SOLD 1994 E500 Limited, Sapphire Black/Black/Green, 82kkm, €0.15M (Aalen Unterrombach, Germany)

[stfallet]

Found this E500 Limited - No affiliation

VIN = WDB1240361C132076 (see post #3 below)

https://www.autoscout24.de/angebote/mercedes-benz-e-500-limited-benzin-schwarz-6443ad0a-db47-4401-936a-61196c62d45f

Marc Luca Automobile

www.marcluca.com

For sale is an exceptionally well-maintained Mercedes-Benz E 500 Limited, originally delivered in Germany and now on its third owner. Since 2006, it has been part of a larger collection and has been driven sporadically during this time. The documentation is complete and includes, among other things:

• the original new car invoice
• various older documents
• the old vehicle registration document
• as well as further documents relating to the vehicle's history

Extensive maintenance was recently carried out. This included the following work:

• Automatic transmission oil change
• Brake replacement
• Replacement of the strut mounts
• Power steering pump replacement
• etc...

241 DRIVER'S SEAT LEFT Electrically adjustable with memory
249 Interior mirror automatically dimming
260 Type designation on trunk lid - deletion
412 Electric sunroof with tilting mechanism
441 Electrically adjustable steering column 540 Electric roller blind
for rear window 551 Anti-theft alarm system (ATS)
570 Folding front armrest
620 Vehicles with catalytic converter technology
658 Alloy wheels EVO 2 (E 500 Limited)
682 Fire extinguisher
732 Bird's eye maple black wood trim
810 Sound system
873 Heated driver's seat, left and right
885 LOCKING SYSTEM WITH INFRARED REMOTE CONTROL AND IMMOBILIZER
958 SPECIAL EDITION - LIMITED

For further information or to arrange a viewing appointment, please contact us by phone.

www.marcluca.com

 

[gsxr]

I think this one is on the forum... but may be hard to locate without the VIN.

EDIT: Could just be the same seller with a different 036, I recognize the Marc Luca website.

 

[WDB748372]

VIN should be WDB1240361C132076. Narrowed it down thanks to the option codes provided. 3 cars, 1 delivered to Switzerland but listings mentions originally in Germany. Other VIN was documented on the forum with higher km so left with only 1.

 

[gerryvz]

It's a new one for the registry, but has now been entered.

 

[PHK]

Check me if I'm wrong, but it seems that the number of E500s that show up for sale is disproportionally weighted to Limiteds, in that not many were made but yet a lot get traded.

 

[gsxr]

Check me if I'm wrong, but it seems that the number of E500s that show up for sale is disproportionally weighted to Limiteds, in that not many were made but yet a lot get traded.

Limiteds were nearly 10% of total production. We don't have a way to easily sift the classified subforum data to extract the percentage of Limiteds, along with listing dates, but it does seem that quite a few pop up for sale.

 

[Surf Blau]

I think a lot of owners of cars like these (and any other type of "collectors item") that might be considering selling, will be triggered by an increase in perceived market value and demand, often leading to a lot of similar cars (or items in general) to be offered at the same time. This is, when you think about it, the literal process of any open market; supply and demand!

 

[gerryvz]

Limiteds were nearly 10% of total production. We don't have a way to easily sift the classified subforum data to extract the percentage of Limiteds, along with listing dates, but it does seem that quite a few pop up for sale.

It's pretty easy to code up a query script in Javascript to extract whatever data is needed from the Google Sheet.

What specifically do you need -- the exact percentage of Limiteds out of production? I think we have that, no?

Now that the Classified listings and the VIN Database are totally in sync, we could extract a listing of Limited that have come up for same in the last X days/months/years, easily, based on the date code markings in the Sheet. Probably could even do an analysis of pricing by then going out and polling price data from the Classified listings from the URLs in the VIN Database.

Just let me know what you want, and I can create and execute a query against the data.

 

[stfallet]

I think a lot of owners of cars like these (and any other type of "collectors item") that might be considering selling, will be triggered by an increase in perceived market value and demand, often leading to a lot of similar cars (or items in general) to be offered at the same time. This is, when you think about it, the literal process of any open market; supply and demand!

I'm not sure. I think the collectors grade (And those that can be upgraded to that) cars which are currently being sold are out of an estate. I don't think that there are too many people looking to flip them as a result of an investment. Reason is that I don't see the "real premium" dealers having any of them for sale.

 

[AdamCabrio]

Don't know this particular example, haven't seen its underbody etc., but this particular one FS @marcluca seems of much higher standard than (most) other Ltd's on offer. To an extent that it wouldn't surprise me if it sells @asking price. Too bad it has the green/black interior though.... I'm not affiliated with Marcluca in any way, but I've been following his cars FS for quite some time, and all of these seem "real premium" to me (in terms of quality)

 

[gsxr]

It's pretty easy to code up a query script in Javascript to extract whatever data is needed from the Google Sheet.

