Is restoring old 500E worth it?

[TornikeM]

Hey everyone, I need some advice on whether it's worth pursuing this W124 500E I found. This has been my dream car for a long time, but the condition and price have me second-guessing.

So, I spotted this W124 500E sitting on the street a while back. The wide fenders caught my eye immediately, and I knew it was something special. Upon closer inspection, I noticed it needed a full repaint, and some plastic parts (like the bumper and side skirts) were missing. The rear light was even removed, and someone had gone at the rear fender with an angle grinder—it looked pretty rough. The car had no license plates or contact info, so I spent a week tracking down the owner.

Finally, I got his number and called him. I offered to trade my W211 E-Class for it, but he wasn't interested. Then I asked how much he was selling it for, and he hit me with a question: "Do you even know what these cars go for?" I said yes and offered him $15k, but he told me that around here, they go for $50k (which is true for ones in good condition). He claims the engine and transmission are in ideal condition, but everything else needs some work.

When I pointed out that it’s a shame for the car to be rotting outside, he said if I saw his garage, I’d understand why it was left out there—turns out, he’s friends with one of the most famous racecar drivers in the country, so he's got plenty of cars. He seemed open to selling it, but I don’t have much more than the $15k I offered, and he said that’s too low.

The problem is, I’m not sure if it’s worth the investment. It’s imported from Japan, probably sat for about two years, and needs a lot of cosmetic work. But the engine and transmission are apparently in good shape, and I’m obsessed with the idea of owning this piece of history.

Would it be worth offering him my car (W211 E-Class) plus $7k? Or should I just walk away and save myself the headache? What would you guys do?

 

[doolar]

In today’s market you could probably pickup a good car for around $25-35k with way less issues.

More or less any E500E will require $5-15k to get it up to reasonable standard.

Buy the absolute best example you can afford. I would rather take out a loan for $20k and add that to the 15k you have, then getting a cheap example. Spend $30 on the car, keep $5k for the most pressing issues.

I’ve restored a E420, plenty of W124’s and know a bit about the costs involved. Not to mention getting a good local tech if you need help. They’re getting rarer every year, and the few that remain (rightly so) know their value.

And at last, and for me the most important thing. If this is a dream car of yours, and if this example is your first E500E, don’t let a lemon ruin it for you. These cars can be a frustrating money pit with seemingly never ending black holes. Get a good one, enjoy the car, maintenance and ownership.

My two cents!

 

[nocfn]

Outside cosmetics can be repaired, albeit not cheap. Front fenders are NLA, rusted battery trays vis a vie rear quarter would need a harvest from a w124 92-95 scrapped car. There are a multitude of NLA bits for the drivetrain, let alone cosmetics. Using the moderator's guide that every running, well cared for E500E should net a new owner between 5-10k USD in mx issues that are just deferred. Then when you think of things such as consumables - tires brakes rotors struts control arms and the corrosive climate of the UK in places your wallet will get light very quickly. Much depends on your will and your wallet and the tolerance of a significant other living with you. yikes thats a lot for a first date.... sorry M8.

 

[TornikeM]

In today’s market you could probably pickup a good car for around $25-35k with way less issues.

More or less any E500E will require $5-15k to get it up to reasonable standard.

Buy the absolute best example you can afford. I would rather take out a loan for $20k and add that to the 15k you have, then getting a cheap example. Spend $30 on the car, keep $5k for the most pressing issues.

I’ve restored a E420, plenty of W124’s and know a bit about the costs involved. Not to mention getting a good local tech if you need help. They’re getting rarer every year, and the few that remain (rightly so) know their value.

And at last, and for me the most important thing. If this is a dream car of yours, and if this example is your first E500E, don’t let a lemon ruin it for you. These cars can be a frustrating money pit with seemingly never ending black holes. Get a good one, enjoy the car, maintenance and ownership.

My two cents!

That makes sense. The thing is, my country has import law and you cant import vehicles that are over 10 years old. But you can import older cars which are over 40 years old. And considering such small size of the country its hard to find many 500e's let alone ones for sale. I have only seen 2 and both were 50-60k.

The cosmetic work doesnt worry me as much, it only needs few plastic parts around and repainting. What worries me the most is possible mechanical issues, but I dont think they will be too hard to work on since older mercedes models are simplier(I hope).

Also considering my car is E 500 with amg body kit and not just a random w211, persuading the owner might be easier if I offer him extra money. But I still dont understand why does he need that car if its going to be rotting away for years like that, losing its value. I will add picture of it that I took.

