Engine oil recommendations

[superstar]

If the pressure is just above zero at hot idle, that isn't good. It may just be a faulty sender, click here for details. I'd try replacing the sender first. And at the next oil change, do not use oil that is 0W-xx. Yes, you should use fully synthetic, and at least a 10W-40 viscosity, if not higher. The 1994 service products brochure (attached) did show 10W-60 as acceptable in warm climates.

I have replaced the sender unite for 93 JDM 500E, and it is still pointing slightly above the zero, and that when idle hot using 0W-40 fully synthetic, However, the other 1994 E500 i own (Euro imported) the minimum i saw in the same conditions was( 0.9 -1.00).
I will change the oil viscosity, in the next oil change to fully synthetic 10W-60. Or maybe change it to mineral 20W-50 and see if they make any differences.

 

[superstar]

Outside temp was 29C

 

[gerryvz]

I see this pressure in hot weather on my car as well, using Mobil 1 5W-40 oil, particularly in 85-90F+ outside temperatures.

I don't consider this an anomaly or bad thing.

In the same weather, my 560SEC is ~1 bar with 20W-50 Brad Penn semi-synthetic oil.

Cheers,
Gerry

 

[gsxr]

Wait a sec. You have custom gauge faces which means the needles have been removed and re-installed. It's very possible that the needle was not put back in the correct position and the gauge may not be reading accurately. Only way to know for sure is to bench test the gauge with fixed resistors and see if it reads properly or not. I was assuming your gauge was stock.

If the gauge is accurate, I agree with Gerry, pressure above 0.5 bar at hot idle is not necessarily a problem, although I'd rather see that with the coolant at 110C, not 85C.

 

[szvook]

I have yet to see 0.5 pressure bar in the past with Mobile 1, or now with Motul. When I was using Mobile 1 0W-40, on a hot day above 90F I would see 1.0 bar, but no less. Now with Motul 5W-40 300V Power, my lowest pressure on a hot day is prolly 1.15.

 

[superstar]

This is during the day time using 10W40 on my 94 E500

 

[gsxr]

This is during the day time using 10W40 on my 94 E500

Those numbers (1.0 bar, ±0.2) look perfectly normal for idling in 34°C (93°F) ambient temps. Your engine runs nice & cool, btw!

 

[superstar]

Wait a sec. You have custom gauge faces which means the needles have been removed and re-installed. It's very possible that the needle was not put back in the correct position and the gauge may not be reading accurately. Only way to know for sure is to bench test the gauge with fixed resistors and see if it reads properly or not. I was assuming your gauge was stock.

If the gauge is accurate, I agree with Gerry, pressure above 0.5 bar at hot idle is not necessarily a problem, although I'd rather see that with the coolant at 110C, not 85C.

The gauge is accurate. There is no way the oil pressure needle could have been re-installed in a wrong way. There is a stop needle which is below the zero which prevents the needle to ravel below that, which is also calibrated, not to go more than 3. Once you remove the needle there is no way to install wrong. If it is installed wrong, it will never sit on the zero correctly and it will read more than 3 when start the car.

 

[gsxr]

If the needle is positioned too low, it can read slightly below 3 at max, and will read ~0.5 bar lower than actual throughout the rest of the range, while still resting on the bottom peg with the engine off. You can compare to other W124's with stock gauges and look closely at exactly where the needle is when indicating 3 bar (max reading).

 

[superstar]

Those numbers (1.0 bar, ±0.2) look perfectly normal for idling in 34°C (93°F) ambient temps. Your engine runs nice & cool, btw!

This car is euro specs and i am using 10W-40. The other one is JDM and i am using 0W-40 .

 

[superstar]

If the needle is positioned too low, it can read slightly below 3 at max, and will read ~0.5 bar lower than actual throughout the rest of the range, while still resting on the bottom peg with the engine off. You can compare to other W124's with stock gauges and look closely at exactly where the needle is when indicating 3 bar (max reading).

I will remove this cluster and put the other one . and see how it goes..

