially with using the 20-50 weight.
At the same time I also went back to my Timevalve Y-Pipe so I am running pretty much a full CAT-BACK system again with my Ren-Tech back box. It is definitely a little louder but it sounds pretty good outside of the car but still to loud inside so I will be installing some Dynamatt inside the car ASAP! The installation will be similar to Dave's (gsxr).
Stay tuned for gas mileage updates.
Also you can buy RP on line for around $7.50 qt if you have the patience to wait.
After realizing it took me 23 months to accumalate 3,000 miles on my Mobil 1 15-50 oil which I did not particularly like I took the plunge and spent $87.60 for 9 Qts of ROYAL PURPLE 20-50 weight oil.
I put it in Sunday after R&R the oil pan to replace the 2 cheap ass 'O' rings in my oil level sending unit.
I am not sure about the mileage claims especially with using the 20-50 weight.
At the same time I also went back to my Timevalve Y-Pipe so I am running pretty much a full CAT-BACK system again with my Ren-Tech back box. It is definitely a little louder but it sounds pretty good outside of the car but still to loud inside so I will be installing some Dynamatt inside the car ASAP! The installation will be similar to Dave's (gsxr).
Stay tuned for gas mileage updates.
Also you can buy RP on line for around $7.50 qt if you have the patience to wait.
I f I may be so bold as to say that ever since switching from what I believe may have been 10w-30 from po's records to m1 15w-50, the benefits have been less valvetrain noise on start-up, oil pressure doubled at idle,hot in gear and more importantly it has stopped burning oil..odd to see those who are displeased by it or have not experienced any positive results.
PS great job with the site Gerry
PS great job with the site Gerry
Thanks for the compliment. It's a work in progress.... as time allows.
My car is a couple hundred miles overdue for an oil change, so I am going to purchase Royal Purple oil and switch it over from the Mobil 1 0W-40 European Car Formula black label and 15W-50 that I've been running for the past 6.5 years. Probably will get it this coming weekend.
Will let folks know how it all works out.
Cheers,
Gerry
My car is a couple hundred miles overdue for an oil change, so I am going to purchase Royal Purple oil and switch it over from the Mobil 1 0W-40 European Car Formula black label and 15W-50 that I've been running for the past 6.5 years. Probably will get it this coming weekend.
Will let folks know how it all works out.
Cheers,
Gerry
Thanks for following up. It turns out that I happened to be in Wal-Mart and found that the 5W-40 Turbo Diesel Truck Mobil 1 was on sale, so I got a couple of jugs and used that. It was an "impulse buy".
I'll use RP for my next change. Probably will be early next year or next spring.
Cheers,
Gerry
I'll use RP for my next change. Probably will be early next year or next spring.
Cheers,
Gerry
Guys,
If anybody is still interested in the Royal Purple oil. I must say that I am happy to report that after switching to RP 20-50 last April that I am no longer using any oil.
I have run up 3,000 miles on the oil change and after checking the dipstick last week it is still at a 1/4" down from the top. The oil still looks pretty clean on the dipstick.
Also I have noticed that all of my minor leaks seemed to have stopped. There is no more oil under the car when it has been sitting for weeks at a time.
I still don't see any better mileage but I am way overdue for new plugs. My best milage on the freeway is about 18 mpg.
I intend to leave it in at least until 4,000 miles. At that time I will decide if 5K is possible.
Take Care
If anybody is still interested in the Royal Purple oil. I must say that I am happy to report that after switching to RP 20-50 last April that I am no longer using any oil.
I have run up 3,000 miles on the oil change and after checking the dipstick last week it is still at a 1/4" down from the top. The oil still looks pretty clean on the dipstick.
Also I have noticed that all of my minor leaks seemed to have stopped. There is no more oil under the car when it has been sitting for weeks at a time.
I still don't see any better mileage but I am way overdue for new plugs. My best milage on the freeway is about 18 mpg.
I intend to leave it in at least until 4,000 miles. At that time I will decide if 5K is possible.
Take Care
Bumping old thread
Terry, if you are interested in how long you can run oil in the car, give one of the oil analysis dudes a try if you haven't done so already - they tend to run $20-40, depending on what tests you do. I use blackstone, costs $33 with the TBN, and though I don't care about extending life of oil (I'm in the "change on regular basis" camp), I always get that test done just for my own curiosity. I've been using Amsoil, but there was a mixup last time and I ended up with Delo in the car. I get these done on the tranny oil every 20-25k miles, too. Another benefit, look at it as one additional form of verification how I treat the car in the event I wish to sell
Jano
PS: comments about wear are due to the high level of lead from the PO at the first change I did after buying the car.
Terry, if you are interested in how long you can run oil in the car, give one of the oil analysis dudes a try if you haven't done so already - they tend to run $20-40, depending on what tests you do. I use blackstone, costs $33 with the TBN, and though I don't care about extending life of oil (I'm in the "change on regular basis" camp), I always get that test done just for my own curiosity. I've been using Amsoil, but there was a mixup last time and I ended up with Delo in the car. I get these done on the tranny oil every 20-25k miles, too. Another benefit, look at it as one additional form of verification how I treat the car in the event I wish to sell
Jano
PS: comments about wear are due to the high level of lead from the PO at the first change I did after buying the car.