What specifically do you need -- the exact percentage of Limiteds out of production? I think we have that, no?

Now that the Classified listings and the VIN Database are totally in sync, we could extract a listing of Limited that have come up for same in the last X days/months/years, easily, based on the date code markings in the Sheet. Probably could even do an analysis of pricing by then going out and polling price data from the Classified listings from the URLs in the VIN Database.

Just let me know what you want, and I can create and execute a query against the data.

I think the idea was to see if there was a substantially larger percentage of Limiteds for sale, vs non-Limited, indicating a disproprtional amount of 958's on the market (per post #5's postulate).

The problem is that we kinda only have the posting date for the forum thread where the car was first added to the forum, which may or may not align with the actual time it was for sale. And, since we keep a single thread for multiple owners/sales, that can get confusing as well. Likely not worth the effort unless it was a really simple query.

 

[Surf Blau]

I'm not sure. I think the collectors grade (And those that can be upgraded to that) cars which are currently being sold are out of an estate. I don't think that there are too many people looking to flip them as a result of an investment. Reason is that I don't see the "real premium" dealers having any of them for sale.

No, I don't think "professional collectors" are represented here, more like people with a hobby car or two, who constantly feel guilty for not using it and could need money for their dream sauna in the garden

If someone bought a Ltd ~10 years ago who is starting to get fed up with (the lack of) parts availability and prices of such, looking at what appears to be market price nowadays would tempt more than a few.

 

[stfallet]

No, I don't think "professional collectors" are represented here, more like people with a hobby car or two, who constantly feel guilty for not using it and could need money for their dream sauna in the garden

If someone bought a Ltd ~10 years ago who is starting to get fed up with (the lack of) parts availability and prices of such, looking at what appears to be market price nowadays would tempt more than a few.

I agree, in the time between 2005 and about 2013 you could get them between EUR 15K to 30K. And considering the emission standards, fuel costs, spare parts costs and that you get substantially more than then, it could be an opportunity to sell for some.....

But not me. I don't sell cars, I only buy...

 

[gsxr]

But not me. I don't sell cars, I only buy...

I have the same problem. I need a 12-step program of some sort.

 

[stfallet]

I have the same problem. I need a 12-step program of some sort.

View attachment 236585

Hmm, so your solution is trying to fight it. I have given up and took a different path: More garage space and additional garages

 

[gsxr]

Hmm, so your solution is trying to fight it. I have given up and took a different path: More garage space and additional garages

I like the way you think!

 

[sheward]

Hmm, so your solution is trying to fight it. I have given up and took a different path: More garage space and additional garages

I just finished a dry underdeck area... for one of my cars.

 

[AdamCabrio]

Check me if I'm wrong, but it seems that the number of E500s that show up for sale is disproportionally weighted to Limiteds

I have no clue how many 036's are (or recently have been) on the market in total. Of the 036 Limited's I (try to) keep track on market activity during the past 3 years or so (don't know where this fetish comes from ). Of the 951 units I have on file (with VIN#'s and any related info, such as latest reported mileage, ex-Japan or not, current whereabouts, asking/sales prices etc.), in those 3 years I see only sales info on <100 units (including a few online for which no VIN# could be established as sellers are secretive about it). This could mean that what @PHK sees might be a distorted picture. AFAIK it's often the same ones that seem to be flipped over and over again. As I see it, the large majority of Limited's (>85% of them) is in firm hands (at least not advertized anywhere).

 

[PHK]

... This could mean that what @PHK sees might be a distorted picture. AFAIK it's often the same ones that seem to be flipped over and over again. ...

I am fully prepared to accept that observation.

 

[stfallet]

My observation is different when I go via the sales platforms. I do see a very small number of real limiteds. I do see many cars that have the Saco boards painted in the body color and have the EVO 2 wheels.

In regard to this forum, we have a combination of people positing to sell their cars and cars which we find for sale and are of interest to us to discuss. In my case, I have only mentioned cars that I found when a friend was searching for limiteds, to share the with you. I believe that was 5 cars in total.

If I take the following platforms and look for E500
mobile.de - 23 cars for sale with 1 Limited
Autoscout24.de - 26 cars for sale with 2 Limited
Autoscout24.ch - 12 cars for sale with 1 Limited

There are other platforms as well.

What would be interesting is to have an AI agent scan the common platforms, eliminate duplicates and trace when the posts went up and got delated. Most duplicates use the same photos.

 

[stfallet]

My observation is different when I go via the sales platforms. I do see a very small number of real limiteds. I do see many cars that have the Saco boards painted in the body color and have the EVO 2 wheels.

In regard to this forum, we have a combination of people positing to sell their cars and cars which we find for sale and are of interest to us to discuss. In my case, I have only mentioned cars that I found when a friend was searching for limiteds, to share the with you. I believe that was 5 cars in total.