 

[500 DXB]

What brand is LQ 5w40? cheers

In our Hellish Summer (+55C) I used the following Oils on the 500E:

- Mobil1 0W40
- Mobil1 5W50
- Mobil1 15W50

Highest Oil Pressure in the Summer is with the 15W50 (During Idle), though all go to 3 on acceleration.
No oil consumption with All three.

Now using LQ 5W40 on the E550, doing well and cheaper than M1

 

[quicksilver500]

I have been using Rotella 5w40 T6 Full Synth after I stopped being able to find 15w50 mobil. Seems to be pretty good, I get ~ 0.5 bar in summer Ga heat which I don't worry about, I like the cold cranking and start up. They say its particularly good at high temps, its a gas/Diesel oil so it has good "waste" suspension and additives package. Also because its a CJ4+ rated oil it won't mess up your cats like a lot of synth oil. I don't know if anyone else has experience with this oil but on Bob's oil site it got some good conversation. Its easy to get and not too expensive.

-Mike

 

[gsxr]

Just FYI... the Rotella Syn is a Group III base stock. It is good stuff as long as you change it at normal intervals, i.e. same as dino oil (3-5kmi). However I wouldn't attempt extended drains (i.e, 5-10kmi) with any Group III oil... you'll generally find that consumption increases dramatically after approx 5k.

You may be able to find Mobil-1 15W-50 at Wal-Mart, however I believe Mobil-1 quietly switched to Group III base stocks about 4-5 years ago for all except their "Extended Performance" oils. It took me a while to figure that out. That's why I recently switched to Red Line...

 

[quicksilver500]

I never leave anything in the car for more than 5k with synth or 3k with dino. I don't think the group stock is that big a deal anymore the API ratings get more and more stringent and the manufacturing/refining keeps getting better and better. I have never added any oil to my M104 or M119 cars using M1 or Rotella, never burns more than 1/2 litre between changes.

If you look at the suspension criteria, anti-oxidation additive requirements, detergents etc for CJ4+ API criteria its pretty insane compared to even 10 years ago. Really it doesn't matter, you don't need to change the oil till you reach your suspension limit or you your additives are consumed, which you won't know unless you get the oil analyzed. You also want to use the proper weight for your climate and engine, to thin not enough protection at extreme temp, too thick no cold start protection. All oils have the same viscosity at normal op temp (+/- few percent).

BTOG showed T6 had ~1200ppm zddp additive which is as good as old 15w50 M1. Also, its a CJ4 oil which beats the hell out of the old SL rated oils. Also Comp Cams recommends Rotella single weight for cam breakin.

 

[gsxr]

The base stock is more of an issue with extended drains, and/or extreme severe service. Otherwise you are correct, for 3-5k intervals at normal service, it's not a big deal. I run extended drains on my daily drivers so this is of concern to me, and I do notice a definite difference between Group III and IV/V. Some of the newer oils also have a lower TBN (compared to previous iterations of the same oil with an older API rating) which again, is mostly of concern for extended drains / severe service...

 

[quicksilver500]

http://www.api.org/Certification-Pr...ublications/Engine-Oil-Guide-2010-120210.ashx

http://www.api.org/certification-pr...ublications/1509-16thAdd-10308forprint-2.ashx

Also depending on the Redline you run, T6 may have a higher TBN number (~10.5). It also has superior shear characteristics because it is meets the CJ4 engine requirements. New diesels (2007+) run ~ 15% hotter than old due to increases in backpressure because of after treatment. So the oils really take a beating, its nothing like a gas engine. T6 also is one of the few oils to have MB ratings. When I was looking it just had too many things going for it. I think T6 may have a better seal conditioner in it because I have less leaks than before as well

I would be curious to see what blackstone says about the TBN of my T6, I am at 4k on my 500E I have always wanted to send a sample to them just never did it. I know everyone has different oils they like, Jono is always trying to talk me into Brad Penn, others, AMSOIL, before that it was all 15w50 M1. My biggest concern is honestly temperature/viscocity response. It can get 100+ here ambient and in a 500E that is HOT, so I have to have an oil that is not going to break down with heat. Maybe any of these oils will provide that but I feel better using a co-rated diesel/gas oil.