 

[ArauzMotoring]

Those rear fenders look like they were “massaged” to be a lot wider than usual 500E’s

15000 for that car seems like a lot- especially considering it was sitting for two years and even tho the owner says the engine is good you never know till you start driving it and inspecting it.

 

[TornikeM]

Those rear fenders look like they were “massaged” to be a lot wider than usual 500E’s

15000 for that car seems like a lot- especially considering it was sitting for two years and even tho the owner says the engine is good you never know till you start driving it and inspecting it.

I dont think they have been widened, it just had more narrow wheels installed so it could slip better to do burnouts better I suppose. I saw it had its original wide wheels in the trunk

 

[gerryvz]

Just from that photo, you are looking at the acquisition cost (whatever the seller would agree to sell it for), plus AT LEAST USD $50,000 in restoration costs. Just from the one photo you posted, the car looks rough. I'd pass and take the advice to spend MUCH LESS and get a MUCH BETTER car (if you can, given your country's laws).

 

[TornikeM]

Just from that photo, you are looking at the acquisition cost (whatever the seller would agree to sell it for), plus AT LEAST USD $50,000 in restoration costs. Just from the one photo you posted, the car looks rough. I'd pass and take the advice to spend MUCH LESS and get a MUCH BETTER car (if you can, given your country's laws).

50k for restoration might be overestimation, labor doesnt really cost that much around here and most parts can be replaced from other standard w124s except engine and transmission.

I had engine main seal and rear axle boots replace on my w211, which required disconnecting the transmission and engine, and also whole rear axle shaft and in the end the mechanic charged little over 100$. Oil stopped leaking and it drives very nicely now.

 

[Bogeyman]

At least get the VIN so you can verify if it is real.

 

[gsxr]

...some plastic parts (like the bumper and side skirts) were missing.

Some of those items are NLA and will be either difficult+expensive, if not impossible, to locate and replace. The fender mouldings are 036-specific and rarer than rocking horse poops. Ditto for the side skirts.

$15k I offered, and he said that’s too low.

$15k USD is all the money for a project car like that. His expectations are unrealistic. It will sit and decay further for another decade and he'll end up selling it for less (inflation-adjusted). Hard to deal with sellers who genuinely believe they own a gold mine.

The problem is, I’m not sure if it’s worth the investment. It’s imported from Japan, probably sat for about two years, and needs a lot of cosmetic work. But the engine and transmission are apparently in good shape, and I’m obsessed with the idea of owning this piece of history.

Keep in mind that Japan cars often have more wear & tear for a given odometer reading since it's an island with mostly city driving. And, Japan spec cars lack the engine oil cooler and some other goodies.

Or should I just walk away and save myself the headache? What would you guys do?

I'd walk away and save both a migraine, and save a large pile of cash.

That makes sense. The thing is, my country has import law and you cant import vehicles that are over 10 years old. But you can import older cars which are over 40 years old. And considering such small size of the country its hard to find many 500e's let alone ones for sale. I have only seen 2 and both were 50-60k.

Might be worth waiting until 2032 when you can import a nice one. Or, shell out the $50k for a nice one and save yourself all the headaches of restoration. You could easily end up sinking $50k into that thing after buying & restoring it.

The cosmetic work doesnt worry me as much, it only needs few plastic parts around and repainting.

You SHOULD be worried much about those "few plastic parts". They're made of pure unobtanium. You're lucky the front bumper is present, and that the missing tow hook cover can be 3D printed.

What worries me the most is possible mechanical issues, but I dont think they will be too hard to work on since older mercedes models are simplier(I hope).

Mechanical stuff is the easy part (but not necessarily cheap), and some mechanical parts are NLA these days...

But I still dont understand why does he need that car if its going to be rotting away for years like that, losing its value.

Because the seller believes it's worth a fortune AND will go up in value. Neither of which is true, especially if it's sitting outside getting rained on along with UV exposure slowly killing the interior.

 

[DerFuror]

This car has been neglected. Walk away from it unless you have an over abundance of discretionary income & time. The realities of a shoddy looking 500E of questionable history can soon turn one’s dream car vision into a nightmare. Buy the best one available.

 

[Jlaa]

50k for restoration might be overestimation, labor doesnt really cost that much around here and most parts can be replaced from other standard w124s except engine and transmission.

