MB position on ethanol in gasoline

[gerryvz]

Interesting to see MB's evolving position on the use of ethanol in gasoline for its cars.

First off, I have a "Factory Approved Service Products" brochure from 1989. Note the following notation in the "fuels" section:

"The afore-mentioned blended fuels ARE NOT TO BE USED EXCLUSIVELY."




Next up, I have the same brochure from 1994. Note the notation has been removed, and the factory allows for "Gasohol" with no restrictions. They have removed the aforementioned limitation on the use of fuels with up to 10% ethanol.


Cheers,
Gerry

 

[r44raven]

Interesting topic!

Here in the UK, I've always tried to avoid using any fuel for my 500E which contains ethanol. However, I am increasingly frustrated when, at refuelling stations, when I ask the question "does your gasoline contain ethanol?", I'm met with a dumb look, and no reliable answer!

Googling the various fuel companies renders no information. It seems (at least over this side of the pond) that all the major fuel suppliers are VERY reluctant to give any information as to which of their fuels contain/don't contain ethanol. It also appears that, for reasons best known to themselves, the fuel suppliers add ethanol in various parts of the country, but not others.

But do I understand it from gerryvz's posting, that I'm worrying unnecessarily?



So its all a bit "hit and miss".

 

[gerryvz]

I think as long as you're using gas with UP TO 10% ethanol, you're probably safe. Though the cars (particularly the CIS-E cars) don't like it, and weren't really designed for it. But, at least on this side of the pond, it's pretty much ALL that is available unless you REALLY want to go out of your way to source non-ethanol gas (such as racing gas, or if you want to drive to a rural area not mandated to use it).

In the US, it's mandated that the gas station have pumps that use gas with ethanol to be marked as such. A few years ago, the stickers used to say "MAY CONTAIN UP TO 10% ETHANOL" which was vague at best. Now, pretty much ALL normal gas here uses 10% ethanol, so the pump stickers say "CONTAINS UP TO 10% ETHANOL" or "CONTAINS 10% ETHANOL"

10 years ago, oxygenated gas was more of a seasonal thing that was mandated during the wintertime in many states. The ethanol lobby combined with government rules/regulations and quotas at the time, was successful in pretty much forcing 10% ethanol into all gas year-round.

Then, of course, there is E85 and other variants for flex-fuel vehicles. The gas companies LOVE E85 because it helps them meet their government quotas/mandates for Ethanol use, because it's 85% rather than 10% alcohol.

 

[northNH]

"Though the cars (particularly the CIS-E cars) don't like it, and weren't really designed for it..."

My 24V CIS-E 300CE, now with 182Kmiles, has had a steady infusion of ethanolized premium for at least half it's wonderful life.
Starts easily hot or cold, idles perfectly smoothly, pulls well to ~7K, dead nuts reliable, and delivers a rock-steady 24MPG.

Other than the altered smell from the exhaust, how else could I tell that my car doesn't like it?

 

[gerryvz]

"Though the cars (particularly the CIS-E cars) don't like it, and weren't really designed for it..."

My 24V CIS-E 300CE, now with 182Kmiles, has had a steady infusion of ethanolized premium for at least half it's wonderful life.
Starts easily hot or cold, idles perfectly smoothly, pulls well to ~7K, dead nuts reliable, and delivers a rock-steady 24MPG.

Other than the altered smell from the exhaust, how else could I tell that my car doesn't like it?

Well, a few things:

• Premature death of the fuel pumps (applies to our E500Es too, as they use the same pumps)
• Seals inside the fuel distributor HATE ethanol fuel
• Premature leakage and failure of the EHA

There's a reason that MB stated (when these CIS-E cars were new) that one should not use blended fuels all the time.

Unfortunately, they saw the winds of change coming, and changed their position, to the long-term detriment of the cars.

Look, I've been using ethanolized fuel in my SEC as well for as long as it's been pushed on us. I've also been through three EHAs and a set of fuel pumps too over the past 16 years & 100K miles. It's gradual damage, not anything that catastrophically fails.

Ethanol is NOT good for rubber fuel system parts, and 10% concentration is about the max one can go without having some major damage. That's where they came up with that percentage in the first place, when they invented "Gasohol" back in the 1970s. If you don't believe me, do some searching for folks' experiences about using E85 and EXX fuels in regular cars.

Cheers,
Gerry

 

[gsxr]

See if you can find ethanol-free gas nearby, using this handy finder for USA and Canada:

https://www.pure-gas.org/index.jsp

I have 87-octane ethanol-free available locally, but the only stations with premium (91 octane) are far enough away that I don't bother with it. I do get the 87-octane E-zero for the lawn mower / chainsaw / ATV / snowblower / weed hacker.

 

[northNH]

Interestng...

Although I have had none of the common ethanol-related fuel system issues mentioned with either the CE or my '80's BMW (original fuel pumps, virtually virginal rest of both systems except filters, and no frequent hoses), different story with chain saw, splitter, whackers, etc.

When the ethanol/gas appeared initially, it did result in (temporarily) poor running equipment and soft hoses, especially the stuff that sat for awhile. Adding the right additive stuff to the fuel eliminated that problem.

But although my equipment hasn't changed much since then, I found several years back I no longer need to put the additive in the fuel. No negative effect even though stuff seems to sit for longer between uses than when I had more gas.

Credit reformulation of what's added to the gas along with the ethanol?

 

[gerryvz]

Jono has plenty of tales about the havoc that E10 has wreaks on our vintage MBs.

 

[alexis]

Hi,
The head of my (big) Mercedes dealer is a guy in his 50's who did most of his career at Mercedes. He is known as a very qualified person.
When I told him about gas with ethanol (E10) few years ago, his answer was : "certainly not". And when I asked why, he answered : "Very bad for the fuel system". Full point...
So, no ethanol in my cars