"What's this called" (ball joint?)

[bgalakazam]

Sorry if it's the wrong section. We were changing the brake pads and found this on the front left side. It may be a culprit in my steering not being straight (while driving and having brakes pressed). Alignment was done last August with new tires, but if the thing was broken back then it would have helped a bit.

What is this called in English and do you have any part numbers for it? I assume an alignment will have to be done after a change. In this case, I should change the other side as well?

 

[gerryvz]

That's the ball joint on one of the tie rod ends, part of the steering system.

When the boot is ripped like that, it's only a matter of time until the joint fails. Luckily tie rods aren't that expensive for the the 500E/E500 (and it makes sense to replace BOTH of them, as well as the drag link and steering shock at the same time). The drag link connects the two tie rods. However, after replacement, the car will need to be aligned. Have a dealer do the alignment.

You can get quality aftermarket tie rods from Lemforder, via AutohausAZ.com. They are selling the left hand unit for $88, and the right hand tie rod for $59. AHAZ also sells the Boge steering shock for $25. I would go with the factory drag link.

Cheers,
Gerry

 

[Jim]

When I put my car through the MoT test it failed on torn rubber gaiters. I knew they were gone and just forgot before the test. The ball joints were still servicable.

I went to the dealer and we were not able to get the appropriate part number to allow replacement of the ball joint as a whole. The parts man ended up offering me all three links (left, centre and right) plus all the associated joints which was expensive. Of course MB do not make a replacement gaiter.

I went to Whoopee Motor Factors and after one false identification I was able to buy a pair of replacement rubber gaiters and the tiny zip ties to hold them in place.

The left hand ball joint taper came loose nice and easy. The right hand one needed more force and some heat to free the taper off. Eventually after a little time under pressure following the application of heat and the occasional "tap" with a hammer...BANG...off it comes. From there on the job was easy.

I was careful not to adjust the length of the left and right tie rods so the tapers went back exactly where they came from, so no alignment check was required.

I took the car back and collected my MOT certificate.

 

[jhodg5ck]

worn out...

I would change the idler arm bushing kit while you are at it. It Can be done w/o removing the exhaust down pipe FWIW, just need to raise the engine up some.

Jono

 

[gsxr]

If the joint is tight and clean, and you are CERTAIN that no water or dirt has entered via the cracked boot, you can replace the boot. MB no longer sells the replacement tie rod end boots, which is ridiculous, IMO (you can still get replacement ball joint boots, btw).

If you decide to replace, then replace ALL the steering links at the same time: left+right tie rod assemblies, and drag link. Then you need a 4-wheel alignment, preferably at the dealer. The steering shock is optional as it can be replaced later without requiring an alignment. If it takes major effort to push the steering shock in+out, it's ok. If it moves with light to moderate pressure, or if it's leaking, replace it. There is often a date code printed on the replacement shocks so if that is visible, you can tell how old it is.

 

[Roma_500E]

worn out...

I would change the idler arm bushing kit while you are at it. It Can be done w/o removing the exhaust down pipe FWIW, just need to raise the engine up some.

Jono

Yup , that is what I did too on my car , actually we just loose exhaust little bit and took those heat shields out, and those idler bushings came out. $140+ for OEM .

 

[samiam44]

Yes, Only need to take the heatsheilds off the idler arm ...

"I would change the idler arm bushing kit while you are at it. It Can be done w/o removing the exhaust down pipe FWIW, just need to raise the engine up some."

I don't raise the engine- just tap the upper bushing upward w/bolt in place. Replace the same way.. I use a big pliers to seat the upper bushing, then do the lower. 3X so far.. only aftermarket bushings are Uro which I would avoid.

I think Lemforder also makes the centerlink. Easy- I've got a stahwillie tapered joint popper which works great- I don't use a pickle fork.