 

[Christian_K]

Love Oil discussions...
ZDDP is obsolete according to certain German refineries i've spoken to. There are today far better Anti-Wear additives in Oils than ZDDP, also we do not drive engines which have iron rocker-arms or non-hardened camshafts.
The trend to reduce ZDDP Values in Oils and replace it with better High-Pressure and anti-wear additives is reasonable, because when they burn its bad for emissions, catalytic converters and it can damage soot particle filters.


.

 

[gerryvz]

ZDDP is certainly NOT obsolete for older engines with flat-tappet designs, up to and including the M116/M117 !!!

 

[Christian_K]

ZDDP is certainly NOT obsolete for older engines, up to and including the M116/M117 !!!

Really? Then please do elaborate why.

EDIT: Ok i read the attached document. I think this is different in germany vs. USA. We don't have such old muscle-cars and stuff here and 2 Oil-manufacturers/refineries i have questioned about the ZDDP level in their oils (whether they are above 1000-1200ppm or not) have both asked me why i worry about ZDDP values with my Engine-type and told me that ZDDP is basically considered as "obsolete" for modern cars post 1970-1980 in Germany, as other additives that reduce friction have come in to place.
However they didn't named me those "new" additives that do the same as ZDDP without its side-effects on catalytic converters and soot particle filters.

 

[mb280sel1985]

I would not use the M-1 15W-50 as it appears Mobil changed to a cheaper group III base stock (i.e., fake synthetic) a few years ago. It's probably ok if you change your oil every 3-5kmi, but it won't handle extended drains.

Does this go for the M-1 5W-50 Fully Synthetic Peak/Rally Formula as well?

 

[gsxr]

Does this go for the M-1 5W-50 Fully Synthetic Peak/Rally Formula as well?

I can't say for sure, as that oil is not sold in the USA. However if the Mobil marketing spin does not say anything about 15kmi drain intervals (like they say for the "Extended Performance" oils), my guess is that it could be a Group III base stock. You'd need to do some searching and see if anyone else has figured it out.

On my cars, I need to run a particular oil for 10kmi and see if the consumption increases exponentially after approx 5-6kmi... if so, it's Group III. Consumption remains linear with Group IV/V base stocks. If you change by 3-6kmi, you'd never notice either way.

 

[szvook]

Just changed my Motul oil after 6k miles and numerous 1/4 mile track events - the consumption looked to be nil (maybe a 1/2 millimeter bellow the dipstick's middle).

 

[mb280sel1985]

On my cars, I need to run a particular oil for 10kmi and see if the consumption increases exponentially after approx 5-6kmi... if so, it's Group III. Consumption remains linear with Group IV/V base stocks. If you change by 3-6kmi, you'd never notice either way.

I've been running M-1 5W-50 - old name was "Mobil1 5W-50 Rally Formula" - new name is "Mobil1 5W-50 Peak Life". At least they changed the label in North Europe. I also found it from the US Mobil1 site: http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENPVLMOMobil1_5W-50.aspx

I've always thought this oil was the absolute high end of synthetic oils, and I've been happy with the comfort that thought has given me. Even if it has been based on a lie

I've used it every 5K-6K miles (8K-10K KM) for the last 45.000 miles or so. I've used the Omega 907 engine flush once to see if the ticking would go away (probably oil tube problem). I've never had to top it off.

I checked the oil level yesterday. It was right there at the max mark - maybe 1-2 mm below. My last oil change was 5500 miles ago (9K KM). So I'm really surprised how little oil it consumes, if any.

 

[gsxr]

I've been running M-1 5W-50 - old name was "Mobil1 5W-50 Rally Formula" - new name is "Mobil1 5W-50 Peak Life". At least they changed the label in North Europe. I also found it from the US Mobil1 site: http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENPVLMOMobil1_5W-50.aspx

That appears to be a decent oil, it has high TBN and adequate phosphorus levels. But it's not an oil sold in the USA. Mobil-1 oils sold in USA are shown at this link.

