OWNER PedigreePartners

[PedigreePartners]

Hey all. I recently bought a 1992 500E from forum member zooklm. The car arrived a few weeks ago. Plans are a basic mechanical restore along with respraying the front valence and trunk lid. Otherwise, it will remain a usable car suited for Cars & Coffee runs in nearby Annapolis.

First thoughts:

-Cosmetically better than expected. Interior is much better than expected.
-Shifter bushings are GONE. Need to do ASAP
-Occasional surging idle. Vacuum leak somewhere.
-Tires shot. Will be sourcing a set of EVOs and tires pretty soon.
-No history of cooling system work so will proactively replace WP and tstat.
-Respray valence and trunk lid
-Reverse is iffy. Hoping its a condition of bushing being shot. But we'll see.

It joins a '01 Z3 M Coupe, '90 911 Carrera 4, '87 325is, '02 E55, '02 G500, and an '86 190E 2.3-16. And a random '89 Isuzu Trooper I love dearly.

 

[gsxr]

Looks great!

The M119 water pumps are not something you need to replace proactively. These can last the life of the engine. If it isn't leaking or noisy, I'd leave it alone. However, a new OE/OEM thermostat and 90° rubber hose (OE/Genuine) is a good idea. Search the forum, your car will use the 116- thermostat, not the 119- prefix.

Shifter bushings only affect the gearshift lever feel. Once reverse is selected, if there's a long delay before reverse engages (more than 2-3 seconds)... it needs reverse clutches. At that point it depends if you want to attempt DIY or just get a rebuilt box from Sun Valley. This assumes the ATF level is correct.

Welcome to the forum!

 

[PedigreePartners]

Looks great!

The M119 water pumps are not something you need to replace proactively. These can last the life of the engine. If it isn't leaking or noisy, I'd leave it alone. However, a new OE/OEM thermostat and 90° rubber hose (OE/Genuine) is a good idea. Search the forum, your car will use the 116- thermostat, not the 119- prefix.

Shifter bushings only affect the gearshift lever feel. Once reverse is selected, if there's a long delay before reverse engages (more than 2-3 seconds)... it needs reverse clutches. At that point it depends if you want to attempt DIY or just get a rebuilt box from Sun Valley. This assumes the ATF level is correct.

Welcome to the forum!

Here's my rational on bushings. It takes a few attempts for the selector to even find the gear cog. It always does but it oftentimes slides into the chosen gear on the console and you have to nudge it back and forth before it finds it (i.e., you choose drive and it still thinks it's in neutral). My hope is once the bushings firm up the actual transition between gears, we see a more responsive gearbox when it comes to physically selecting a gear.

I do have Sun Valley bookmarked, however, as it may be a decision I'll need to address at some point anyway simply due to mileage. It goes down the road quite happily once we're warmed up.

Good to know about the water pump. I'll leave that for another day.

 

[gsxr]

Definitely replace the shifter bushings first. Cheap and relatively easy, if you have the special pliers to install them. Full writeup here:

HOW-TO: Replacing 722.3 Shift Linkage Bushings | "HOW-TO" Tutorial Articles

NOTE: I did a much less complete HOW-TO on this topic several years ago, which you also may find of interest. That HOW-TO is here. Moderator update: Post #1 covers replacing the REAR bushing. Post #7 covers replacing the FRONT bushing. Make sure to read the tip in post #12 also. Today...

www.500eboard.co

 

[PedigreePartners]

Cheap and relatively easy are my middle names!

Also, I found a salvage yard in GA that had the remains of a parts car today. Bought the one SLS shock and one Euro headlight they had sitting on the shelf. Fairly cheap and I'm sure some day useful. This car is gone, FYI, and most of the parts were sent out to someone on a pallet years ago, but they have some bits left. European Automotive Group - Moultrie, GA

 

[PedigreePartners]

From the same parts car, I snagged a fuel sender for $75. The headlight turned out to not be a Bosch unit - Taiwan junk - so sent that back. Also got the E55 cleaned up in the weather break we had recently but more snow on the way.

 

[gsxr]

Score! The yellow-top sending unit is NLA and stupid rare.

Was the 90L gas tank still available? That's another unicorn item...

 

[gerryvz]

Can we get the VIN of that wrecked car, for the database? We have been tracking wrecked/decommissioned cars for well over 20 years now.

Thanks.

 

[PedigreePartners]

Can we get the VIN of that wrecked car, for the database? We have been tracking wrecked/decommissioned cars for well over 20 years now.

Thanks.

WDBEA36E3NB619208

Score! The yellow-top sending unit is NLA and stupid rare.