Please drive the car fwd and backward in the drive way and then measure with a tape measure the front and back edge at the same height. You can set the Toe pretty darn close- Takes a few tries. You want to rough it in close to zero difference or slightly toe in(1/8 inch). Then when it comes back from alignment in the green- you can tell them you did it with a tape measure=0)

Michael

 

[jhodg5ck]

Sitting on the lift it's real easy to put the screw jack under and make yourself a bit of room. Some of those upper bushings do Not want to come out readily. You need to get @ them from inside :-/

jono

 

[gerryvz]

My E500 idler arm bushing required raising the engine to remove the bolt to make room. I didn't want to hassle with the downpipe .... space was just too tight.

I automatically assume the joint is bad if there is a ripped boot, and replace the part/joint (if applicable). You may be able to get some additional time out of it, but anytime you have an open boot, dirt/moister can/will get in and hasten its demise.

My proactive philosophy is to replace outright rather than prolong & limp along, but I understand that not all folks subscribe to my maintenance philosophy...

 

[bgalakazam]

Thanks for the info. Added to next maintenance:
Left Tie Rod Assembly
Right Tie Rod Assembly
Drag Link
Alignment

 

[szvook]

I would have the idler arm bushing checked as well, just in case.

 

[jhodg5ck]

Indeed...And if you are doing all that to Not freshen the idler wouldn't be prudent IMHO...;-)

 

[bgalakazam]

I found the part number for this 129-460-00-19 but I am unsure of the location. I'll do some more searching as I am not doing this overnight, but any help will be great . It's worth noting that I only have the stock jack/lift available.

 

[gerryvz]

You can replace the tie rods and drag link (and idler arm bushings) with the front end of your car up on jack stands ... and if you do the idler arm bushings, your jack can be used to raise the engine with a large block of wood under the oilpan to distribute the force.

It's exactly what I did in my own garage back in early May. Not a horribly difficult job. Just get that four-wheel alignment ASAP after finishing the job.

 

[samiam44]

Impact is good for removing the 24 mm nut.

Leave the bolt in the upper bushing, when it is loose angle will change and bolt comes right out. Big pliers, long punch is all that is needed. Socket ,torque wrench, and wrench for install.

I use my 24 mm 944 tb wrench.

 

[Roma_500E]

Thanks for the info. Added to next maintenance:
Left Tie Rod Assembly
Right Tie Rod Assembly
Drag Link
Alignment

Initially I was thinking to replace my tie rods ONLY , cuz both boots were cracked. Then I decided to replace both ball joints cuz it was time to do so. After we lifted a car we figured out that idler arm bushing is worn out and it was loose. I also noticed my control arm bushings look old .... In a result I ended up replacing all links, rubber bushings and mounts in a front end. Honestly that is a HUGE difference before and after so I will recommend to do it all at once.

I will also recommend to go with all OEM parts , cuz when I was searching for parts I saw some URO crap and othe unknown brands. So genuine parts will be the best option there.

 

[bgalakazam]

Sorry for the stupid question, but if I replace the tie rods, do I need to buy a separate boot? Is there a part number for this boot? thx

 

[gerryvz]

No, the boots and BJs come installed on the ends of the tie rods.

 

[bgalakazam]

One more questions, for the idler arm bushing, do I need 1 bushing or the kit? I still am not sure what/where this part(s) is. From the images I saw there are multiple ones. Can you tell me if I need the kit or just 1? Part number? I want to order the stuff together. Also, looks like only Karlyn is available for the center link and it's listed as not recommended brand. I'll probably have to go with MB part. Scratch that, there are some Lemfoerder on feebay.

 

[Roma_500E]

One more questions, for the idler arm bushing, do I need 1 bushing or the kit? I still am not sure what/where this part(s) is. From the images I saw there are multiple ones. Can you tell me if I need the kit or just 1? Part number? I want to order the stuff together. Also, looks like only Karlyn is available for the center link and it's listed as not recommended brand. I'll probably have to go with MB part. Scratch that, there are some Lemfoerder on feebay.