I had engine main seal and rear axle boots replace on my w211, which required disconnecting the transmission and engine, and also whole rear axle shaft and in the end the mechanic charged little over 100$. Oil stopped leaking and it drives very nicely now.

Hello @TornikeM,

Welcome to our forum. As others have mentioned, restoring the mechanical bits - engine, transmission, driveline, etc etc .... that will probably be the least costly part of restoration as you mentioned that labor costs in your country are low. Perhaps paint costs are also low as that car will need to be repainted.

You will find that a huge majority of costs comes from staggering NLA parts prices --- in which you will be buying parts sourced globally, and competing with global demand and global dollars in purchasing them. These parts are not shared with other w124s.

Just as an example, from the one picture you have posted:

• Front headlights 500E specific - NLA. Those headlights on that car is from a non-500E. Plan for at least EUR 5000, if you can find them. Some jokers are even asking USD 4000 - 9000 for just the headlight lenses alone, not the whole assembly!
  
  
• Black front bumper trim for this pre-facelift 500E - NLA - and these are 500E-only pieces. If you can even find these in pristine condition (especially the center piece w/o license plate mounting) then maybe you are looking at USD 1K +?
  
  
• Headlight wipers - NLA. If you can find these, plan for USD $150+
  
  
• Foglights - etc etc etc....

Anyways, this is just from one picture. Perhaps this would be a passion project and you are independently wealthy ----- then more power to you and damn the money!!

 

[maw1124]

Would it be worth offering him my car (W211 E-Class) plus $7k? Or should I just walk away and save myself the headache? What would you guys do?

Walk away and save yourself the headache.

Cars are almost always poor investments, and when a car has the word "investment" attached to it, people develop unreasonable expectations around it. Such is the car in question.

The short answer is there are better cars around, which are probably worth your car plus cash, in which to realize your dream. Getting one fully sorted -- either in the beginning or by the end of your ownership -- will cost more everything than you think. More time, more money, more work, more frustration, everything.

Fully sorted ones no longer trade for cheap, so figure those cost 3 or 4 of your W211. And cheap ones might literally never be brought back up to snuff because parts are becoming scarce. So you have to spend more time to find one in the middle of that spectrum -- some $30k car that's mechanically sound and maybe needs paint and some other workable deferred maintenance items.

The good news, and sorry I saved it for last, is "you've come to the right place." Such cars trade and are spotted and discussed here all the time. So if there is such a car you'll find it here before anywhere else (my view). On your side of the world we see maybe a dozen a year come up for sale.

Welcome to the forum!

maw

 

[sheward]

Even I, who never saw a project that couldn't be resurrected, agree with all the comments. What you offered the man was probably the correct price.

 

[Melville]

I agree with what everyone has said, and I'll just add a short comment that, if you buy that car, it will make you very unhappy much more often and for much longer than it will make you happy.

 

[alabbasi]

I think that if you're looking to buy a car, you should look for ones that are for sale. If you going around knocking on people's door because you happen to see one there. You should expect the owner to either not take you seriously or not be serious about selling.

 

[TornikeM]

I think that if you're looking to buy a car, you should look for ones that are for sale. If you going around knocking on people's door because you happen to see one there. You should expect the owner to either not take you seriously or not be serious about selling.

Thats the thing. There arent any of them for sale. Plus if you see a car that has been abandoned for a while its reasonable to think that owner might be open to selling it. In this case he was indeed open to selling it but after reading the answers I realized his price is just unreasonable.

 

[daantjie]

Always pay up front for the best one you can find. Trying to drag a dead horse across the finish line with this one I'm afraid.

 

[maw1124]

Thats the thing. There arent any of them for sale. Plus if you see a car that has been abandoned for a while its reasonable to think that owner might be open to selling it. In this case he was indeed open to selling it but after reading the answers I realized his price is just unreasonable.

If after all we've said you think "his price is just unreasonable" then I'd say check back periodically. He may yet come to a price you find acceptable.

And I don't think that's an unreasonable conclusion on your part, given your country's importation rules and everything else you've said around labor availability, etc.

So bide your time while you look. Hopefully you find a better one.

maw

 

[sheward]

Show the owner this thread if possible. He may be open minded and unaware of the current state of things. I'm somewhat of an expert when it comes to "projects never gotten to"

 

[gerryvz]

50k for restoration might be overestimation, labor doesnt really cost that much around here and most parts can be replaced from other standard w124s except engine and transmission.

