M119 Ticking Noise - NOT oiler tubes (1998 SL500)

[gsxr]

If I'm reading those correctly, you have cams at 0°, two at 20-ish degrees, and one around 40°.

The zero appears to be 2 teeth off, the two at 20-ish are likely 1 tooth off. You'll need to loosen the chain and rotate the cams until you can get all four cams reading near 40-45°. Remember that the cams may "jump" when tension is released. It won't be fun to correct this.

 

[R129 UK]

Thanks, I’m really perplexed how this has happened because I only disturbed the exhaust cam with the bad lifter as far as I was aware.

I’m busy for the next couple of weekends so won’t be able to correct this straightaway.

I’m guessing they all “off” in the same direction too? Seems odd to me that the one I removed is potentially correct and the other’s aren’t.

 

[gerryvz]

A few posts that may be helpful?

RESTO PROJECT: M119 / W124 / E500 Engine Top-End Refresh | Member Roadtrips and Project Journals

:update: I'm at a point where I'm having to adjust the order of some of the tasks that I have been planning to do on the car, in addition to taking a hiatus for some of the Memorial Day holiday weekend, and this week. Specifically, I had intended to change the transmission fluid NOW, in...

www.500eboard.co

RESTO PROJECT: M119 / W124 / E500 Engine Top-End Refresh | Member Roadtrips and Project Journals

Hi JC, Yes, I can get a socket on that remaining 13mm bolt that holds the bracket to the cylinder head, using a wobbly and a couple of long extensions. It seems that it is just a bit of an extreme angle with the wobbly, so I guess I'm going to have to find another shallower angle so that I can...

www.500eboard.co

RESTO PROJECT: M119 / W124 / E500 Engine Top-End Refresh | Member Roadtrips and Project Journals

Hi JC, Yes, I can get a socket on that remaining 13mm bolt that holds the bracket to the cylinder head, using a wobbly and a couple of long extensions. It seems that it is just a bit of an extreme angle with the wobbly, so I guess I'm going to have to find another shallower angle so that I can...

www.500eboard.co

RESTO PROJECT: M119 / W124 / E500 Engine Top-End Refresh | Member Roadtrips and Project Journals

Hi JC, Yes, I can get a socket on that remaining 13mm bolt that holds the bracket to the cylinder head, using a wobbly and a couple of long extensions. It seems that it is just a bit of an extreme angle with the wobbly, so I guess I'm going to have to find another shallower angle so that I can...

www.500eboard.co

 

[gsxr]

Thanks, I’m really perplexed how this has happened because I only disturbed the exhaust cam with the bad lifter as far as I was aware.

I’m busy for the next couple of weekends so won’t be able to correct this straightaway.

I’m guessing they all “off” in the same direction too? Seems odd to me that the one I removed is potentially correct and the other’s aren’t.

Weird stuff can happen when the chain is loosened. I don't have an explanation, but I've experienced this too. This is why I tell people to triple-check the cam timing when the work is complete, because it's no fun to tear it apart second time just to check cam timing (and then fix it).

 

[R129 UK]

A few posts that may be helpful?

RESTO PROJECT: M119 / W124 / E500 Engine Top-End Refresh | Member Roadtrips and Project Journals

:update: I'm at a point where I'm having to adjust the order of some of the tasks that I have been planning to do on the car, in addition to taking a hiatus for some of the Memorial Day holiday weekend, and this week. Specifically, I had intended to change the transmission fluid NOW, in...

www.500eboard.co

RESTO PROJECT: M119 / W124 / E500 Engine Top-End Refresh | Member Roadtrips and Project Journals

Hi JC, Yes, I can get a socket on that remaining 13mm bolt that holds the bracket to the cylinder head, using a wobbly and a couple of long extensions. It seems that it is just a bit of an extreme angle with the wobbly, so I guess I'm going to have to find another shallower angle so that I can...

www.500eboard.co

RESTO PROJECT: M119 / W124 / E500 Engine Top-End Refresh | Member Roadtrips and Project Journals

Hi JC, Yes, I can get a socket on that remaining 13mm bolt that holds the bracket to the cylinder head, using a wobbly and a couple of long extensions. It seems that it is just a bit of an extreme angle with the wobbly, so I guess I'm going to have to find another shallower angle so that I can...

www.500eboard.co

RESTO PROJECT: M119 / W124 / E500 Engine Top-End Refresh | Member Roadtrips and Project Journals

Hi JC, Yes, I can get a socket on that remaining 13mm bolt that holds the bracket to the cylinder head, using a wobbly and a couple of long extensions. It seems that it is just a bit of an extreme angle with the wobbly, so I guess I'm going to have to find another shallower angle so that I can...

www.500eboard.co

Awesome, thanks Gerry, that really reinforces what I need to do next although I doubt my engine will be clean enough to eat my dinner off!

Were these markings related to some previous re-timing activity? Are they chalk or some kind of dry based material?



I think part my problem came from using ancient correction fluid to mark my cams. It is almost impossible to buy it new over here (probably everywhere) in a bottle with a brush to apply it and with the oily surfaces and the months I've taken to do this work they effectively disappeared.

 

[R129 UK]

Weird stuff can happen when the chain is loosened. I don't have an explanation, but I've experienced this too. This is why I tell people to triple-check the cam timing when the work is complete, because it's no fun to tear it apart second time just to check cam timing (and then fix it).