Kit , simple though expensive part , basically two rubber bushings washer bolt and nut fot appx. $150 for OE part

 

[gsxr]

The idler arm bushing kit is specific to the V8 models (129-460-00-19) and your only option is OE/dealer. There is no aftermarket Lemforder idler arm kit available, only Uro or Hamburg, both of which are garbage. $117 from parts.com:

http://www.parts.com/parts/index.cf...hText=1294600019&action=oePartSearch&siteid=2

You may need to raise the engine to get the top bushing out. I've never done this job with the engine still in the car so I can't provide any tips/tricks.

 

[samiam44]

Karlye center link you won't know what it is till received. Lemforder or dealer.

You can buy the other and possibly return if it is not lemforder.

 

[bgalakazam]

I got it from the dealer today with Mercedes club parts discount for less than parts.com. I also got the center link from there as I didn't want to get feebay. Lemfoerdor for left and right tie rods from autohouseaz. I'll update when I start with the replacement.

 

[gerryvz]

I happen to have a factory idler arm bushing kit sitting on my shop workbench, and I was getting ready to enter it into my MB parts inventory.

Here are a few photos of the kit, as received from MBUSA.

Cheers,
Gerry

 

[mwaldron]

Gurus,

Is there a specific reason why the norm is to replace the whole tie rod assemblies, as opposed to just replacing the tie rod ends on both sides?

Mark

 

[Glen]

Because there isn't any cost savings.

 

[mwaldron]

Thanks Glen,

Mark

 

[gerryvz]

Gurus,

Is there a specific reason why the norm is to replace the whole tie rod assemblies, as opposed to just replacing the tie rod ends on both sides?

Mark

For me, it's because the factory bits aren't all that expensive to just buy new.

Drag link: (Lemforder, from AHAZ) -- $86.40

Left tie rod: (MB OE, from parts.com) -- $80.40

Right tie rod: (MB OE, from parts.com) -- $78.00

Steering shock: (Boge, from AHAZ) -- $26.52 if needed

 

[gsxr]

Because there isn't any cost savings.

Correct. Plus, it's nice to get a new adjusting sleeve for the same price. And, you usually want to replace both tie rod assemblies & drag link all at the same time. If they are the same age, and one is failing, the others are not far behind. With dealer alignments typically costing $125-$175, it makes more sense to replace everything at the same time and get ONE alignment.

Plus, it's cheaper than replacing tires, worn steering joints will accelerate front tire wear...

 

[bgalakazam]

You can replace the tie rods and drag link (and idler arm bushings) with the front end of your car up on jack stands ... and if you do the idler arm bushings, your jack can be used to raise the engine with a large block of wood under the oilpan to distribute the force.

It's exactly what I did in my own garage back in early May. Not a horribly difficult job. Just get that four-wheel alignment ASAP after finishing the job.

The indie is asking for 3hr labour for this and with the tie rods I'm getting into the $500s. I looked today under the car and there is really not enough space. I will try to make the change myself. Somebody on Benzworld I think suggested this:

This is a super easy job, the hardest part is getting the car up on jack stands.I searched the forums and was concerned about the exhaust being in the way of removing the bolt so put off the job longer than I needed to.


There was a lot of talk on the forums of cutting the head of the bolt off and installing the new bolt head down/nut up, but I don't like the idea of having the bolt threads in contact with the idler arm itself. Look at the bolt and you'll see that the threaded area is the narrowest part of the bolt, and installing the bolt the way the factory intended, is not hard at all. I used the Febe bushing kit.


Remove heat shield.....1x10mm nut and 1x10mm bolt


Remove the 24mm nut, washer and lower bushing


Push the bolt upwards until it just touches the exhaust so there is room to push out the bushing.


Now, push/drive the upper bushing out of the frame mounting, once the upper bushing is free of the frame, there is room to rotate the arm assembly forward to remove the bolt.


Install kit in reverse of removal.....super easy!


Bolt and nut are 24mm


Torque nut to 100NM or 74ft.lbs


I hope this helps others who have been putting this job off.