I've always thought this oil was the absolute high end of synthetic oils, and I've been happy with the comfort that thought has given me. Even if it has been based on a lie

Well, they used to be, back in the 1980's and 1990's. Then in the early 2000s, things changed. It's just been the last few years that I've finally thrown in the towel on them. I stuck with M-1 as long as I did because they were so much cheaper than Red Line and Amsoil, but now that advantage is mostly gone, and the majority of their (USA) oils are now Group III, so I won't use them anymore.

I've used it every 5K-6K miles (8K-10K KM) for the last 45.000 miles or so. I've used the Omega 907 engine flush once to see if the ticking would go away (probably oil tube problem). I've never had to top it off.

Avoid using any engine flushes, ever, no matter what you read on the interwebs. If you change every 5-6kmi (8-10kkm), any quality oil of the correct viscosity should be ok.

I checked the oil level yesterday. It was right there at the max mark - maybe 1-2 mm below. My last oil change was 5500 miles ago (9K KM). So I'm really surprised how little oil it consumes, if any.

Remember that the ideal level is between MIN and MAX, not actually at the MAX mark. Note that the marks are not "Full" and "Add" like on some other cars. Read the factory TSB here.

 

[mb280sel1985]

I stuck with M-1 as long as I did because they were so much cheaper than Red Line and Amsoil

And I don't think I'd be able to get a hold of Red Line or Amsoil over here

Mobil1 is actually one of the more expensive oils we have here. It's a say that it's the best/most expensive one you can buy. Now oils are expensive one way or the other in this country, but normally a good quality synthetic oil goes for $125/gallon or you can have it by the liter for $35. Mobil1 typically runs for 20-30% more.

Here is link to the engine flush (Omega 907) I once put in there
http://www.magnagroup.com/products/omega/product_list/907/index.asp

Ever heard of it before anyone? Hope it didn't do evil to my engine!

 

[gsxr]

That's insane. We pay $6-$9 per quart of Mobil-1, while Amsoil and Red Line are $10-$12 per quart. That's pure larceny if you are paying triple that, or more! Yikes.

Engine flushes where you idle the motor for ~15 minutes basically consist of harsh solvents. There is risk of breaking rings or other bad things happening with this stuff in the crankcase. That kind of failure is rare, but not worth the risk on an otherwise good (and expensive!) engine. Those flushes are almost never, ever, ever needed. Since your engine has been running ok after the treatment, I wouldn't worry about it. Just don't use it again.

For massively abused engines with major sludge, Auto-RX is the correct product to use, and it takes thousands of miles, not minutes. Otherwise, long-term use of top-notch synthetics will do an excellent job of cleaning engine internals over say 10-20kmi (20-30kkm). I haven't yet found any magic product which will remove the brown varnish found inside some M119's, but the varnish doesn't hurt anything either.

 

[samiam44]

As Dave has mentioned in the past- the mobil-1 product in the USA is different than europe. So, this advice maybe irrelavant to you. Maybe a list member in your country can provide some input. Motul, Luk, etc are quite hard to find in the usa.

 

[Christian_K]

You can and even should use engine flushes if you or the previous owner overdone the oil-change interval by at least double, or if you would re-oil your engine from mineral-oil to synthetic oils for instance (unlikely these days, as basically everyone uses synthetic or semi-synthetic oils - even in close-minded germany).
This at least in Germany is a standard procedure in every single shop i know and the results are quite positive (first hand report of an E420 with a 30.000km overdue Oil-change available).
Even further, from two Toyota Dealers/Shops i know that they always do a Engine flush with "Eurosol Öl-System", on every single oil-change of their customers.

