www.hagerty.com
Ricardo's car definitely looks nice but right now I'm waiting on garage space and some other factors that are taking more of my time than I'd like.Do you really need to see a car before you buy it? - Hagerty Media
We're so used to buying online that in-person vehicle inspections can seem antiquated. They're still a good idea.
@Mercedes>BMW, @RicardoD has a very good 500E for sale now. His mileage will make that car a better deal than it would seem. If you want a low mile example of similar quality, well that could take a while and will likely cost over double.
maw
You will regret not buying Ricardo's car. Enthusiast-owned cars that have been truly gone through are quite rare -- perhaps one or two come up per year. Or you can take your chances with an expensive HaT car with photos only. Ricardo's car is fully vetted and documented on this forum. Whomever buys Ricardo's car is going to be very happy. That is not guaranteed with HaT, and of course you will pay far more via that site plus their stupid fees.
I understand, I'm just more drawn to a low mileage car bought for less than half its original msrp with very nice cosmetics. I agree it will take more money to get them up to 'cpo' condition, but I think it will be worth it more to me than buying a driver's car and having to refurb all the cosmetics while still having more wear all around. It is definitely a deal for someone looking for a driver though.
Meh. Chasing any sort of odometer number is a fools errand. But sometimes you’ve got to ‘live it’ before you believe it.
As for Dean, he seems like a nice guy, but you’ll pay for the pleasure. To me- the value proposition just doesn’t seem like its there.
OK, so this is awkward.
In the fall of 2018 the car won third place in its class in Monterey California at "Legends of the Autobahn." ..... so it was relatively nice ..... but the only reason why it got 3rd place in its class was because there weren't that many E500Es in attendance that year ..... there also just wasn't a lot of competition in that class. My car was nice but it wasn't concours nice.
That does seem to be a lot of integral parts. I do see other companies making some of these parts. Control arms are still being made by lemforder. Radiators are still being made by Nissens. Shocks are on backorder from Sachs, but maybe they can be rebuilt? Victor posted in this thread earlier, he runs Restoreyourmercedes.com. I had a conversation with him yesterday. He rebuilds throttle bodies, harnesses and MAF harnesses too. Maybe their will be a work around for the rest of these parts. I wonder if one can even restore one of these cars now.. If it's getting this difficult now, imagine in 20 or 50 years.
Yeah most people that are collectors are just worried about the values of their cars and don't drive them which is just sad. Maybe a restoration for a higher mileage car would be more fitting? I had a 91 300e as a daily driver 10 years ago so I kinda wanted a 94-95 E500. I guess the Amg version of these cars would be even harder to keep alive.
Cosmetically and mechanically restoring these cars is really difficult, as the NLA parts situation is causing real issues on both fronts. @Jlaa listed some of the items in his previous post. Work arounds are either expensive (e.g. anodizing NLA exterior trim pieces, refurbishing the wood trim) or require a combination of patience and deep pockets to land NOS NLA parts. Not to mention that you need to find someone who knows about these cars and their intricacies to address all the issues they invariably will have at some point (from misfires to lack of power to poor ride quality). Search the site and you will get an idea.
@TimL's post (especially the last paragraph) says much more eloquently what I was trying to say. I bought my car in 2003 with 57K on the odometer for $21,500. A decent but not exceptional buy at the time - not a bargain and more toward the upper end of the scale.
So the question now is would it still be viable buying a 500e and keeping it for 20+ years when OEM is not available anymore? Will MB start producing these parts in the near future? It seems they would still make a good profit from them since people are still investing momey into these cars.
There is one other issue that no one has mentioned yet. A good number of people on this forum here are working on the cars themselves. There are few mechanics that are particularly knowledgeable of ANY W124 car much less a 500E. If I didn't live near David Hendy and have him as a resource there is zero chance that I would be driving a older Merc.
I do not believe that MB Naperville will sell using its internet catalog to local "pickup" clients (like the arrangement I have through MB Annapolis). People local to MB Naperville have tried in the past, and their parts counter will only sell at MSRP/retail prices if you go to the parts counter. So they only sell discounted through the internet site. You can talk to Bob there, who runs their Internet operation, and see if they will make an exception for you, but in the past they haven't for anyone.
