Another E420 5.0 swap

[markland556]

Ive had this 94 E420 sitting around for a while with the intention to swap in a 5.0. Some late winter weather has pushed me to get this project going. I have a 119.970 thats been sitting around for some time as the perfect engine for this. I have seen comments regarding the oil pan and pump having to be swapped but im not too sure why. Unfortunately i never did look to closely at this engine until now and it had water sitting in it, so off to scrap she goes. The .970 seemed to be the most strait forward and easily replaceable block for this and ive sourced another.

I had some questions with the LH module, but gsxr mostly has answered them. Ill be pulling the 5.0 LH for the donor as well as the EZL. Swapping the short 2.24 diff is also on the list. I have been skimming over 2phast's list off diffs and seeing how close to a 2.82 I can get. Might be easier to get a 2.87 or 3.07. I know many of these swaps have been done and just wanted to share mine. Will post up some pictures.

 

[outrbnks]

I remember a few years back now, that someone had taken a white 400E and converted it into a 500E with the exception of the rear arches(I think).

If I remember correctly the owner has spent well over $20K to make the conversion at the time. The last I saw it was at a dealer and it sold for $6K I think.

It's probably still around some where. A great Idea to do this swap in a car built for the M119. Always wanted to do this with my 300CE, but that will never happen now.

Looking forward to your build pictures... Best

 

[gsxr]

The oil pan is shaped differently on the .970 (W140). The lower sump is in a different position (further back) and will not clear the W124 engine crossmember. The exhaust manifolds are different too (at least one of them). You can swap these pieces from the 4.2L engine.

The 2.87 and 3.07 diffs are the smaller/weaker 185mm and are not suitable for the M119 engine. You need a 210mm diff, and the housing needs to match your chassis (either ABS, or ASR) as the diffs are different for each. 2.65 is commonly available as a bolt-in from 1990-92 500SL (and ONLY those years). 2.82 is available from W140, 400SEL (only through 1994, or 1995). 3.06 is available from 91-92 300CE but only with ABS (non-ASR), as ASR versions are essentially impossible to locate. You could also get a 3.27 (again, non-ASR) from a 1990 300CE.

BTW, welcome aboard, and don't forget to share some photos as the project moves along!

 

[gerryvz]

Looking forward to hearing more about the project. Photos are always welcome, as well as in-depth discussion of the trials and tribulations you face in the process, as well as your success !!

Cheers,
Gerry

 

[a777fan]

The 2.87 and 3.07 diffs are the smaller/weaker 185mm and are not suitable for the M119 engine. You need a 210mm diff, and the housing needs to match your chassis (either ABS, or ASR) as the diffs are different for each.

Not to derail the intent of this thread, but since you brought it up Dave, in such wonderful detail... are the innards of all of the various diff options transferable between ABS and ASR cars? Or are the internals specific and not mixable between the cases?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[gsxr]

Not to derail the intent of this thread, but since you brought it up Dave, in such wonderful detail... are the innards of all of the various diff options transferable between ABS and ASR cars? Or are the internals specific and not mixable between the cases?

Most of the internals are the same between cases. The main difference is the case/housing itself, ABS has 1 sensor at the pinion/input shaft; ASR has 2 sensors (1 each at the axle/output shaft flanges). The axle/output flanges are also different. But the gears, carrier/diff, rear cover, input flange, etc are all the same stuff.

 

[markland556]

Just thought i would post an update. New engine is in, just finishing up the last details. Ill probably get her fired up next week if I can make some time. I still need to spend some time to come up with a new diff. Ive got a few parts cars, but not lucky enough to have anything that will work. The car is non-ASR so it should be pretty fun. If i can come up with a 2.65 diff I think all will be well with the 1st gear start. I havent really taken many pictures along the way, but here is one from a while back. Dont mind the gaudy wheels, still need to come up with a set of monoblocks.
Ill get some more pictures shortly.

 

[gerryvz]

That's awesome -- thanks for the update.

One important item to consider, since you have the engine out. Consider replacing the power steering long hose, which runs along the top of the frame rail on the driver's side, under a heat shield. This is nigh-impossible to get at and remove with the engine in the bay, but quite simple to do with the engine out of the car. It's not an expensive part and worth the 10 minutes to do. It's actually an excellent time to replace all of the hoses and soft parts underhood, as needed. Check them carefully for condition.

GXSR may also have some additional maintenance items to do in the engine compartment while it's out, based on his extensive experience.

 

[northNH]

As I’m sure GXSR is watching, and with all this diff info, seems like a reasonable place to wonder aloud,

I was planning on removing/refinishing/re-bushing-and-arming the rear subframe/diff carrier on my still-sweet DD 200K mile ‘92 ASR 300CE.
I’ve since obtained a ‘92 ASR 400 parts car with less than half that mileage with a rear setup clean enough to go in without the refinishing.
Obviously reinstalling my original 3.06 diff, will there be any incompatibilities with the 400 carrier i.e. are they the same 300CE vs. 400?
TIA

 

[gsxr]

NNH - assuming you swap diffs, the V8 subframe *should* bolt in to the coupe. At least, I'm not aware of any differences that would prevent it.

I think you'll need to swap the rear cover of the diff, as the mounts are not the same between 6cyl and V8. Might be something else I'm forgetting... don't often hear of subframe swaps.

 

[markland556]

The engine was dropped back into the car a few days ago. Getting all the last bits and pieces together right now. I have a 5.0 EZL from the donor W140, i also have a few LH's laying around. Im trying to decide what to try first for the LH. both 5.0 ones I have are ASR and this car is not. Doing an EEPROM swap is an option, but im not sure if anything bad will come of that. The cold start upshift delay relay will be removed. I guess i can try either of the LH's I have and see what happens.
Part numbers I have: 0135453832 and 0165451532

 

[gsxr]

The LH module doesn't care if the chassis has ASR or not. Just make sure you are using a T/LLR module for a non-ASR car.

Your 013- LH module may have WOT enrichment.

 

[markland556]

The car is finally all back together and running. Fuel rail we had put in was completely clogged and had me scratching my head for a bit. Swapped in another one, then a FPR and she came to life.
Now its time to start troubleshooting my high and erratic idle. ETA is an updated one, tried the 5.0 and 4.2 LH with the same effect. Idle at 1400 and a big dead spot in acceleration with random stalls while in gear at idle. Was thinking it was the ETA, the LH actual values show no change on R1 pot and the idle safety contact never switches on. Unfortunately i dont have an extra ETA that will work for this thing. Ive got some more poking around to do before i drop $200 on another one, but i guess at least im almost there.

Edit: the T/LLR module never left the car, so all should be good. Factory non-ASR.

 

[a777fan]

Congrats!

Make sure you've got your throttle linkage adjusted per the FSM. When mis-adjusted, the linkage can pull the pot off the idle switch, and cause a high idle like you are describing.

 

[markland556]

Linkage was adjusted. Adaptations cleared. Also forgot to mention she is running very rich right now, as indicated by the smoke out the back. I cant be sure what was going on with the car proior to me owning it as the engine was half torn apart with little to no explanation. I think i had the 4.2 LH in when she was sucking fuel through the FPR, so i might give that another try when i get a chance.

 

[gsxr]

The updated ETA's can fail too. Don Roden @ RFC Electronics will rebuild it for ~$300 and he may have one to send you, then you ship him your old one, if you don't want to wait for the turnaround.