If this doesn't work, can you tell me what needs to be done before raising the engine? I assume there are some bolts that have to be loosened or removed prior. Also, there is a crane type of lift at Harbor for ~$120, will that be easier to use from the top hook? In either case, what are the pre steps to be taken before trying to lift the engine from either top or bottom?

 

[bgalakazam]

I'm going to attemp the changes this weekend and see where I get. The South Charlotte dealer quoted me $179 + tax for wheel allignement so I may have to scrape the stealership allignment. I do have $125 credit from a Columbia, SC dealer, but that's 80miles away on the interstate and I don't want to drive it unalligned. I also despise PEPBOYS for bad experience on 2 cars with tyres and allignment so I am SOL.

Another change I will be making is resealing the P/S steering box (also the top reservoir and camshafts, but that's not under the car). Said stealership wants $99 for 1hr diagnostics and if there is a problem with the pitman arm allignment, that $99 goes toward the labour for the repair.

Stealerships gonna stealership...

 

[gerryvz]

That's about what the MB dealer in North Houston wants for a four-wheel alignment. Honestly though, it's the only way to go. I do not trust "aftermarket" places as most of them don't know how to properly set things up and don't have the correct rack to do it. I think you're fine to drive the 80 miles with it unaligned, but I'd suggest just bending over and doing it at your local. You're going to spend almost the difference in just gas.

 

[jhodg5ck]

Find out who the local race shops are using/who has been in business for the Longest. If you can find a guy who has been aligning cars for the last15+ years you'll be good. The dealers here put NOOB's who only understand "in the green" which isn't Really right.
You want someone who has time/knowledge and experience when it comes to setting up cars. The 500E especially.

Make some calls...Or, read up on how you can @ least set toe-in w/ some pieces of wood/string. That will @ least make the car driveable for some distance.

Jono

 

[Ron500E]

If the joint is tight and clean, and you are CERTAIN that no water or dirt has entered via the cracked boot, you can replace the boot. MB no longer sells the replacement tie rod end boots, which is ridiculous, IMO (you can still get replacement ball joint boots, btw).

Lower Ball Joint Seal 201 330 0085 - $7.32 from parts.com
This might fit.

Ron

 

[samiam44]

"Sitting on the lift it's real easy to put the screw jack under and make yourself a bit of room. Some of those upper bushings do Not want to come out readily. You need to get @ them from inside :-/"

Agreed Jono.. My car with headers I did it that way. Infact, I did all the steering, brake fluid flush, and a few other odd balls at the tech session on a lift. ~3 hrs for everything with donut breaks.

Could have been quicker- irritatingly, they gave me a lift without a working shop light, so 2 techs held lights and chatted. Think they just wanted checkout the old MB with headers and fancy wheels on it...
Shop Forman was NOT a nice person. Think he didn't like seeing me tackle a real project of size... I guess I was suppose to do an oil change and beg to have them do my all my work.

Michael

 

[bgalakazam]

Well I'll see how it is after the change, maybe I'll drive to Columbia, I'll do some other activities there as well besides the allignment (campus tour for fall, museum, etc).

If I knew about the boot earlier I would have gotten it. But I have the 2 rods, center link and idler arm bushing kit so at this point is change them all. The shock will be a later paycheck. I really hope I can get the bolt out with the wiggle process described in post #30. If not, what do I need to unbolt to lift the engine from below with a jack and a wood board at the oil pan? I assume I can't just do it right off without unmounting/unscrewing something?

 

[samiam44]

There are 2 lower bolts holding the motor mount to the subframe. They are access cutouts and I think 13 or 14mm hex bolts from memory.. Be a little careful not to loose your bolts or socket in the subframe.

No need to do anything else. It allows the engine to rotate a bit. But if you read my 1st posting, I tell you how to do it without messin with the mount. Just tap the upper bushing loose with the bolt in it. That allows more angle and the whole thing will come right out. The reverse the process- install bolt and upper bushing at the same time.

Michael