The M119s due to the way they are driven (in europe/germany at least - full throttle) are prone to Oil-buildup in the engine head and oil-pan area. Don't know what proper english word there is available for, but in germany we say "Das Öl verlackt", "The Oil transfoms into lacquer" ???
Anyway quite some M119 driving People in German Forums observed and reported often, that even with the stock 10.000km Oil-Change interval done, but with a mineral-crap 10W-40, the engine gets this "Oil-Lacquer" builtup quite fast in the head area, covering in later stage even the Head-Bolts and making them practically unaccessible.
Bernard showed once in the German Forums what happens if you overdo your oil-change big time on the M119 (IIRC it was overdone by at least 50.000km), The engine was so full with "Oil-Lacquer" that he couldn't even get the heads of the block anymore, as the Head-Bolts were covered in centimeter-thick "Oil-Lacquer".
I try to get the pictures and link them here
EDIT Pictures from Bernards W140 Forum:


So for a well maintained and clean-looking M119 i would NOT use an engine-flush. But if you are from Europe, fresh bought your M119 Benz and the Oil is looking already pretty dark even black, do a oil-change and use such a engine-flush.

 

[gsxr]

Sorry Christian, I don't care how many shops do it in Germany, it's NOT a good idea to dump strong solvents into the sump and let the engine idle. Shops push this crap on customers because it's pure profit. As I stated in my previous post, sludged engines should get an Auto-RX treatment, engines without sludge don't need any treatment. And if people would just use synthetics in the first place, we wouldn't have this problem.

 

[Christian_K]

Sorry Christian, I don't care how many shops do it in Germany, it's NOT a good idea to dump strong solvents into the sump and let the engine idle. Shops push this crap on customers because it's pure profit. As I stated in my previous post, sludged engines should get an Auto-RX treatment, engines without sludge don't need any treatment. And if people would just use synthetics in the first place, we wouldn't have this problem.

There are different of such products on the market. Liqui Moly and Eurosol ones here in Germany even have TüV approvals, there is no harm done when using them for 15-20 minutes according to the certificates/tests. Mostly they not only contain of solvents, but for the majority also of high-dosage "detergents", found in every modern formulated engine oil aswell.
On my Freinds Ex-E420 the Oil-change was 30.000km overdone as he bought it. It had similar residues (not that much, just slightly overall one mm thick) aka "Oil Lacquer" in his head like in the pictures i liked above from Bernards W140 Forums and they were almost completely removed with a single Eurosol Oil-Flush. We used TWO Oil-filters at that change and even had to clean the oil-filter housing then aftwards after removing the seconds clogged Oil-Filter. In his E420 engine this was really necessary, tell me what you want. You won't believe what came out of his oil-drain hole, this was everything but not an Oil anymore like you would imagine an oil to be.

If he would have done just a regular Oil-Change with Filter and Full-Synthetic Oil, this would have probably clogged him his Oil-Pump nozzle/sieve and Oil-Filter housing most likely, causing severe damage over time.As
As i've said, don't use it if your engine doesn't look "dirty" inside and has had regular oil-changes, but for a situation like described above on that E420, this was the only quick fix for those residues.

 

[gsxr]

I could care less if it's TüV approved or not. It's your engine, you can do whatever you want, but you'll never find me dumping that junk into my motors. Any flush that's "safe" is also not going to do much except lighten your wallet.


http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/flushservices.html

"After engine flushes, there's a pretty high incidence of some damage to the interior of the engine," Chris Martin of Honda tells NBC Los Angeles. That's why Honda issued a memo to mechanics advising them not to perform engine flushes. Other major car-makers, including Ford, General Motors, and Nissan have all issued similar advisories against the service. ​

http://www.redlineoil.com/techinfo_faq.aspx

Q: Should I flush my engine or driveline before using Red Line's synthetic lubricants?
A: A flush isn't necessary or advised.​

I'll never understand people's obsession with dumping snake oil into the crankcase. But, whatever.

 

[szvook]

Motul, Luk, etc are quite hard to find in the usa.

As far as Motul (aside from my tuner who caries Motul) I contacted Motul U.S.A. and got a list of local distributors in SoCal, who can get any Motul products within a day or two. So if my tuner is out, I have 4 more places where to get my Motul oil.

