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Electric car real cost comparision
- Thread starter Trae
- Start date
This discussion is about electric vs. gas powered cars however trucks must be considered in the discussion since nearly everything we use, consume, repair, and trade is enabled by them. Diesel powered trucks and the infrastructure that supports them are not going away anytime soon. Economies of scale push hard for continued diesel development. Bias here as well. My truck with 280,000 miles currently is the most easily and cheaply maintained vehicle I've ever owned.
drew
drew
Not to mention diesel-powered locomotives (trains) and JET-A powered aircraft.
And for the kind of money they command, it should do that and more....
I really liked the "Palo Alto Camry" analogy. Having lived in the Bay Area it was especially enjoyable to me.
Dan
And having lived in the neighboring town of Menlo Park for three years, and being in Redwood City on a monthly basis now, I can say that it is a very accurate and relevant observation.
San Bruno and later Montara, right across the PCH from the beach. A wonderful place that I still miss today....
Dan
I forwarded a link to this thread to a neighbor friend of mine who owns a Volt. Here is his response:
Alright, I don’t want to ruin the pooh-poohers party, but here are a few answers in response to the first comment based on my experience with a 2012 Chevy Volt:
1. It plugs into a basic (two prong) wall socket; I do not even have a dedicated circuit. Same plug as I’d use to plug in a toaster. Can’t speak to what would happen if, in my town, three more Volt’s were plugged, but my assumption is the writers analysis, though weighted down with numbers, is faulty.
2. Attached below is a picture (1 of 2) from this morning. On the left side of the photo is the battery range (37 miles). Varies between 33-40 depending on weather.
3. See also in the picture, in the middle: mileage, fuel used and MPG est (I reset each fill-up). Do the math for me on current MPG. Over the life of the vehicle (I can send that picture too), I’ve experienced ~150MPG.
4.a. The use case the writer portrays is asinine. If you need to drive 270 miles a day, this is not the right car for you (unless you like the style and features, like any car). However, I have driven to NY with it, and it took the same four hours as every other car and filled up the same amount as anyone else on the round trip.
4.b. The primary use case for this vehicle is commuting, which ABC News reports to be, for the average commuter in the US, 16 miles each way. Drive to work, possibly plug in; drive home, charge overnight. Repeat. I have gotten 2,000+ miles between fill-ups at best, and usually over 1,000 miles.
4.c. To that point, attached is a 2nd photo. This was taken upon parking my car at the client this am. Do the map math for distance of commute: home to downtown DC. The total range available after my drive in to the client decreased by less than the actual miles because the Volt is equipped with Kinetic Energy Recovery (KERS), braking recharges the battery. So you actually can get more than 1 mile of ride for 1 mile of mileage rating (of course, drive up a mountain, it is far less).
5. The cost per charge has been a $1/day increase in our utility bill.
6. Finally, I get that it took fossil fuels to build the car and fossil fuels generate the electricity that recharges the battery. I am neither a global warming crazy. Geopolitically, I find it crazy to be tied so unapologetically and unthinkingly to the Middle East. More importantly, I liked the car, it fits my use case and my dad was a GM scientist that worked on the electric vehicle program as far back as the 1970’s - I drove a prototype on a GM test track in 1985. I like the technology and believe combustion engines are inefficient and a dying technology. My next car, I hope, will be autonomous.
Alright, I don’t want to ruin the pooh-poohers party, but here are a few answers in response to the first comment based on my experience with a 2012 Chevy Volt:
1. It plugs into a basic (two prong) wall socket; I do not even have a dedicated circuit. Same plug as I’d use to plug in a toaster. Can’t speak to what would happen if, in my town, three more Volt’s were plugged, but my assumption is the writers analysis, though weighted down with numbers, is faulty.
2. Attached below is a picture (1 of 2) from this morning. On the left side of the photo is the battery range (37 miles). Varies between 33-40 depending on weather.
3. See also in the picture, in the middle: mileage, fuel used and MPG est (I reset each fill-up). Do the math for me on current MPG. Over the life of the vehicle (I can send that picture too), I’ve experienced ~150MPG.
4.a. The use case the writer portrays is asinine. If you need to drive 270 miles a day, this is not the right car for you (unless you like the style and features, like any car). However, I have driven to NY with it, and it took the same four hours as every other car and filled up the same amount as anyone else on the round trip.
