Willow Springs Open Track Racing - June 20, 2012

[szvook]

I've decided to attend the Open Track Racing event at Willow Springs sooner than later...speed is calling. Plus I have a bit of downtime at work next month, before it gets busy again. My whip is turning 20 years next moth, so what's a better birthday gift than a day at the track to stretch the legs a bit. I'm still planing to attend the November 14th date as well, which has been confirmed.

Got my helmet yesterday, Nitto NT01 tires and Porterfield R4 race brake pads have been ordered.

It's an early call for this event, 7am is the preferred time to arrive, but the drivers meeting is at 8am.

All info for June 20,2012 and Open Track Racing - http://www.opentrackracing.com

The Big Willow track - http://www.willowspringsraceway.com/page.php?id=26

If anyone is going, I'll see you there.

 

[szvook]

7 days left...getting quite eager

 

[J-Sauce]

Have fun Steve-O!! make sure and get some great in-car vid shots for us.

 

[Jimbo]

First track event for you Steve? I'm sure I speak for everyone in saying have fun and hope nuttin' breaks on the old dawg.

Post pix or it never happened !

 

[gsxr]

Steve, do you have an alternate set of wheels for the track? Or will you have the sticky Nittos spooned on to those gorgeous HRE's for the weekend?

 

[szvook]

I had a GoPro HD Hero 2 camera in my plans, but I will be borrowing a Sony Bloggie HD camera from work. Just need to get a Delkin Fat Gecko Mini suction cup this Saturday.

This is my first time on a twisty track with my 500E. I have been on twisty tracks a few times before on the East Coast, but with a slower car.

I have no alternative wheels for the track, so the HRE will be tested. I did not end up getting the Nitto tires nor the R4 race pads; I had to help my family with some cash for the past two months, so I had to cut back on the track budget…this time. I’ll just use up my Conti DW’s and have them replaced after the event, I might try Michelins next. I also spoke with Porterfield regarding using the R4-S pads at Willow Springs and with the Big Willow being a fast track, I should be ok, plus I don’t ride my brakes.

 

[J-Sauce]

Steve, I will be in LA this weekend. I can bring my FatGecko Mini if you would like to borrow it.

 

[szvook]

I will be in LA this weekend. I can bring my FatGecko Mini if you would like to borrow it.

Justin, I would take you up on the offer, but I'm not sure when you would get the mount back, unless you make trips to L.A. on a regular basis. Btw, you wouldn't happen to have an extension arm for the FatGecko Mini? I found a FatGecko Mini with an extension arm through Samy's Camera.

If you are still willing, I can get the extension arm separately - but I don't want to put you in a bind.

 

[J-Sauce]

Yes I still have the extension arm, but I have to find it! haha How much do they charge? I think I paid $45 for mine shipped somewhere online.

I am in no rush to get it back as I haven't used to since the last track day, save one run up to big bear. Held on fine going around the canyon roads.

 

[szvook]

Well, if you can find the extension arm and are ok with the mount being with me, then I'm game. Let me know if you actually can get the extension arm and then I'll meet you at your discretion - but I need to ask you to let me know by EOD tomorrow, or I'll just go to Samy's Camera.

The price for the arm is about $42 at Samy's Camera.

Many thanks in advance.

 

[J-Sauce]

Ill look tonight. I mean the price for my entire mount with arm was $45. Do they charge $42 for the arm alone?

 

[szvook]

My bad, it's actually $49 with the extension arm + tax. Btw, the extension arm I'm referring to is this one.

 

[400Eric]

plus I don’t ride my brakes.

I love it! On the gas all the way around the track!

Sorry that none of the rest of us can join you.
Regards, Eric

 

[szvook]

I love it! On the gas all the way around the track!

Sorry that none of the rest of us can join you.
Regards, Eric

Yep, gonna try to stay in throttle as much as I can. The track only has three hard braking corners, but since the Big Willow track is fast and wide, the speeds can be kept up in corners.