Was the 90L gas tank still available? That's another unicorn item...

No such luck. The car itself was scrapped a few years back and like most salvage yards, the tank went with it. These guys were far better than most at salvaging usable parts, but the gas tank wouldn't have registered....

Ironically, when I rescued my Cosworth out of a Pennsylvania salvage yard (story for another time), it, too, has the larger tank and was long gone. I did manage to find a NOS one held by a buddy I hadn't spoken to in 10+ years! Miracles do happen.

 

[gerryvz]

No previous record of this car in my private database. It is a fairly early 1992 US model.

Thanks for providing VIN.

 

[PedigreePartners]

No previous record of this car in my private database. It is a fairly early 1992 US model.

Thanks for providing VIN.

You got it! Thanks for keeping track of them.

So, short list of a long list looks like the following:

- Transmission mount, both guibos, and shift bushings all need replacement
- Fiber heat insulation is rubbing on the driveshaft and needs to be trimmed
- Steering linkage / ball joints need replacement
- Tires, in addition to being bad, are also mismatched and wider at the front

The good news is, all of these items are pretty straight forward and cut to the heart of what is, to date, the most negative aspects of the car (steering and transmission feel).

I also figured out after the car arrived that my headlights were, indeed, standard W124 assemblies. I located a set of supposedly NOS US lights in France, which I preferred over the Euros. 1.) I like headlight wipers, and 2. unlike my Cosworth, which had absolutely awful US-spec lights, I find the 500E assemblies pretty attractive. I also secured a set of NOS Euro amber Hella turn signal assemblies.

More to come!

 

[Jlaa]

You got it! Thanks for keeping track of them.

So, short list of a long list looks like the following:

- Transmission mount, both guibos, and shift bushings all need replacement
- Fiber heat insulation is rubbing on the driveshaft and needs to be trimmed
- Steering linkage / ball joints need replacement
- Tires, in addition to being bad, are also mismatched and wider at the front

The good news is, all of these items are pretty straight forward and cut to the heart of what is, to date, the most negative aspects of the car (steering and transmission feel).

I also figured out after the car arrived that my headlights were, indeed, standard W124 assemblies. I located a set of supposedly NOS US lights in France, which I preferred over the Euros. 1.) I like headlight wipers, and 2. unlike my Cosworth, which had absolutely awful US-spec lights, I find the 500E assemblies pretty attractive. I also secured a set of NOS Euro amber Hella turn signal assemblies.

More to come!

Good luck! From memory -

• Transmission mount is NLA - let us know what you come up with
• Guibos - Dorman was reboxing the SGF GAD138 guibos for a while for very cheap - and Amazon sold them! Search the board.
• Fiber heat insulation - I believe also NLA but vaguely remember @mrindiafromuk and / or @gerryvz made a template? Maybe I remember incorrectly
• Steering Linkage / Balljoints - steering damper and center section still available. Balljoints, if you have the later E500E and not an early one, they are integral with the front control arm and OE arms are unfortunately NLA. Aftermarket --- search the board. If you have one that an early model then the balljoints are separate and still available.

 

[gerryvz]

The transmission insulation blanket has been NLA for some years. I was able to score a NOS piece from a forum member, some years ago.

From this NOS piece, I created a pattern for it a couple of years ago, out of newspaper, which I supplied to a forum member which he I believe had a unit made from. If you need the template, if you want to make your own, please reach out to @mrindiafromuk.

Or, if you want the NOS piece, I am happy to let it go (as with all NLA E500E parts in my basement), for USD $5,000, plus MD & AACo sales tax.

 

[gsxr]

1992 with stock brakes will have early LCA. Install OE/Genuine ball joints.

If the Dorman reboxed flex discs are not SGF, try Febi, those were still SGF last I checked. You may want to re-use the original OE bolts, not the cheap hardware included in the Febi kit. The Dorman reboxed disc comes without hardware and will need the old hardware. New bolts+nuts are insanely expensive from MB ($35 MSRP x qty 8, ~$280 list, ~$200 discount just for new OE hardware - nope.) For reference, new OE/Genuine flex disc kits are ~$220 discount and the kit includes hardware ($440 for both).

Steering linkage - OE only for everything. Aftermarket Lemforder center link is from Türkiye now. Use the right-side 500E tie rod assembly (129-330-03-03) on both left+right sides now. Search the forum for details. The original 036 left tie rod assemblies are NLA. The left+right can be interchanged.

 

[PedigreePartners]

Thanks for all the advice. Bummer about the trans mount....I was hoping for an easy answer there. I reached out to Sun Valley to see if they still reburb them.