 

[samiam44]

Christian,

I think mercedes recommends NOT flushing, just like no fuel system additives on a regular basis. In the USA, when the dealers had slugging problems from running mineral base oils instead of synthetic with the long change intervals, the dealership was doing close change intervals.

I've seen bad internal engines.. the worst ones I worked on in the 90's were Amsoil cars. I remember an alfa where the oil was jello from the blown headgasket. The audi's which looked like the pictures shown.

 

[195910]

Never Used any of these engine flushes, just do regular synth oil changes and the engine block will sparkle from the inside...will post pics of my old 500E block at 217,000km (taken when doing the timing chain), this was when i first switched to M1 0w40, Its got even cleaner afterwards!

 

[Christian_K]

Hi, i asked today Liqui Moly on the Phone about the product "Motor Clean". It is approved by the german TüV and by them rated as "good working" and does no harm at all. They tested this for decades over and over again on a regular base by independent laboratories and there is ZERO wear in the engine when using it for only 10-15minutes and at idle.

I asked them because of the strong cleaning solvents that is used as base carrier material here (made the comparison with brake-cleaner) and they said they add for instance ZDDP (1-1.5% by Volume!) to the formula to avoid any wear in those 10-15minutes at idle. They also said since offering such flush-products they had ZERO cases with any customer claimed engine damage. They also said if the car has had regular oil-services after manufacturers targets with a good Semi- or Fullysynthetic oil, they say its not necessary to use such a product.
Just thought to inform you about that.

http://www.liqui-moly.de/liquimoly/mediendb.nsf/gfx2/1019%20Motor%20Clean_EN.pdf/$file/1019%20Motor%20Clean_EN.pdf
http://www.chemical-check.de/client....pdf?Opendocument&voilalang=e&voiladb=web.nsf

Will try to get in contact with Eurosol about that as well tomorrow.

 

[gsxr]

Like I said: If your engine is not a complete piece of crap, you have no need for "engine flushes". IMO it's a pure gimmick product that is produced because some people demand it. Just like people keep buying that eBay chip and reporting that their car runs so much better with it!

*chuckle*

 

[400Eric]

I haven't had time to read this thread but based on what I have seen in previous threads on this topic, I can say with great confidence that Dave knows his stuff when it comes to oil. (Although he does like his oil a little thinner than I do. I generally like 20W-50 weight in my warm running, non-oil cooler equipped M119. Look in your owners manual and you will find that 20W-50 is good to a much colder temperature than you may think! Other than that y'all can do what Dave says!)

There is a lot of info on oil here: http://www.ultimatesyntheticoil.com/Scamsoil_Skeptics.htm with a lot of links to a lot of other very informative pages on oil as well.
Regards, Eric

 

[Jelmer]

This thread is becoming so long with so many different angles and opinions, it's nearly impossible to draw proper conclusions from it.

That said, I've asked my car monkeys to replace my current semi-synthetic 10W40 with a fully synthetic 5W40. Main reason for that is that it came with 5W40 from the factory, and the the argument with a thin layer of coating that remains with full synthetic (for "softer" cold starts). Also: this is what MB says you should put.

I know the way my engine sounds, starts, runs and behaves since I'm paying very much attention to it. I'll be sure to see if there are any differences.

 

[Jelmer]

Drove the first 100km with my car today, having the fresh 5W40. Although its by no means "scientific", I do feel like it somehow feels better, more smooth. Acceleration sounds softer, more smooth, less metalic, and idle has become nearly silent, especially in gear: nearly no engine shudder, no intermittent stutters, etc.

I had expected my oil pressure to drop slightly from the already not-too-high 1 bar in gear, but it seems the contrary happened. Even with a fully hot engine (playing catch with 036 on the freeway and then ending up in a traffic jam), it stayed at 1 bar.

 

[Christian_K]

I had expected my oil pressure to drop slightly from the already not-too-high 1 bar in gear, but it seems the contrary happened. Even with a fully hot engine (playing catch with 036 on the freeway and then ending up in a traffic jam), it stayed at 1 bar.