I had engine main seal and rear axle boots replace on my w211, which required disconnecting the transmission and engine, and also whole rear axle shaft and in the end the mechanic charged little over 100$. Oil stopped leaking and it drives very nicely now.

I've been observing this market for E500E restoration for more than 20 years now.

UPDATED DEFERRED MAINTENANCE COSTS (aka Gerry's Law) | Off-Topic Discussions

I'm trying to track down a recent thread that I think went "off topic" when a board member asked if Gerryvz's deferred maintenance figures could be updated - and what these figures might be based on the car's mileage? Were these figures ever given, and if so where can I now find them? Thanks...

www.500eboard.co

It's absolutely not an over-estimation. But I'm estimating the job being done professionally, and with high quality factory and/or OEM parts. Good luck in finding "most parts .... from other standard w124s" these days.

 

[TornikeM]

If after all we've said you think "his price is just unreasonable" then I'd say check back periodically. He may yet come to a price you find acceptable.

And I don't think that's an unreasonable conclusion on your part, given your country's importation rules and everything else you've said around labor availability, etc.

So bide your time while you look. Hopefully you find a better one.

maw

That seems best approach. I dont think I will call him again and offer lower price, but I have left my contact info inside of the car, if he ever finds it and calls me Im not willing to give him more than 9-10k and the all the reasons you guys listed.

 

[alabbasi]

In this case he was indeed open to selling it but after reading the answers I realized his price is just unreasonable.

Which goes back to my point about whether he was not being serious or thought you were not. In any case he's not a seller right now and you're not a buyer right now either.

On a side note.

Maybe it's just me who gets irritated by random people knocking on my door to ask 'how much?' on a car that I clearly don't have for sale. If you are going to direct him to this thread. I'd also like to make a recommendation for this type of situation: here :-D

 

[duuder]

This car looks like a headache... and unless you're a body pro, a 90s German vehicle is going to be very costly. This just might be a parts car unfortunately...

 

[maw1124]

If after all we've said you think "his price is just unreasonable" then I'd say check back periodically. He may yet come to a price you find acceptable.

And I don't think that's an unreasonable conclusion on your part, given your country's importation rules and everything else you've said around labor availability, etc.

So bide your time while you look. Hopefully you find a better one.

maw

FOR SALE - 500E for Sale- price reduced to 25K | Cars for Sale - 500E / E500 ONLY

Hello 500E Board. Just wanted to let folks here know that my 500E is still for sale. Originally listed here at a much higher price, now significantly discounted given the current market and feedback from a reserve not met auction on BAT. That BAT auction had high bidders with very new...

www.500eboard.co

If you have a relative in a neighboring jurisdiction where you could import and register this one, it might be easier than restoring that one.

But this is just one of the many cars available. You're solving for importation more than solving for the poor state of that home car.

maw

 

[yao500e]

Hey everyone, I need some advice on whether it's worth pursuing this W124 500E I found. This has been my dream car for a long time, but the condition and price have me second-guessing.

So, I spotted this W124 500E sitting on the street a while back. The wide fenders caught my eye immediately, and I knew it was something special. Upon closer inspection, I noticed it needed a full repaint, and some plastic parts (like the bumper and side skirts) were missing. The rear light was even removed, and someone had gone at the rear fender with an angle grinder—it looked pretty rough. The car had no license plates or contact info, so I spent a week tracking down the owner.

Finally, I got his number and called him. I offered to trade my W211 E-Class for it, but he wasn't interested. Then I asked how much he was selling it for, and he hit me with a question: "Do you even know what these cars go for?" I said yes and offered him $15k, but he told me that around here, they go for $50k (which is true for ones in good condition). He claims the engine and transmission are in ideal condition, but everything else needs some work.

When I pointed out that it’s a shame for the car to be rotting outside, he said if I saw his garage, I’d understand why it was left out there—turns out, he’s friends with one of the most famous racecar drivers in the country, so he's got plenty of cars. He seemed open to selling it, but I don’t have much more than the $15k I offered, and he said that’s too low.

The problem is, I’m not sure if it’s worth the investment. It’s imported from Japan, probably sat for about two years, and needs a lot of cosmetic work. But the engine and transmission are apparently in good shape, and I’m obsessed with the idea of owning this piece of history.

Would it be worth offering him my car (W211 E-Class) plus $7k? Or should I just walk away and save myself the headache? What would you guys do?

sad to say, probably not worth it. Even worse is how these owners can let an e500 sit and rot. horrible.
the MONEY spent will be quite high, then factor in your TIME, the TIME you spend is ENORMOUS!