If I take the following platforms and look for E500
mobile.de - 23 cars for sale with 1 Limited
Autoscout24.de - 26 cars for sale with 2 Limited
Autoscout24.ch - 12 cars for sale with 1 Limited

There are other platforms as well.

What would be interesting is to have an AI agent scan the common platforms, eliminate duplicates and trace when the posts went up and got delated. Most duplicates use the same photos.

Look for example at this wannabe Limited one:
https://www.autoscout24.ch/en/d/mercedes-benz-500-e-automatic-9198715
And added Porsche and AMG to make it sound more special

 

[PHK]

Thanks for the link. Vendor Question: Wouldn't anyone spending this sort of money on a high-mileage W124 know the basics of the 500? Description says 'cloth seats'. How dumb is that? But it never actually waves the 'Limited' flag, so I guess it's alright.

 

[stfallet]

Thanks for the link. Vendor Question: Wouldn't anyone spending this sort of money on a high-mileage W124 know the basics of the 500? Description says 'cloth seats'. How dumb is that? But it never actually waves the 'Limited' flag, so I guess it's alright.

All valid questions. But there are many who just hear Porsche and AMG and that gives it premium.
In current market the car is overpriced, then again. If the dip is just temporary, they only need to wait. The number of cars is going down.
But will the market pickup? Who knows - If you look at the youngsters, they at least don't show the interest in cars anymore as it was with my generation. For me living on the country side, a car was freedom. Nowdays, you can take the train every 10minutes into a big town. Many don't even have a driver license anymore. Last but not least, the industry is as well taking a step against us serious enthusiasts.....

 

[PHK]

Actually, it is surprising to me how many in their twenties recognize and appreciate the car for what it is. I also see the broad trend away from autos but there are also many youngsters who still get it. There would be no market for these cars at all if it were just 'our' generation.

 

[gsxr]

Look for example at this wannabe Limited one:
https://www.autoscout24.ch/en/d/mercedes-benz-500-e-automatic-9198715
And added Porsche and AMG to make it sound more special

"Creative" marketing from a dealer... sadly there's a lot of this, including the flipper-dealers on Bring a Trailer. They're all about hype, trying to pump up the sale price.

That particular car is interesting. It's an early production, 1991-1992, with a full facelift... and has the rare trip computer AND stationary heating. Looks like 199 Pearl Black. Painting the lower cladding body color is a fairly common modification, and IMO it often does look better than the 2-tone, so I understand why it's done. The ~$75k USD ask is on the high side for 300kkm/200kmi but if it's rust-free with full history and mechanically restored, it might be a fair number. That said, the badly sagging headliner is inexcusable at the asking price.

 

[stfallet]

"Creative" marketing from a dealer... sadly there's a lot of this, including the flipper-dealers on Bring a Trailer. They're all about hype, trying to pump up the sale price.

That particular car is interesting. It's an early production, 1991-1992, with a full facelift... and has the rare trip computer AND stationary heating. Looks like 199 Pearl Black. Painting the lower cladding body color is a fairly common modification, and IMO it often does look better than the 2-tone, so I understand why it's done. The ~$75k USD ask is on the high side for 300kkm/200kmi but if it's rust-free with full history and mechanically restored, it might be a fair number. That said, the badly sagging headliner is inexcusable at the asking price.

Don't forget, if you bring in a car from the US or anywhere else. You will have to add the shipping, road registration fees (4%) and VAT (8.1%). Which does keep prices higher here.

 

[Surf Blau]

Reiserechner!

 

[TerryA]

@stfallet,
In regards to the 8.1% VAT, I my travels to Europe when I returned to the US the VAT in the past was recoverable by keeping all receipts and filling out form. I haven’t been to Europe in the last 6 years so I don’t know if that rule still applies or if it ever applied to automobiles.

 

[stfallet]

The 8.1% is if you import to CH. You are correct, the VAT is refunded when you export from a VAT territory

 

[AdamCabrio]

This car appears to have been sold (can't see it any longer on the autoscout24.de site on top, and it seems now listed @marcluca under "sold cars"). That was quick for such a high asking price . Anyone knows more?

 

[FD.]

This car appears to have been sold (can't see it any longer on the autoscout24.de site on top, and it seems now listed @marcluca under "sold cars"). That was quick for such a high asking price . Anyone knows more?

No surprises here.

Marcluca is one of the leading players in the Mercedes-Benz 500 E / E500 (W124) field — and in high-end Mercedes youngtimers in general.

They have a loyal customer base which are ready to pay 30% more for a rare car from a known specialist with a strong presentation.

 

[FD.]

The 8.1% is if you import to CH. You are correct, the VAT is refunded when you export from a VAT territory

It works, but only if the car is being sold with VAT — meaning it has remained registered to companies within that country / the EU throughout its life (or after importing from Japan for example).

That currently applies, for example, to this Ferrari FF listing from Marcluca, but not to the other Mercedes youngtimers in the Marcluca portfolio.