It is the not knowing why that is bugging me, I have spent ages following the MB docs and youtube videos and the advice from here so it really shouldn't have happened.

See my above comment - my poor choice of cam marking material was definitely a factor I'm sure.

 

[gerryvz]

The marks were fingernail polish that I "borrowed" from my wife -- albeit with her permission. Pink and orange are colors that she does not commonly use/wear. I think I also made a third mark with a black Sharpie marker, but the black ink can potentially be dissolved through handling, motor oil, brake cleaner solvent, etc. I also like having multiple (two or three) separately colored points of reference. This makes everything visually MUCH more sure and able to line up.

 

[R129 UK]

The marks were fingernail polish that I "borrowed" from my wife -- albeit with her permission. Pink and orange are colors that she does not commonly use/wear. I think I also made a third mark with a black Sharpie marker, but the black ink can potentially be dissolved through handling, motor oil, brake cleaner solvent, etc. I also like having multiple (two or three) separately colored points of reference. This makes everything visually MUCH more sure and able to line up.

Ah, the old "borrowed" nail polish line



Sorry, but I need to inject some humor into my situation, I'm desperate to get my car back on the road ready for the 2 or 3 days of a UK "Summer"... the problem is that it isn't currently known when it will be this year.

 

[R129 UK]

An update with sadly a question...

Started today and got all cams pinned, unfortunately there was a father/son miscommunication and the crankshaft wasn't at 45° BTDC.

No problem, we can just stop for lunch and redo it all afterwards having moved the crankshaft to the correct starting position.

The trouble is that after moving the crank to the correct position we have "run out of chain" maybe a link or 2 so something appears to be caught somewhere.

Does anyone know if there is enough room for the chain to skip or double over on itself around the crankshaft sprocket or elsewhere out of sight?

It isn't clear where the missing chain is located or trapped.

I'm thinking of removing both exhaust camshaft sprockets and trying to pull through the excess from one side to the other and roughly measuring if it to see if it is equal or coming from 1 side or the other.

Any other ideas?

The only other thing to note, between the incorrect timing attempt and the last was when removing the chain tensioner in between it came out slightly disassembled as the locking ring was slightly bent about. This has been fixed but obviously not refitted yet.



Chain path with possible places of issue highlighted:



I also probed lightly with a screwdriver into the tensioner hole in case something was caught up around that area but didn't notice anything.

EDIT - I just went back to the car and was able to get the final (exhaust) sprocket on with 1 fixing but the chain was a tiny bit too tight to get the other 2 fixing holes lined up.

Where's my missing link (or 2) of chain?

 

[R129 UK]

I'm buying an endoscope so hopefully more news on what's wrong with the chain path to follow...

 

[R129 UK]

Another update:

After a few weeks and weekends working away, I finally got some time to get back in the garage and try to make some progress.

The endoscope wasn't particularly helpful. The chain was actually very easy to free by just starting to rotate the engine anticlockwise, it immediately pinged out.

The outcome of today is that I now have the cams correctly positioned and the chain tensioner in. After 2 rotations of the engine the cams return to the pinning points. I have checked this a couple more times just to be sure.

I think not using the correct tool was a major factor so we made these, the centres are ~138mm apart:



Hopefully I will never need to use them again

The next jobs are to replace the front covers and fit the power steering pump and then the chain guides and valve covers, plugs etc. can go back on.

 

[TerryA]

I have no clue as to the cost or availability of the MB OEM tool especially in the UK. This is a nice improvisation of one. It looks precise and even adjustable if needed and it did the job.

 

[R129 UK]

I have no clue as to the cost or availability of the MB OEM tool especially in the UK. This is a nice improvisation of one. It looks precise and even adjustable if needed and it did the job.

Me neither but probably expensive if still available and a special order.

These were made from 2 different sizes of round bar which was tapped and threaded but you could use M6 studding and threaded collars. They were made fully adjustable so they would definitely fit.

 

[R129 UK]

It looks like my fuel pump is dead, put the remainder of the engine back together this morning and when I eventually plucked up enough courage to turn the key it cranked fine but didn't fire.

I have checked the relay/fuse in the boot and it seems to be fine.

I squirted some Easy Start down it's throat and it spluttered into a kind of life.

Now it is a matter of establishing if the fuel pump is getting power (likely) vs the fuel pump being dead.

I think the pump (or pumps?) are underneath the car in front of the rear wheel on the RHS. I'll check for 12V tomorrow before giving the pump a tap to try and encourage life.

From memory, the pump makes a bit of noise when the ignition switch is turned to position 2 and this isn't happening currently.

Not the outcome I was hoping for but a huge step closer to getting the car running and back on the road I hope.

 

[R129 UK]

Apologies, I completely forgot to update this thread, the car is all back together, running perfectly, MOTed and in regular use.

With my paranoia over recharging the battery and wanting to avoid frying the roof module in the process, I had very carefully tucked some of the +ve battery leads well hidden out of sight behind the boot trim and failed to remember to re-connect them hence the electrical issues initially.

I learned as much about myself as I did the car during this work. Many thanks to everyone who helped along the way, particularly @gsxr who did a huge amount of hand holding.

I don’t seem to be able to attach a short (6 second) video - any ideas? I have seen much longer videos posted in thread replies and in my OP.