FYI Difference between Genuine VS aftermarket NSS

[JC220]

Hi all, this thread is intended to show anyone how to identify a genuine Neutral Safety Switch VS an aftermarket item.

Given the genuine MB 500E NSS is recently NLA folks may need to consider thier options and choose carefully when purchasing from fleabay or other vendors.

You need to know what to look for to tell you if the part you receive is genuine MB or not.

Interestingly I panic bought two NSS off ebay in late Dec and one came in the MB packet whilst the other came bare with the MB star and part number ground off.

I bought a 3rd £12 NSS just for comparison purposes so you dont have to. From that I was able to ascertain with certainty that my second NSS is the genuine article

Genuine NSS in MB packet:



Note the quality control paint markings which match on the second NSS with markings ground off:



A genuine NSS should have these 2x paint QC markings.

Now compare a genuine item and aftermarket side by side:

(This is a 6 cylinder aftermarket NSS!)



Notice the following differences:

• Genuine part has a brown radial seal / bushing where the lever rotates. Aftermarket does not.
• Genuine Lever arm additionally has the code 29761 embossed in it. Aftermarket does not.
• The rubber inside the genuine switch lays flat, full coverage and has a talc like powder on it. Aftermarket is mall fitting, lifting and shiny black.
• General quality of housings is visually different in photos.
• Feel of the aftermarket part is VERY Poor. hardly moves, stiff and about to shatter its so hard to move. Notchy terrible feel to it. If it even works out of the box - it won't work for long trust me.
• Genuine part notably heavier in weight. If Gixer requires grams let me know.
• Pins missing from aftermarket -this is because it is the 6 cylinder version as Gixer mentions below.

AVOID ALL AFTERMARKET NSS's

 

[JC220]

For posterity here are photos of the genuine NSS I received in no MB bag with the part number and Star ground off.

Comparing this part to my genuine bagged switch it is identical and definitely came from the same factory.

I can only assume there is a limited aftermarket supply where this was re- boxed originally. The Ebay seller sent me the part less the box.

If any members do know for sure who the aftermarket reboxer of genuine NSS's is please share.

 

[gsxr]

Joe, the aftermarket NSS in your photos is for a 6-cyl car (E320, etc). It lacks the 2 extra pins which provide gear position information. It's the wrong part number. And as you explained, it appears to be junk, although it wouldn't affect engine operation... it only affects engine starting and backup lighting.

We need to get one of the correct part number aftermarket switches for comparison, designed for the 034/036 (and also 129/140 with LH-SFI). I think @Jlaa received one recently?

 

[Jlaa]

Joe, the aftermarket NSS in your photos is for a 6-cyl car (E320, etc). It lacks the 2 extra pins which provide gear position information. It's the wrong part number. And as you explained, it appears to be junk, although it wouldn't affect engine operation... it only affects engine starting and backup lighting.

We need to get one of the correct part number aftermarket switches for comparison, designed for the 034/036 (and also 129/140 with LH-SFI). I think @Jlaa received one recently?

Here is a genuine OE 036 NSS compared to a "New OE Supplier For Mercedes Benz" 036 NSS that I received. Both have a brown plastic ring and both have the Star and "Mercedes Benz" molded in plastic on the housing. The differences that I have noted are:

1) The OE one has the blue colored dots on the white part. The "New OE Supplier for Mercedes Benz" one does not.
2) The OE one has an additional number molded into the black plastic below the MB part number. The NOESfMB one not only has an additional part number, but also a logo that I do not recognize (see arrow)

 

[Vinnie]

Isn't the additional number on the "OE" (from MB Dealer) upside down, comparing to NOESfMB? Is it possible to look under the white plastic ring which covers the initial digits on the OE? Maybe there is also the same logo at the very beginning?

Anyway, they look quite similar to each other, and NOESfMB looks much more solid than the aftermarket one which JC220 shown in the initial post.

I just ordered two from Germany via eBay. My needs replacing, and the other one will be a spare. I'll see what will be in the package and share my remarks once it arrives (should be in 10-14 days).

 

[Jlaa]

Isn't the additional number on the "OE" (from MB Dealer) upside down, comparing to NOESfMB? Is it possible to look under the white plastic ring which covers the initial digits on the OE? Maybe there is also the same logo at the very beginning?

Anyway, they look quite similar to each other, and NOESfMB looks much more solid than the aftermarket one which JC220 shown in the initial post.

I just ordered two from Germany via eBay. My needs replacing, and the other one will be a spare. I'll see what will be in the package and share my remarks once it arrives (should be in 10-14 days).