The cosmetics on my car can be addressed by Alto gray paint via any good body shop. Want to go next level? Respray hood & front fenders. Get interior wood refinished. Note that all of that is easy to do whenever you want, when you are ready, just takes $$. No chasing parts for that. So many of the hard to get part stuff is already on the car!!
It seems like 3/4 of the people I’ve met who recognized what the car was, owned one (or a few) back when, sold them and regretted it.
It's funny, because there is always somone who comes on the forum looking for "the right" car -- I mean, their vision of what the right car is. For many people, it's the cheapest 500E they can find so that they can become a member of the club. Then they get confronted with the daunting costs and challenges of maintaining and improving the car. So they end up selling it.
Yep. I had the same sad feeling when @RicardoD announced he is selling his car as I did when @TimL announced he was selling his. Fortunately Tim did not sell and thus did not have to experience said regret.@Ricardo at this point I’ll remind you of what you already know but don’t want to hear, which is that everyone I’ve ever met who sold one of these has regretted it.
maw
Are you sure you don't want to keep it for a few more years and enjoy the work you put into it?
Contact Jono (@jhodg5ck) at Blue Ridge MB, he often knows about low-mile 036's for sale that aren't advertised publicly. Dean's talent is locating cream puffs and reselling for a hefty profit, he cherry-picks top-shelf stuff, and built a great reputation on this. But he doesn't specialize in the 036 and it could take him a while to find one. Hopefully you aren't picky about color and really like 199 Pearl Black, since half of USA imports are that paint color.
The MB Classic website (link) has text which implies what you state above, but IMO it's total BS, unless thousands upon thousands of buyers with cash in hand accost MB. Even then, you may not want to pay the price for the newly-manufactured part, which could be 2x-10x the last published price - inflation, supply chain, yadda x3. And, there's no guarantee the new part will be identical quality to the original, as MB is steering towards low-cost alternatives these days, like everyone else. I think their "send us a request" link just provides false hope. I've yet to hear of any requests being successful, at least for 124-related NLA items.
Lemfoerder only makes the early control arms, and they are now made in Taiwan (previously Italy). There is NO known source for quality late control arms. Nissens radiator kwality has apparently gone downhill after they also moved production to a low-cost country. Yes, harnesses can be rebuilt but you can't make new MAF's and it could get tough for Victor to rebuild ETA's when the internal parts become NLA. Bottom line, there are always alternatives available and with enough detective work you can generally find the part you need as NOS or custom aftemarket, but it won't be cheap. Which is why it's preferred to buy a car that already had most of this stuff done, and low-mile cars may have a number of original parts nearing the end of their service life after 30 years.
Find a higher-mileage car that has already been restored, like Ricardo's. But, it really depends if you are buying this for a collection where you are really concerned about resale value, in which case the low odometer helps - because collectors buy odometers, not cars.
There were very few of these made, and none were ever officially imported into the US. Even now, you could probably count the number of AMG versions of the .036, in the United States, on one hand.
@gerryvz My station in life has improved. Now I've graduated to the Prius XXL - i.e. Toyota Venza Hybrid!
Indeed, with a full tank of gas no less.
Whoa! You are a greenie afterall! Practicing “carbon recapture” I see!.
Supply & demand would not matter much, if MB and other companies (influenced by the goverment) have decided that EV's are better for the planet. Based on the guise of saving the environment from the masses, they could gently nudge people towards owning EV's by not providing repair parts for old dirty carbon-spewing dinosaur internal combustion engines. The bonus of making money by selling new EV's and not building ICE's anymore is a happy coincidence for them.
I love them too, to look at, but they drive nothing like an 036. People love them until they ride in my E5E. The difference is a bit much. BMW people are crazy though, so it’ll sell for higher numbers, which I find incredible.
E21... let me see, I have one too (don't worry, im not going anywhere)