These MORONS, yes i called him a MORON who let an e500 sit and rot is outtrageous.

He is willing to let this car ROT but he wont just give it to you at some SUPER LOW PRICE or even for FREE so you can put time, effort and MONEY to bring it back to life. He doesnt CARE ABOUT THE CAR anyways! ZERO. but he wants TOP DOLLAR for it. this guy is a MORON IDIOT.

 

[Oldcar]

How does it run and drive ...what's the documented miles...doesn't look that rough to me...has it been in a serious accident? You can offer what ever you want his starting price could be just that.

Drive it for a few hours at all speeds and and test it hard for free then sleep on it. If you find sand in the air filter it is a terrible shock to you so you lower your 15 to whatever you want but only if it is a savage beast!

 

[TerryA]

@TornikeM or Anybody Else Interested,
This is a parts car as far as I’m concerned.

From the pic in post #04, this car has had a front end accident! Wrong headlights, no fog lights, impact strip is missing plus it may have had an engine fire.

IMOP, This car is in bad shape. Walk away better yet RUN!

 

[Oldcar]

You forgot the missing mercedes hood symbol ! On the plus side it's a desert car with no rust...lol

 

[gsxr]

@TornikeM - any update since October?

 

[duuder]

sad to say, probably not worth it. Even worse is how these owners can let an e500 sit and rot. horrible.
the MONEY spent will be quite high, then factor in your TIME, the TIME you spend is ENORMOUS!

These MORONS, yes i called him a MORON who let an e500 sit and rot is outtrageous.

He is willing to let this car ROT but he wont just give it to you at some SUPER LOW PRICE or even for FREE so you can put time, effort and MONEY to bring it back to life. He doesnt CARE ABOUT THE CAR anyways! ZERO. but he wants TOP DOLLAR for it. this guy is a MORON IDIOT.

pretty funny about an owner that says "i know what i got..." and chooses to let it rot outside... this is something a corvette guy would say

 

[Oldcar]

I understand what you guys are saying.

However the guy said he had lots of cars...and maybe used up his garage space..... .

M119 is all about the engine and the driving mine has over 200k miles and the compression ratio tests like new
The body has some parking lot dents ...I don't care...it's the engine and build that I have enjoyed for 24 yrs.

Some of us are home mechanics/ drivers others are enthusiasts.. but we all have this incredible machine in common. Don't forget M119 raced Le Mans.

Also the guy liked M119 maybe it's the only one in his home country Timbuktu.

like gsxr said it's an old text....he probably never got to drive it.


...

 

[500AMM]

@Oldcar, that was actually very well said with few words about the ownership. People have different preferences and different starting points, but in my case - and probably for the majority of the owners, the ownership circles a lot around the M119, which is a dictating factor for the 036 characteristics.

.

 

[Oldcar]

Sounds like Tornike wants to be an owner but 500es are hard to find in Timbhktu!!!

 

[bclifton]

It all depends on how much you want to do something and what kind of attachment you have to the car.

I'm overly sympathetic towards any W124 or W126 that doesn't have frame damage or major engine damage. With time and attention (and don't forget the $$$) anything is possible. And folks to support you! Like folks this board and of course a supportive spouse (VERY IMPORTANT)

Does it make financial sense to restore a car? Unless you're a pro where you restore cars for customers and you're good enough to live well, the answer is likely no. It takes a while to build contacts for rebuilding / replating / etc. But personal satisfaction is a hell of a drug (if you have money/time to spare).

Horribly maintained cars do respond well to care. But they require a LOT of attention and money (buying parts cars or junk-yarding for the hard to find stuff). I recently brought a 1987 300SDL back to life. Interior was completely trashed, wouldn't pass emissions, someone sawsalled the dashboard. I won't make a profit but it feels good to fix those things and end up with a car that now gets compliments.

Please see the maintenance journal for my two cars:
- 1987 300SDL - this was the one near totaled that I recently brought back.
- 1987 300D - this was what really roped me in hard to the e500board Project thread here.

The E500E presents some extra tough challenges as it's got a lot of unobtainium parts. If you don't enjoy hunting for those things (and potentially buying a parts car for the part) then answer is definitely no.

 

[Oldcar]

Are parts harder to get than 400e?

 

[gsxr]

Are parts harder to get than 400e?

Body parts, yes.