4.b. The primary use case for this vehicle is commuting, which ABC News reports to be, for the average commuter in the US, 16 miles each way. Drive to work, possibly plug in; drive home, charge overnight. Repeat. I have gotten 2,000+ miles between fill-ups at best, and usually over 1,000 miles.
4.c. To that point, attached is a 2nd photo. This was taken upon parking my car at the client this am. Do the map math for distance of commute: home to downtown DC. The total range available after my drive in to the client decreased by less than the actual miles because the Volt is equipped with Kinetic Energy Recovery (KERS), braking recharges the battery. So you actually can get more than 1 mile of ride for 1 mile of mileage rating (of course, drive up a mountain, it is far less).
5. The cost per charge has been a $1/day increase in our utility bill.
6. Finally, I get that it took fossil fuels to build the car and fossil fuels generate the electricity that recharges the battery. I am neither a global warming crazy. Geopolitically, I find it crazy to be tied so unapologetically and unthinkingly to the Middle East. More importantly, I liked the car, it fits my use case and my dad was a GM scientist that worked on the electric vehicle program as far back as the 1970’s - I drove a prototype on a GM test track in 1985. I like the technology and believe combustion engines are inefficient and a dying technology. My next car, I hope, will be autonomous.
Wow.
He "gets it" ....but doesn't have a logical answer to it. Other than "I like the car" "it fits my use case" and "I'm emotionally attached to GM because my dad worked there."
Well, my dad worked for Weyerhaeuser Co. for 36+ years -- his entire career (and I worked there three summers during university). I guess that means I'm emotionally attached somehow to 2x4s, particle board, Douglas Fir trees, diapers and printer paper. I need to think deeper about all that....
All good, but doesn't refute in any way the facts that indeed electric/hybrid vehicles are NOT green in a cradle-to-grave context; NOT particularly easy nor convenient to operate over moderate to long distances; and are often, if not nearly always, purchased for emotional reasons because the owner wants desperately to believe they are "doing their part" for the environment.
I mean seriously, on a long trip, someone is going to equate their X-minute/hour electrical charge period (after sweating bullets to find a charge point), with my 10-minute gasoline fillup (and that's dilly-dallying around at the pump) to go another 300-400 miles?
I hate to say it, but oil is not the only reason that the US is "unapologetically and unthinkingly" tied to the Middle East. Anyone believing that Big Oil is the sole reason that the US cares about the Middle East is naiive/uninformed, to say the least. Other significant factors do exist, such as Islamic terrorism/fanaticism, Israeli affairs, and big-picture geo-political strategy, among others.
Happy that some look forward to the day that autonomous cars exist, and will buy one. I'll never, EVER buy an autonomous car. To me driving (even commuting, when I must) is fun and enjoyable, as is the overall experience of owning and operating my cars. Autonomy in the context of an automobile takes this fun away, and transforms cars into a faceless, joyless transportation utility service. Fortunately I'll be long dead before this transportation Utopia is foisted upon us.
No thanks.
Nobody, and I do mean NOBODY, in their right mind is going to recharge an EV(a true EV) via a 110v circuit on a daily basis. Something like a Tesla S might accrue 3-5 miles of range per hour. And a good portion of the energy going into the car will be consumed by the onboard systems keeping the battery conditioned during the charging process.
I laugh when I hear of people claiming that 110 charging is viable. Because it isn't. Unless you're retired and just need to run to SBUX once in a while.
And just for a real life data point... it takes between one and two hours to charge my wife's Porsche plug in on a Level 2 home charger. That's to get ~17 miles of range. The exact charge time varies by 100% due to a variety of factors, not just temperatures.
When we first bought the car, prior to running a decent circuit, it took 12-15 hours to charge.
I laugh when I hear of people claiming that 110 charging is viable. Because it isn't. Unless you're retired and just need to run to SBUX once in a while.
And just for a real life data point... it takes between one and two hours to charge my wife's Porsche plug in on a Level 2 home charger. That's to get ~17 miles of range. The exact charge time varies by 100% due to a variety of factors, not just temperatures.
When we first bought the car, prior to running a decent circuit, it took 12-15 hours to charge.
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A lot of strong criticisms about people who buy certain cars. What if they just like the car? Do they have to prove that they are motivated to buy it by environmental concerns and that an electric car actually is cleaner than an old Mercedes? Maybe let’s be ok with letting people buy and do what makes them happy even if we disagree.
Lots of people buy Bud Lite. I think it’s gross, but I’m not going to demand that they prove it tastes better than my favorite beer. And I’m not going to think that by buying it, they prove they are stupid or have ill-considered political beliefs.