Yes, the additional number on the OE switch is indeed upside down. Here it is:

 

[gsxr]

OMG! One of the crazy rare Inverted Jenny NSS's!

 

[Vinnie]

Yes, the additional number on the OE switch is indeed upside down. Here it is:

View attachment 129725

Thanks for the photos. Seems the logo might there, there something before the "04" digits.

I'm starting to feel as playing the "find <nn> differences between the two pictures" game

 

[Vinnie]

So mine arrived way ahead of time (delivered in just two days in international shipping from Germany to Poland), and here it is:



It looks exactly as the unit which @JC220 received, from the same ebay seller (carloxx24): the and "Mercedes-Benz" are ground off, but other than that it looks the same as the original @Jlaa 's unit: it has two quality marking dots and upside-down number It was wrapped just in a brown paper (and a shipping box) without original MB packing, but for 76 Euro / item I'm quite happy knowing that this is now NLA.

Just for the sake of completing the find <nn> differences game: JC and me have the following numbers on the rotating arm: 2 and 29761, while both Jlaa's have 1 and 29761. But that's just for fun.

If anyone still needs one (shipping cost may be too high for overseas shipping, but might be useful for European owners), here is link to the ebay offer: Carloxx24 NSS on ebay

It's the last unit, but it seems that they occasionally list some, so if this one is gone it may help to drop the seller a message and ask.

 

[rayhennig]

Maybe not relevant as this applies to my 722.5 box. I put an NSS into stock for the future. I Googled the MB number and found 95€ for genuine MB at my usual MB parts supplier. But also the same part for 60€ at - wait for it - Porsche. Same part, Porsche box. Should be alright.

RayH

 

[Jlaa]

Maybe not relevant as this applies to my 722.5 box. I put an NSS into stock for the future. I Googled the MB number and found 95€ for genuine MB at my usual MB parts supplier. But also the same part for 60€ at - wait for it - Porsche. Same part, Porsche box. Should be alright.

RayH

Awesome! What is the porsche part number? For a 928?

 

[rayhennig]

What is the porsche part number? For a 928?

This is the NSS I got. From the MB part number for my 300CE-24 with the 722.5 auto box:



Note MB on the part itself.


Does that answer?

I can't comment on 928s. But I did find this:

Porsche 928 Starter INTRLCK Switch. Transmission, Sensor - 0005454906 | Porsche Atlanta Perimeter - Monday-Friday 9am-5pm, Atlanta GA

Starter INTRLCK Switch. Transmission, Sensor, Range. Porsche 928. Genuine Porsche Part - 0005454906 (000-545-420-5, 928-613-601-00, 92861360100, 0005454205, 000-545-490-6). Ships from Porsche Atlanta Perimeter - Monday-Friday 9am-5pm, Atlanta GA

www.porscheatlantaperimeterparts.com

And this:

Switch 000-545-490-6 | Online Porsche Parts

Switch 000-545-490-6

www.onlineporscheparts.com

RayH

 

[gsxr]

That NSS may work for 6-cyl models, but the V8's have a different NSS with additional pins to send a position indicator to the E-GAS or T/LLR module.

 

[landspeed]

Sorry to bring this back from the dead. I am having issues passing my emissions inspection due to high idle and high HC. I don't have any codes for the NSS, but it shows a big (F) on the NSS status in the HHT display. Can the V8 NSS cause idle issues? Mine's only when engine is warm/hot.

 

[gsxr]

Sorry to bring this back from the dead. I am having issues passing my emissions inspection due to high idle and high HC. I don't have any codes for the NSS, but it shows a big (F) on the NSS status in the HHT display.

What happens when you move the gearshift through each position, and watch live data on HHT-Win? It should display each gear as you move the lever. Might need to try and take your NSS apart and clean the internal contacts, assuming it's adjusted correctly now.

Can the V8 NSS cause idle issues? Mine's only when engine is warm/hot.

The ONLY thing the NSS can do is cause a different idle speed than normal. Idle RPM's should be:

650-700rpm = P/N
500-550rpm = Any gear (any selection besides P or N)

I doubt this would cause emissions to fail though. High HC is generally due to the catalysts not being hot enough, or bad/failed cats. What's your HC reading, and did you do anything specific to heat the cats prior to arriving for the emissions test?

 

[landspeed]

The HHT just showed (F) in all positions, at least that's what I remembered.

