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1993 400E Head gasket, Yay or Nay?

GSXR:


*Yes, once I hear it roar, it makes perfect sense right away what an engaged fan sounds like :)

*I just looked at the old clutch again, and indeed it's stamped with March 1993 date. My car was build in April of 1993. Got screwed by dishonest shop then. Oh well.
On Thanksgiving 2014, took a trip from LA to Portland. Idea was to pick up wife who'd fly there and drive back to LA along the ocean. Made it to San Francisco, hitting 140 MPH several times on the empty freeway 5 at night, where my radiator shifted causing fan to hit it and disintegrate puncturing radiator and hoses. Dropped off a car at first Merc only shop, rented a car and continued on to Portland. Picked up my car on the way back. They've supposedly replaced fan clutch with a brand new one. The shop knew I'm not from San Francisco. I test drove the car, asked why it still does 105C-82C with new fan clutch (did not have cool harness at the time). "head-gasket" was the reply. Mechanic was a German guy, who supposedly worked on Mercs at a dealership back in Germany. That's when possibility of "head gasket" was sown in my head. I've assumed with a new MB radiator and MB fan clutch, it's unlikely these parts would be the culprit of 105C-82C cycle. Then a 2nd mechanic told me it's head gasket or cracked head - that's when I started this thread

* What amazes me, is that over 4.5 years, about 6-7 MB indies didn't even bother to troubleshoot fan clutch and either just told me it's a head gasket issue or, most of them, that "it's fine". Same as some members here who said "if it doesn't overheat, you've got no issue"

* ACM is stamped with "China" and NSK, which is a big Japanese bearings manufacturer. Should be good stuff, made by a proper engineering company, even if in China
 
Fan clutch it is! After 4.5 years, PROBLEM SOLVED! What a beautiful roar ACM clutch makes!...
Congrats, that is pretty awesome! Still good with temps?

...install an ACM fan clutch ($150 at FCP). The ACM clutch is engaged almost all the time, and may keep the temps lower, or more consistem. If it works, and you don't mind the constant roaring...
Now, I'm looking at this very same ACM fan clutch you mentioned, I think I would like to use it in my car as well, in the SL500, unfortunately, when I plug in my car's data in FCP, it says 1192000122 is not compatible with my M119... they are calling for 1192000022 I'm looking at the pictures of my original clutch, I'm failing to see any difference in terms of appearance. The fan blades share the same part numbers... Any suggestions?

Regards,
D
 
The 119.974 (W124) clutch is thinner, due to less space available in the 124 chassis. It also does not have the Swiss-cheese plastic cover on the front, the cover is open in the front. Poke around eBay for photos of each type.

The 119.970 (W140) and 119.972 (R129) clutch is "full size" with Swiss-cheese plastic cover. But I can't think of any reason you couldn't use the W124 clutch. Oddly, I hear much less about issues with the 140/129 "full size" clutches. Dunno if they tend to be calibrated better (Klink?), or if I just don't pay attention to the 140/129 enough to know about their problems.

:klink:
 
The 119.974 (W124) clutch is thinner, due to less space available in the 124 chassis. It also does not have the Swiss-cheese plastic cover on the front, the cover is open in the front. Poke around eBay for photos of each type.

The 119.970 (W140) and 119.972 (R129) clutch is "full size" with Swiss-cheese plastic cover. But I can't think of any reason you couldn't use the W124 clutch. Oddly, I hear much less about issues with the 140/129 "full size" clutches. Dunno if they tend to be calibrated better (Klink?), or if I just don't pay attention to the 140/129 enough to know about their problems.

:klink:
Good info Dave, appreciate it!

I've replaced original to the car fan because the car with AC on would get to 103C at the stand still traffic at times, I know it's normal, but it is higher than SL320 and considerably higher than my C280. Did I have to replace it - probably not, since the new, Hella/Behr keeps the temps exactly where they were before with original one.

With that said, the replacement Hella/Behr is a thin style already, came with new shorter bolt, and the "Swiss-cheesed" plastic cover no longer used.

I've heard of ACM clutches staying engaged longer that most, that is the reason why I wanted to give this W124 unit 1192000122 a try, I could not find R129 specific 1192000022 in ACM brand. ECS has these W124 specific units for $116 with free shipping, I may just try it...

Regards,
D
 
Yes, aux fans kick in at low speed with A/C on. ACM is stamped with "China". I'm not too concerned with stuff made in China if the brand is proper. After all, Iphones are made in China too. When it's an unknown brand and it's made in China, I get suspicious

Congrats on your persistence and sorting out the problem. I give you credit for not getting off the case.

Where did you buy the new/ACM fan clutch from? (i.e. do you have a link or online source?)
 