I have no problem with a good debate about the actual environmental merits of electric cars. I agree with those here that their benefits are overrated. But some of the criticism is a little much IMHO. Or maybe I just need to sit down with one or three of my favorite beers and lighten up. Only one way to find out...
Lots of people buy Bud Lite. I think it’s gross, but I’m not going to demand that they prove it tastes better than my favorite beer. And I’m not going to think that by buying it, they prove they are stupid or have ill-considered political beliefs.
I have no problem with a good debate about the actual environmental merits of electric cars. I agree with those here that their benefits are overrated. But some of the criticism is a little much IMHO. Or maybe I just need to sit down with one or three of my favorite beers and lighten up. Only one way to find out...
Melville,
Well said. Cheers to that!
But I must say that the environmental cost of producing a light beer......
Kidding.
Cheers!
Well said. Cheers to that!
But I must say that the environmental cost of producing a light beer......
Kidding.
Cheers!
I think there is something to be said for investing into future technologies. I love my Hybrid Toyota Hylander for several reasons other than lifetime cost benefits or green considerations. Fact is, as recently as 15 years ago one could barely justify paying the premium for a household LED light bulb purely for its energy savings. Today however, with prices having come down drastically, selection and quality improvements, I don't think it is prudent to spend for an incandescent bulb that burns hot and consumes 7 times the energy for the same lumens output. The heat output of an incandescent alone will increase power consumption to run an AC system in the home or office. The more people get behind alternative techs the quicker the technology will come. Having said this I love my old cars like the rest of us here; I have 4 of them. I don't think it is an Either Or, but rather an AND. Both camps can exists.
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Speaking of that, I just stocked up on several dozen incandescent 150 watt bulbs on clearance at Lowes for $1 each because I refuse to pay a ridiculous price for an LED (Obama) bulb that in my experience doesn't last nearly as long and doesn't work nearly as well when installed in a work light or even an interior lamp. Green technology is farcical and has been pushed on us for mostly the wrong reasons. Just my 2 cents.
My experience with LED lighting has been quite the opposite. When I built this house almost 10 years ago, I specced halogen lighting. And so, this house was built with 167 recessed lights -- each one using a 50 Watt Ushio brand MR16 bulb. I am pretty picky when it comes to lighting --- no "crap name" light bulbs for me.
Always, as you can imagine, having 8350 watts of recessed lighting available to me made for a very bright, and very hot house --- but the lighting quality was really fantastic.
Last year I replaced nearly every one of the Ushio halogen bulbs with Hyperikon 7 watt LED MR16 retrofits. The beam pattern isn't quite as focused as a good 36* or 60* MR16 and the light quality has a tiny striations of yellow in it that most normal people wouldn't notice at all (I'm as OCD about lighting as I am about the schmutz on my W124's door hinges) but I'll be damned if the light output on modern day MR16 LED retrofits isn't A LOT brighter than 50W MR16 halogens. I was floored. The light output on these hyperikons are spectacular. And the color (when not trying to be be ultra OCD about it) is nearly indistinguishable from a good halogen.
And instead of making my house an oven with 8350 watts of halogen heat, I'm only consuming 1169 watts at full tilt boogie. And I never do that, because its just too bright. I wear my sunglasses at night.
Anyways, I just wanted to have an opportunity to use that lyric.
I’ve had mixed luck with green bulbs going out prematurely in the past. Of course they contain mercury and so in their disposal are worse for the environment than incandescents too.
My brand new Maryland home has mainly LED bulbs and they seem to be much better, and longer lasting, without the mercury hazard.
When I lived in Texas I bought up as many incandescents as I could when the forced phasing of the Obama-bulbs started coming into play.
Obama-bulbs, Obama-care, Obama-phones.....heh...
My brand new Maryland home has mainly LED bulbs and they seem to be much better, and longer lasting, without the mercury hazard.
When I lived in Texas I bought up as many incandescents as I could when the forced phasing of the Obama-bulbs started coming into play.
Obama-bulbs, Obama-care, Obama-phones.....heh...
I have remodeled after the Harvey fiasco (no real damage but took stock and remodeled anyway) and the house was built in 87. Every room had can lights, and I retrofit 30 cans with daylight dimmable LED, and went led with every candelabra style and lamp. I must say we got rid of the heat for sure, and we are light and as bright as we could possibly be without tearing off the roof. Very happy with the led - I think we may have 20 mercury squiggly spares or Obama lights.