There you see the advantages of a full synthetic Oil. It thins out less at temperature, compared to the crap European 10W-40s and 15W-40s (which are in 99% cheap mineral based oils or HC oils in the best case, with still only 2-5% synthetic parts)

 

[szvook]

I do feel like it somehow feels better, more smooth.

That's exactly what I experienced when I bought my car and switched to Mobile 1 0w-40. But that sensation was heighten even more when I recently switched to Motul 300v Power 5w-40. Motul is the only motor oil I will use from now on.

 

[Jelmer]

If anyone ever needs convincing on why they should change their oil, make them watch this:
[video=youtube;KC-SxrsgEwo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KC-SxrsgEwo[/video]

and part 2
[video=youtube;oIkxlWpJ6bk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIkxlWpJ6bk[/video]

 

[Christian_K]

WOW! Similar harden residues like in those M119 Pics from Bernard i posted some posts ago in this thread... Incredible how one can save on something as crucial as an oil-change.

 

[Jelmer]

Correction: how one THINKS he can save! I'm sure these video's were shot over the course of multiple days - the owner will surely receive a hefty bill!

 

[Wowek]

Hi,
We got her nice discussion about engine flushes. Until I will see interior of the engine - to check the "oil-lacquer" - I do not recommend to use it.
Better switch from semi or mineral oli to full synthetic for 1000-2000km - just to clean the engine a bit and the go back to at least semi.

In my case buying a car I was 99% sure that the engine oil was semi-synthetic oil - but still I have removed the timing covers and the oil pan.
In the oil pan I have found piece of timing chain slides - so it was good reason to inspect some more parts and do "manual flushing".

Oil I can recommend:
Fuchs TITAN SYN MC SAE 10W-40 it is semi synthetic. German one and very good quality, it has lot of recommendations - also the VW 505 that normally goes for full synthetic products.

For this year I have bought Valvoline Racng VR1 10w60 - to be tested.


Regards

 

[Christian_K]

Oil I can recommend:
Fuchs TITAN SYN MC SAE 10W-40 it is semi synthetic. German one and very good quality, it has lot of recommendations - also the VW 505 that normally goes for full synthetic products.

Negative on this one.
It has only the MB Blatt 229.1 approval - very "basic" oils. For the M119 Engines they say "minimum" is 229.1, recommended and typically filled were/are oils after approval Blatt 229.3 or better (Blatt 229.5).
The MB Approvals are the "strongest/hardest" on the oil-market out there. Aral (BP) for instance, writes on the German homepage in their engine oil FAQs that the MB approvals are the hardest to match in the industry. So if an oil qualifies for an MB 229.3 approval (in case of engine oils), you can be assures that its really "good". The really good Full-Synthetic oils get approval of MB Blatt 229.5 which is so far "the best". Mobil-1 0W-40 for instance (european formula), or "FUCHS TITAN Supersyn
LONGLIFE SAE 5W-40".

 

[Wowek]

https://www.500eboard.com/forums/member.php?282-Christian_K

Christian_K - what you wil say about the Valvoline Racng VR1 10w60 ?
It does not go with the MB approval - it is US.
My engine was driving all life on the semi synthetic - so I have to stay semi! Any experiences with Valvoline?

 

[samiam44]

Interesting.. snip "they said they add for instance ZDDP (1-1.5% by Volume!) to the formula to avoid any wear in those 10-15minutes at idle."

My understanding was ZDDP prevents scuffing from contact it does not eliminate wear. It is much more effective @ op temp. By thermo-couple experiement, oil temp takes 3X as long as water to come up to temp.

You will still get wear... but scuffing is a near-fatal event for parts. Those pictures from Bernard are YUCK! Maybe if the shops were not doing $$ flushing, customers would change their oil more frequently.

 

[gsxr]

My engine was driving all life on the semi synthetic - so I have to stay semi!

No need to stay with semi-synthetic, you can switch to full synthetic if desired. I use full synthetic in all my vehicles and some had previously only had dino (non-synthetic) oil used by the previous owners. There is no technical reason to stay with semi-synthetic just because that is what had been used previously.