However, everything I own tends to have a limited supply of OEM parts available at any given time, and somehow, we always pull through.

The Cosworth is still at the shop in Rhode Island where I left it close to two years ago....chasing CIS-E issues. And I found out that the body shop I've used to completely restore the cosmetics, fix all the rust, respray it, etc. tossed out the (admittedly damaged) front air dam and side skirts after I relocated from RI to MD....can't even tell you how gutted I was to learn that.

My 964 has actually been fairly easy to live with, but of course, I had to source a hardtop from France which represents a whole 'nother can of worms that will inevitably make a car that has had no real issues suddenly develop a new list of random concerns, fiddly hardware, N/V/H issues. But it will look so much cooler!

And my '01 Z3 M Coupe, which is one of my favorites, increasingly sees parts supply dry up and ridiculous price increases ensue...par for the course.

 

[dreaming.haze]

Pretty sure @jhodg5ck has a transmission mount solution he's been working on. Might be worth a ping to see if he has an example for sale/use.

 

[PedigreePartners]

Pretty sure @jhodg5ck has a transmission mount solution he's been working on. Might be worth a ping to see if he has an example for sale/use.

Thank you - I sent him a note. Sun Valley directed me here: Spare parts for Mercedes-Benz classic cars

 

[gerryvz]

There’s one a couple or three miles down the road from you …


Not optimal, but ....

Rear Engine Transmission Gearbox Mount 90-96 For Mercedes Benz 300 400 500 600 E420 S500 SL600 1402400818 1402400918 1402400318 - AliExpress 34

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

www.aliexpress.com

Transmission Mount For 1992-1995 Mercedes-Benz Vehicles FEBI | eBay

FEBI PARTS. TRANSMISSION MOUNT FOR. I WILL DOUBLE CHECK FOR THE CORRECT PARTS FOR YOUR VEHICLE !

www.ebay.com

 

[gsxr]

There’s one a couple or three miles down the road from you …

Yes, but €5k will buy a lot of aftermarket mounts.

+1 on checking with Jono, I do recall he had fabricated an aftermarket solution...

 

[gerryvz]

Yes, but €5k will buy a lot of aftermarket mounts.

Indeed. Like I said, all this stuff will be gold when I kick the bucket, for the charities who inherit my estate !!

 

[gerryvz]

Thank you - I sent him a note. Sun Valley directed me here: Spare parts for Mercedes-Benz classic cars

I'm not sure that Niemöller handles parts for young-timers like the W124. Definitely worth checking with them, but back when I used to visit and patronize them in Germany, they stopped at the 123 and 126...just short of the 124. I used them for W109 and W116 stuff, which was well within their purview.

I would also check with Kurth Classics in Germany, as they are a 124 repro parts specialist.

Kurth Classics Autoparts

hier findet Ihr Mercedes Ersatzteile in Original oder verbesserter Qualität

kurth-classics-autoparts.de

 

[PedigreePartners]

There’s one a couple or three miles down the road from you …


Not optimal, but ....

Rear Engine Transmission Gearbox Mount 90-96 For Mercedes Benz 300 400 500 600 E420 S500 SL600 1402400818 1402400918 1402400318 - AliExpress 34

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

www.aliexpress.com

Transmission Mount For 1992-1995 Mercedes-Benz Vehicles FEBI | eBay

FEBI PARTS. TRANSMISSION MOUNT FOR. I WILL DOUBLE CHECK FOR THE CORRECT PARTS FOR YOUR VEHICLE !

www.ebay.com

If I weren't chasing a rusty old 911 that's been sitting in the woods for 25 years, maybe I could justify the investment. I think I'll just plan to replace the mount with more aftermarket junk every 3 years.

I think my trusty E30 has seen *maybe* 100 miles in the past 5 years? Given my current travel range of, oh, 8 miles a week, I'm guessing the 500E mount won't blow up any time soon.



I know, I know...not OEM....

 

[gerryvz]

Fortunately, changing the transmission mount is not a huge deal on the E500E.....unlike the motor mounts. Which is another sad tale of the OEM Boge "BBB" liquid-filled engine mounts disappearing off of the aftermarket some years back....

 

[gsxr]

Which is another sad tale of the OEM Boge "BBB" liquid-filled engine mounts disappearing off of the aftermarket some years back....

Thankfully, the OE/Genuine engine mounts are still available. Just not as cheap as the aftermarket reboxed OEM mounts.

 

[TerryA]

Kurth Classics shows a motor mount for M119 engine for $82.00 under “New Parts”
but I didn’t see a trans mount.