The next event is in November, so maybe other drives can make it. The bummer is that the open track events are held during the week and I bet that makes it harder to attend vs. the weekend.

 

[Jack Olsen]

I'll be there on the 20th.

If you haven't driven the course before, then this might not be very useful. But here's a corner-by-corner guide I threw together for Willow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLCpHnA54cQ

 

[szvook]

I'll be there on the 20th.

If you haven't driven the course before, then this might not be very useful. But here's a corner-by-corner guide I threw together for Willow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLCpHnA54cQ

Jack! Are you kidding me, I've been religiously studying that exact video for the past month. Your video tutorial is the best one I have found to date, especially your step by step directions at slowmo and then at speed, very well done!

When I get to the track next week, I would like thank you in person. Many thanks again.

 

[400Eric]

The next event is in November, so maybe other drives can make it. The bummer is that the open track events are held during the week and I bet that makes it harder to attend vs. the weekend.

I probably can make it in November but I would first need to do the suspension parts upgrades that we discussed on the phone.

I'd like to hit that track at least once before I move up North.
Regards, Eric

 

[szvook]

Well, I had a blast and managed not to go off the track…although I could have on a few occasions - turn three at higher speeds and wrong exit lines. This is one fast track, even the beginners group (group I was in) was haling ass at 95 mph before breaking into turns and taking them at fairly fast speeds as well. I was even told by a few drivers and instructors alike that the beginners groups in the OTR events are close to intermediate groups elsewhere – I found that out the hard way during my first lead and follow session. I was the only person there whom never driven the Big Willow track and with the slowest group flying, the first two laps were quite fast and keeping a maximum of one car length between all cars (which was being semi enforced) was a quick learning curve for a first timer...this is a "beginners" group?

This track will kick your ass if the speeds are too high and the lines aren’t dead on in turns, the track will try to throw you off it faster than you can imagine. The elevation changes along with camber changes require all your attention at higher speeds and without a racing suspension, the car just wants to fly off the track. I was quickly able to reach the limits of my tires and the suspension at will. You can easily feel how heavy the car is and how hard it has to work, I just didn’t want to push it beyond its limits. The brakes worked perfectly, but I was after the performance of the suspension and never braked very hard, just kept diving into turns and tried my best to hold the lines while using the throttle more and more. I’ll have Nitto NT01 tires next time. The Conti DW tires worked ok, but I did manage the fry them a bit. If I do decide to track my car more often on these types of road courses, a suspension upgrade might be in order. The suspension's side to side travel made my wheels look tucked in a bit, see bellow.

The weather was quite hot, the first session was right around 88F and by the time I was done, it was 103F. The day was hindered by a few breakdowns, spilled oil and a new pothole before turn one, which developed early in the morning. Based on the time lost, two groups at a time would go out, which made for a busy day on the track with lots of passing at will. I ended up running 10 laps and I took it easy on my own; three laps during the lead and follow session (with an instructor in my car for one lap) and 7 open laps. I did only run two to three laps at a time before going off to do a cool down lap in the parking lot just to be safe and heading back out a few minutes later. The car never got too hot during any of my laps, 85C was the most I saw. I was the only Mercedes out there, there was an E550, but it was used to drive to the track in. I didn’t stay to the end, it was extremely hot by 3pm so I packed up, turned on the A/C and headed back home. I could have stayed till 4:30pm and the track was emptying out a bit, but the freaking heat was too much and my brain was fried.

I did take a few pictures and a few videos, but forgot to turn off the camera and drained the battery – I got into a few long conversations about my car and forgot I had the camera on and didn't have enough juice for the rest of the day. The in-car video did not turnout that well, the glare from the front washed out the images from the track. I had to mount the camera inside of the rear windshield, as all windows have to be down, so this prevented a better in-car video. By the time I wanted to mount the camera to the front windshield or outside the car, the battery was dead. Next time I’ll get a GoPro camera, the Sony Bloggie camera didn’t have a good resolution when zooming into full zoom and the results got blurred out. Below are some pictures (by me and a photography service) and a few badly taken videos...by me.