Congrats, that is pretty awesome! Still good with temps?

100% my issue has been resolved. Ambient temperature has been low thus far in northern VA (45-55F), still I think I only saw coolant at 90C once, and only for several seconds, after a couple of WOTs to 80 MPH and then spending 3-5 min at the traffic light. Keep in mind though that my old clutch was completely dead. I can't comment about ACM clutch vs properly working OEM

Congrats on your persistence and sorting out the problem. I give you credit for not getting off the case.

Where did you buy the new/ACM fan clutch from? (i.e. do you have a link or online source?)

Thanks. This was grinding at me for 4.5 years peredioticaly but regularly 😁

6,7,8(?) Mercedes indies over the years told me "temp behavior is fine, it's a big engine in tight space" or "head gasket". NOT ONE bothered to look at the clutch and NOT ONE was enthusiastic about tinkering with my car NOT for free. Both facts bewilder me to this day

I bought the clutch at fcpeuro.com
 
100% my issue has been resolved. Ambient temperature has been low thus far in northern VA (45-55F), still I think I only saw coolant at 90C once, and only for several seconds, after a couple of WOTs to 80 MPH and then spending 3-5 min at the traffic light. Keep in mind though that my old clutch was completely dead. I can't comment about ACM clutch vs properly working OEM...
I can certainly see the "comfort" in the matter after such a long journey, well done! I have few important things to attend in the next few weeks (AC compressor on C280 just died) and few other priorities, but definitely going to try this ACM on my SL500 and hope for the same low 90ish temps (not that far away from you btw, Frederickbsurg/Orange area)

Regrards,
D
 
How do one store the Viscous fan clutch?

1192000122 arrived, it is unlikely I'll be able to get to replacing it for a week or two... For some reason I vaguely remember that my old Hella/Behr came with the box labeled with red arrows pointed upwards (lateral side of the box) so it was to be stored vertically? Or am I "seeing" things that don't exist and overthinking? This ACM (boxed as BorgWarner) has not markings for storage...

Regards,
D
 
Store them vertically, or face-up.

If stored face-down, the pin which enters the fluid chamber could allow the juice inside to come out.

:hiding:
 
Thanks Dave, vertically it is!

I just checked the pic-a-part inventory, that old 1992 SL500 still there, going to pay a visit this Sat and pull the fan blades off of it so I can swap as full unit.

Regards,
D
 
Unfortunately by the time I got the yard, 500SL was crushed, and the W140 had broken blade, no dice... Today however, I did install this W124 ACM unit. Few things to note if anyone is mounting it to R129:

Physically it fits, perfectly. Shorter bolt is required (can be purchased separately). The difference is the depth of the mounting tabs, once assembled, it pulls the blades a little closer to the engine on R129, still with in the shroud, but closer to the engine. NO interference of any kind.

The temperatures with this ACM have not reached anything above 95C or so with AC on, that is what I was after. Looking at it's operation, I see what you guys were talking about, its on most of the time, and I indeed hear that mile hummmm a little, but is is not annoying to me at all, particularly if it keeps the temps at bay...

Driving with 71 outside, gauge stays at about 83-87C, while parked with AC on after a drive, gauge 88-93C. It is 7-10C lower than last I recall. Now, with this said, did I needed? Probably not, since I've never seen anything over 103C (ish) - stop and go traffic... Now under 100C = my mind is at rest!!!

And this is car at idle after a 30min drive, ac on, parked for 15min running (temperature ranges):

46808342964_9ce1496f91_z.jpg2019-04-03_06-36-30 by Duh_Vinci, on Flickr

47531989911_3cfc24eca5_z.jpg2019-04-03_06-35-23 by Duh_Vinci, on Flickr


So thanks to all for ACM suggestions, works, and hoping for similar results once summer gets here.

Regards,
D
 
Looking at it's operation, I see what you guys were talking about, its on most of the time, and I indeed hear that mile hummmm a little, but is is not annoying to me at all, particularly if it keeps the temps at bay...

I actually like the roar when taking off from stop light :)
 
Recent weather in NoVa has hit 100F with "feels like 105F" per Google weather. 1 hour drive in moderate city traffic, A/C at full power I'm seeing mostly 98-100C with highest of 103C briefly
 
Recent weather in NoVa has hit 100F with "feels like 105F" per Google weather. 1 hour drive in moderate city traffic, A/C at full power I'm seeing mostly 98-100C with highest of 103C briefly
I would say that is very very similar to what I see with my car. Temps get a bit more scary over there in the NoVa, than we Marylanders experience being on the water !
 
Could it be that Fan Clutch A1192000122 ist NLA from MB? I saw some Dealer Pages with "available" and some with "NLA" ?
 

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