 

[PedigreePartners]

NOS headlights arrived. Very happy. They are beautiful and will look great paired with the deep amber indicators.



Also arrived: another package from Europe, this one with a set of OEM Oris roof W124 roof bars (somewhat hard to find) and a set of W463 Oris roof bars (absolutely rocking-horse-crap rare). Hardly anyone in the states knew you could get factory cross bars for the older design G-Wagens so not many sets were sold. I fortunately made friends with a MK2 VW guy in Europe who sends crates of Euro bumpers home for people looking to update their MK2 GTIs and Jettas, and he's been scouring the local classifieds for these bits.



Finally, in other vehicle news, my 1991 BMW K1 will leave the shop of a friend in Rhode Island who volunteered to restore it; sadly, very little has happened, so it's being moved from RI to PA to be refreshed by the guy I should have sent it to in the first place.

 

[doolar]

I use the Oris roof bars quite often! They’re really well made, and rated for 100 kilos which is rare for bars not fitted to rails.

 

[PedigreePartners]

I use the Oris roof bars quite often! They’re really well made, and rated for 100 kilos which is rare for bars not fitted to rails.

They are the best OEM bars, hands down. Perfect fitment and very little in the way of adjustments needed.

Stopped by the shop. Basically, what we're finding is this car is overall sound but there's lots of age-related items that need replacing.

Both driveshaft guibos are very well past done:




Control arm bushings and ball joints cooked:



Front brake rotors overdue for replacement:



There was evidence of a fuel leak inside the front wheel well from the charcoal canister that had gone unchecked:





And to think, we started with replacing the shifter bushings!

On a positive note, my hardtop for the 911 is painted and being installed this week:

 

[mrindiafromuk]

The transmission insulation blanket has been NLA for some years. I was able to score a NOS piece from a forum member, some years ago.

From this NOS piece, I created a pattern for it a couple of years ago, out of newspaper, which I supplied to a forum member which he I believe had a unit made from. If you need the template, if you want to make your own, please reach out to @mrindiafromuk.

Or, if you want the NOS piece, I am happy to let it go (as with all NLA E500E parts in my basement), for USD $5,000, plus MD & AACo sales tax.

Hi @gerryvz I am interested,

 

[PedigreePartners]

Welp - we're going to replace a transmission.

I knew when the car came off the truck, reverse was slow to engage. However, it likely fell into the category of "livable" for a while yet. Unfortunately, I tend to take my kids in the hobby vehicles for cars and coffee and other events, and I really didn't like leaving it to fate if/when reverse would stop working.

The rest of the car is solid and we haven't discovered too many surprises, so it seems like we should just spend the money now and be done with it. With 180K+ on the clock, it has lived a useful life, and the replacement gearbox will certainly add value.

 

[PedigreePartners]

No real updates; awaiting its turn to have the transmission replaced. Replacement trans is unboxed and waiting. Also had some OEM wheels powdercoated. Not thrilled with the quality of the work but they are temporary wheels.

 

[maw1124]

I tend to take my kids in the hobby vehicles for cars and coffee and other events, and I really didn't like leaving it to fate if/when reverse would stop working... With [30 yrs+] on the clock, it has lived a useful life, and the replacement [parts] will certainly add value.

This logic has had me "spend the money now and be done with it" for most of the time I've owned this car.

"Well if it were MY car..." and "well since you insist in carting your family all around the country in the darned thing" were some of the most persuasive logic I ever heard from my mechanic (now friend) who had cared for this car since '95 or so.

So I say keep with it. On this car it's actually money well spent.

And plus eleventy billion on the US Spec headlights.



Cheers,

maw

 

[PedigreePartners]

This logic has had me "spend the money now and be done with it" for most of the time I've owned this car.

"Well if it were MY car..." and "well since you insist in carting your family all around the country in the darned thing" were some of the most persuasive logic I ever heard from my mechanic (now friend) who had cared for this car since '95 or so.

So I say keep with it. On this car it's actually money well spent.

And plus eleventy billion on the US Spec headlights.



Cheers,

maw

Totally. If nothing else, the fact that kids are in the car leads to a lot of work getting done now rather than waiting for a "better time" (which ironically, never comes.)

 

[PedigreePartners]

Old transmission is out.

 

[PedigreePartners]

New transmission is in. Also installed the recommended H&R spacers and the powdercoated OEM wheels with new tires. Going to drop off the correct headlights this week with the NOS Hella Euro amber turn signals.

The paint work on the front valence is driving me bananas but it's going to be a little bit before I can get into a body shop's rotation.

 

[PedigreePartners]

Ugly 300E headlights out, OEM NOS 500E headlights in!