My car did get a bit of attention and compliments, which led to a few long discussions starting with the usual “Are those fenders aftermarket?" A lot people thought I was nuts to track my car, being my only car.

I'm still down for the November 14th event, even if I don't get a stiffer suspension beforehand.

[video=youtube;q4BLdGuIebY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4BLdGuIebY&feature=my_favorites&list=FLva 1YgFV87s9ZEA40xYEsVA[/video]
[video=youtube;eHxgV7Pc5FU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHxgV7Pc5FU[/video]

 

[gsxr]

Steve, that is awesome.

The tires look great for being flogged on the track for a day. The little bit of balled-up rubber on the edge of the tread blocks is normal. The wear was pretty minimal, shoot, you can still see the "DW" imprint! I was pretty confident you'd have no braking problems, the Silver Arrow setup is ideal for track use on the 500E. Glad to hear you had no issues in the stopping department.

Now - what's this about them making you have all the windows rolled down? Seriously? At 120mph+ on the straights?

Anyway - I was able to attach my video camera to the front windsheild using the Gecko mount with extension arm. Shoulda taken a photo of the setup.

I would buy race tires first (possibly with a spare set of wheels, so you can swap on the race tires/wheels easily) before messing with suspension changes. Sticky tires and driver skill improvement are the first items to work on to reduce lap times...

 

[Glen]

Very cool, Steve. Looks like you had fun!
Did you get to meet Jack? I've followed his awesome garage build on the garagejournal site for years...he's an amazing diy'er.

 

[400Eric]

Cool stuff Stevo!

Generally speaking, is your car an understeerer or oversteerer at the limit?

Did the ASR system intervene much?

 

[szvook]

Steve, that is awesome.

The tires look great for being flogged on the track for a day. The little bit of balled-up rubber on the edge of the tread blocks is normal. The wear was pretty minimal, shoot, you can still see the "DW" imprint! I was pretty confident you'd have no braking problems, the Silver Arrow setup is ideal for track use on the 500E. Glad to hear you had no issues in the stopping department.

Now - what's this about them making you have all the windows rolled down? Seriously? At 120mph+ on the straights?

Anyway - I was able to attach my video camera to the front windsheild using the Gecko mount with extension arm. Shoulda taken a photo of the setup.

I would buy race tires first (possibly with a spare set of wheels, so you can swap on the race tires/wheels easily) before messing with suspension changes. Sticky tires and driver skill improvement are the first items to work on to reduce lap times...

The tires help up, but then again I didn't stay on the track for more than 3 laps at a time, or I think I would have lost the DW imprint. :grin:

The all windows down policy was a safety request to minimize any shattered glass - I was told that many crashes have occurred at the track where some windows were still closed and the shattered glass caused more injuries. This just sucks in a sedan. I had to check my headliner a few times and the damn thing stayed on.

Having the Silver Arrow brakes were a blessing, I didn't have to even think about them at all - they just hauled my car down from speeds with moderate effort. The Porterfield R4-S pads worked quite well and it looks like don't need to replace them.

On my next event, I'm gonna make my first recording with the camera attached to the front windshield, or outside on the roof.

I'll be running Nitto NT01 next time, but a second set of wheels is just not in the cards right now. I'm not even sure where I can even store them, I need a garage for any storage. I'll have to find a place to store the Nitto NT01's for now. The suspension tweak would be much further down the line and you are spot on - for now I need to learn the track, which was my approach to Big Willow.

 

[szvook]

Very cool, Steve. Looks like you had fun!
Did you get to meet Jack? I've followed his awesome garage build on the garagejournal site for years...he's an amazing diy'er.

I had a Blast! More fun then should be legally allowed!

I did meet Jack and had a chance to thank him, but we only spoke for a few minutes before I was heading home. It was the only time I found him alone - he had a lot of people around him throughout the day and I didn't want to barge in. Plus his 911 was in a garage most of the day with the engine lid open, so I figured he was busy. He did mention that next time I'm at the OTR even, he'll take me out on a few laps - I'm looking forward to those laps!