I replaced the cat, and the engine was fully warmed prior to emissions test. I did have to wait for 45 min in line before the test. The 1st attempt was 450HC(at900rpm idle), and 2nd try after holding 2500rpm stationary, it was 250HC(at 1300rpm idle). This was the second time attempting the emissions test in a week. 1st time it failed at 900HC(with surging idle(800-1300rpm), and 236 HC after holding at 2500rpm. Max is 220HC.

When the engine is cool/cold, the idles are normal, no higher than 700 in park, and 500 in drive. When it's fully warmed up, park can be anywhere from 900-1100, and sometimes up to 1300rpm. But sometimes idle speed is normal when warm, it's inconsistent. I do have code 6 for idle speed control inop. I'm pretty sure the ETA is responsible for this, but I want to rule out any other causes.

It normally runs great, with only the failing transmission causing the most issue.

 

[gsxr]

900-1300rpm idle is WAY off. Something is wrong, and this is why you are seeing a fault code for ISC inop. Is your car a 500E or other M119 with ASR and E-GAS? Or is it a non-ASR car with T/LLR?

Either way, idle speed is controlled by the ETA and either E-GAS or T/LLR module. I'd also check for vacuum leaks - ideally with a smoke test.

Your HC numbers are way high. Either the new cats are undersized (doubtful) or they were not up to temperature... and/or, you have a rich mixture. Is your LH module and EPROM stock? I'd want to take a look at the MAF airflow readings too, for grins, to see if they are in the right ballpark.

I wouldn't bother getting another emissions test until you can get the idle speeds where they belong, at normal operating temp.

 

[landspeed]

I have a 93 400E, 208K miles, non-ASR. I did get a used LH while I was re-capping my original, and I don't recall if I reinstalled the original re-capped module. Same P/N LH, but I do not know if that one was chipped.

What MAF values do you want to see? just idle?

 

[gsxr]

Verify the re-capped module has a stock chip, and install that one (if not already in there).

Then you'll need to move on to fixing the wacky idle speed. Do you have a spare T/LLR module to swap in for testing?

 

[landspeed]

I do not have another T/LLR.

I will swap the LH tonight, and compare the MAF readings on each.

 

[landspeed]

This first image is in park. Second image in drive. The other 2 are just more info. Coolant temp about 50-60C. The recapped LH was already installed, and is what these images are from. I swapped in the spare LH, and the readings were similar. I have those images too if needed. The original, recapped LH appeared to have a stock chip, it had an off-white plastic cover that doesn't appear to have been removed before. I checked the spark plugs, and they are Bosch FR8DC, so I will get some F8DC soon. I gapped the FR8DC to 1mm, from 0.80mm. The NSS will indicate P, N, D, and 2, but only with the engine off.

 

[gsxr]

This first image is in park. Second image in drive. The other 2 are just more info. Coolant temp about 50-60C.

Everything looks pretty normal, other than the idle RPM at 550 is a bit low for Park. Still indicating an ISC issue with T/LLR or ETA.

The recapped LH was already installed, and is what these images are from. I swapped in the spare LH, and the readings were similar. I have those images too if needed. The original, recapped LH appeared to have a stock chip, it had an off-white plastic cover that doesn't appear to have been removed before.

Good - leave the recapped / stock LH module in there.

I checked the spark plugs, and they are Bosch FR8DC, so I will get some F8DC soon. I gapped the FR8DC to 1mm, from 0.80mm.

The resistor plugs should not cause any of the problems you currently have, but the proper F8DC4 are always a good idea (at 1mm gap).

The NSS will indicate P, N, D, and 2, but only with the engine off.

That's odd. The readings should be the same with engine off or running. This won't cause high HC or 1000rpm idle though. Worry about this after getting the ISC fixed.

 

[TerryA]

@landspeed,
Does Oregon require your emissions test to the specified RPMs be done on a roller OR just setting with no roller?

It makes a difference. California does not use the roller because it causes high emissions on the E500E.

Just trying to clarify Oregon’s Emissions Test.

 

[landspeed]

@landspeed,
Does Oregon require your emissions test to the specified RPMs be done on a roller OR just setting with no roller?

It makes a difference. California does not use the roller because it causes high emissions on the E500E.

Just trying to clarify Oregon’s Emissions Test.

Oregon is stationary, idle only test.

 

[landspeed]

Update!

Since I regapped the plugs, and swapped around LH modules, the idle has been more behaved than usual. I attempted another emission test, and it passed no problem, with 42HC.

Obviously I still need to address the idle/throttle, but the pressure is off now.

Thanks for the help.