 

[szvook]

Cool stuff Stevo!

Generally speaking, is your car an understeerer or oversteerer at the limit?

Did the ASR system intervene much?

Sup homie!

Understeer at the limit. My rear never went out and the ASR didn't intervene at all, but I also didn't push the car too much. The 275 meat in the back kept the rear planted, plus the track was sticky. The higher treadwear on the DW tires made the front tires slide a bit, adding to the understeer feeling. So when I'll run the Nitto NT01 tires, I should be able to dial out the understeer at bit.

I just need to learn the track, first and foremost.

 

[gsxr]

Steve, if you find room to store the Nittos, you'd also have room for the extra set of wheels! Well, at least after the Nittos are mounted, that is. You should be able to find some good used wheels for cheap... there are usually plenty of OE 17x8.5 ET30 (approx) wheels available on the MB forums, Craigslist, or eBay. In SoCal, it should be a breeze to find a set. I bet you could find four wheels for about $500 in decent shape. The nice thing about track wheels is that they don't have to be pretty, just straight. Maybe paint 'em black for that real mean look! I bet Jeff could scrounge up a set if you asked him. Sure, it would be nice to get a set of track-dedicated HRE's, but that would be one serious chunk of change to drop on something which would spend probably 360 days per year in storage.

The more seat time you can get at the track (with any tires), the better. Any chance you get to have an instructor ride along, take it. As your laps increase you'll get more comfortable and your times will drop accordingly. I've BT and DT on a bike at Sears Point and Thunderhill. The only bad part about going fast is that it tends to burn up your tires more rapidly, which in turn lightens the ol' wallet...

 

[szvook]

But a set of track dedicated HRE's would be the shiznit, plus I live in La La land, so even the drive to the track has to be in style....j/k.

I would need a set of light wheels as well and in the same staggered configuration as now. I need to think about it.

 

[gsxr]

Light weight wheels would be preferable, but as long as they're not made of lead, I wouldn't sweat a few pounds. The AMG CLK430 wheels are relatively light at ~23 lbs ea for 17x8.5 which is pretty decent. Staggered would be tough to find for 17's... there are sets in 18" (8.5 front, 9.5 rear) but the cost starts going up for both wheels and tires when you move into 18's. Besides, a bit less grip at the rear might help with the understeer, no?

 

[Glen]

If you are going to get a set of wheels just for the track, don't get staggered. Get a square setup and run the same sized tires front and rear. This will help with your understeer condition.

 

[szvook]

Thank you guys for sound advice. I need to do some thinking about space.

 

[J-Sauce]

Steve, I've got two sets of staggered 17" C36 AMG wheels. One of which I'd be willing to let go cheap.

That is, if you dont mind ugly.

 

[gsxr]

Interesting reading on a few track tires:

http://www.caranddriver.com/feature...odrich-toyo-michelin-and-yokohama-tires-rated

 

[400Eric]

Steve, I've got two sets of staggered 17" C36 AMG wheels. One of which I'd be willing to let go cheap.

That is, if you dont mind ugly.

Steve does mind ugly. Witness:

But a set of track dedicated HRE's would be the shiznit, plus I live in La La land, so even the drive to the track has to be in style...

Regards, Eric

 

[szvook]

Steve, I've got two sets of staggered 17" C36 AMG wheels. One of which I'd be willing to let go cheap.

That is, if you dont mind ugly.

Thank you for the offer. But if I'm going to get a set of track only wheels, I prefer an open wheel design for better air flow to the brakes.

 

[szvook]

Steve does mind ugly. Witness:

Regards, Eric

Dood, why are you stirring up shite? Did you miss my j/k ending?

 

[szvook]

Interesting reading on a few track tires:

http://www.caranddriver.com/feature...odrich-toyo-michelin-and-yokohama-tires-rated

Indeed

 

[szvook]

So it looks like I can get some storage space in my condo complex. I just might pursue the track dedicated wheels/tires option sooner than later.

 

[400Eric]

Dood, why are you stirring up shite? Did you miss my j/k ending?

It's not like that Stevo.

You may have implied that you were only joking, but deep down inside, you know you weren't really. It's been proven that even when folks say they are only kidding, the vast majority of the time, they aren't. You know, I know, and even Justin knows that you like your stuff NICE, cause you are one seriously pimpin' dude! At Fontana, while the other dudes are working on their cars trying to find an extra tenth, you are cleaning your engine and rims! It's OK though cause it's an image that few of us can live up to, so sometimes we are envious.

Besides, I'm angling to get those rims for myself so that I'll eventually be able to join you at Willow Springs! (After I perform the suspension upgrades that we discussed on the phone.) My puny little 15s and 16s aren't going to cut it there!
Regards, Eric

 

[szvook]

At Fontana, while the other dudes are working on their cars trying to find an extra tenth, you are cleaning your engine and rims!

Cleaning the engine, yes - and not having dust collect on top of the air box, with the hood open for 30+ minutes while the car was cooling off can’t be all that bad. I have never cleaned my wheels at the track, I might have brushed something of the lip while adjusting the tire pressure, but that’s it. If anything, you’ve seen me wipe down the front spoiler right before I was heading home, from the dried up bugs/insects.

It's OK though cause it's an image that few of us can live up to, so sometimes we are envious.

Silly goose

I'm angling to get those rims for myself so that I'll eventually be able to join you at Willow Springs! (After I perform the suspension upgrades that we discussed on the phone.) My puny little 15s and 16s aren't going to cut it there!

Wait, are you getting a set of HRE's as well? The suspension upgrade is worth it, but it’s the brakes you’ll need to upgrade if you want to fly around Willow Springs. That’s the one upgrade that actually can give you a better and safer track day, and you will need at least 17” wheels to slap on larger brakes. The Silver Arrow brake kit will be the best option for cost, stopping power and fitment…Dave might have to find another set, if he already doesn’t have a few sets lying around.

 

[400Eric]

I have never cleaned my wheels at the track, I might have brushed something of the lip while adjusting the tire pressure, but that’s it.

You WERE cleaning the rims! And I left out the best part: you were using bottled water to do it!

Wait, are you getting a set of HRE's as well? The suspension upgrade is worth it, but it’s the brakes you’ll need to upgrade if you want to fly around Willow Springs. That’s the one upgrade that actually can give you a better and safer track day, and you will need at least 17” wheels to slap on larger brakes. The Silver Arrow brake kit will be the best option for cost, stopping power and fitment…Dave might have to find another set, if he already doesn’t have a few sets lying around.

I was referring to the phone conversation we had where we discussed me getting your cast off parts when you do your suspension upgrade.
Regards, Eric

 

[szvook]

You WERE cleaning the rims! And I left out the best part: you were using bottled water to do it!

Nope, the bottled water was used to clean the spoiler. I might have been cleaning the fenders as well, which might looked like I was cleaning my wheels. I never wipe down my wheels away from my home, too many chances of scratching them. At home, the wheels get compressed air on them first before any water hits the wheels and I only use a sponge to wash my wheels.

 

[400Eric]

Wait, are you getting a set of HRE's as well?

Sorry, I forgot to answer this one. No, I was referring to Justin's 17" C36 wheels. I was saying to him don't sell them to Stevo cause Stevo only wants nice stuff. Sell them to me instead cause I only want cheap stuff.
Regards, Eric

 

[szvook]

I'm switching jobs soon, so I'm not sure I can make the November 14th date - it will be too soon to take off work mid-week to go racing. But this time will give me a chance to save up for new track wheels, Nitto tires as well as a GoPro camera.

 

[szvook]

Unofficially, there might a be a private race day being planned for July 13th (Saturday) at night at the Big Willow track and I can invite anyone I want (attendees would still have to pay to partake and the cost should be around $140.00). I'll know for sure by tomorrow and if the track is reserved, I'll start a new thread.

I've never been on a twisty track at night, should be quite interesting.