I hate keeping this off topic, but had to share my $0.02:
The original green lights, the pigtailed CFC's, were awful. The PO of our house had installed quite a few and we just lived with them for years. When LED's came out they were better, but priced to the moon (read: unaffordable). Just in the past couple of years the price/performance of LED's has come down to the point where it's worth swapping out dead incandescents with LED. In the past year I've started installing some LED's and in general have been content with the results. My remaining gripes with LED is they do not fully dim like incandescent (major issue for me), require LED-compatible dimmer switches (nuisance/expense), and are not commonly available in as many wattages (at least at the big-box stores, HD/Lowes). Jury is out on lifespan, but assuming they are anywhere near rated hours, at current pricing it's still worth it IMO. This assumes you don't mind the "colors" available, and of course there are few if any decorative / antique-look LED's.
Flourescent-tube style shop light LED's are a separate discussion. They're still relatively expensive, and the light pattern is noticeably different compared to flourescent. And, per my wattmeter they don't save as much energy as the specs make it appear they should. And, retrofitting into existing fixtures is a mild PITA as it's best to bypass the ballast. I've only done a couple of my shop lights so far. I'll do more eventually, but I'm waiting for prices to drop further before I go there. They've already come down noticeably (~20%?) in the last year or so.
The original green lights, the pigtailed CFC's, were awful. The PO of our house had installed quite a few and we just lived with them for years. When LED's came out they were better, but priced to the moon (read: unaffordable). Just in the past couple of years the price/performance of LED's has come down to the point where it's worth swapping out dead incandescents with LED. In the past year I've started installing some LED's and in general have been content with the results. My remaining gripes with LED is they do not fully dim like incandescent (major issue for me), require LED-compatible dimmer switches (nuisance/expense), and are not commonly available in as many wattages (at least at the big-box stores, HD/Lowes). Jury is out on lifespan, but assuming they are anywhere near rated hours, at current pricing it's still worth it IMO. This assumes you don't mind the "colors" available, and of course there are few if any decorative / antique-look LED's.
Flourescent-tube style shop light LED's are a separate discussion. They're still relatively expensive, and the light pattern is noticeably different compared to flourescent. And, per my wattmeter they don't save as much energy as the specs make it appear they should. And, retrofitting into existing fixtures is a mild PITA as it's best to bypass the ballast. I've only done a couple of my shop lights so far. I'll do more eventually, but I'm waiting for prices to drop further before I go there. They've already come down noticeably (~20%?) in the last year or so.
I replaced my 4 tube fluorescents with LEDs last year. Had to switch out the ballasts (minor PITA) but really impressed with the increased light output.
I needed lights for my workbench so I got a couple of 4' two tube LED fixtures from Costco for $18 apiece. Wow do they put out the light, almost too much...
I needed lights for my workbench so I got a couple of 4' two tube LED fixtures from Costco for $18 apiece. Wow do they put out the light, almost too much...
My sole motivation for anything green is to save money. If it doesn't cost less and save money over the long haul why should I waste my time and money?
On a side note: Having spent most of the summer traveling around the Olympic Pennisula looking for our future home I noticed a high percentage of the liberals in Jefferson County drive Prius'. I have no problem with Prius but I also noticed, on the Pennisula, they also consistantly drive an average of 5 mph below the posted speed limit and about 25% drive ten mph below the speed limit and they brake to about 20 mph on all curves. I make the assumption they are liberals by the high percentage of Hillary bumper stickers. Just drive the damn speed limit!
[video=youtube;gXZeq9eXAys]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXZeq9eXAys&index=1&list=PLS5XPxnz4QPk1_Uc dp7KcasbYx7cnuhUL[/video]
On a side note: Having spent most of the summer traveling around the Olympic Pennisula looking for our future home I noticed a high percentage of the liberals in Jefferson County drive Prius'. I have no problem with Prius but I also noticed, on the Pennisula, they also consistantly drive an average of 5 mph below the posted speed limit and about 25% drive ten mph below the speed limit and they brake to about 20 mph on all curves. I make the assumption they are liberals by the high percentage of Hillary bumper stickers. Just drive the damn speed limit!
[video=youtube;gXZeq9eXAys]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXZeq9eXAys&index=1&list=PLS5XPxnz4QPk1_Uc dp7KcasbYx7cnuhUL[/video]
That shows that the area you are looking at is behind the times.
Where I'm at, the slow-eco drivers are now driving Leafs and 500es (Fiats) and other electric cars. Palo-Alto-Camry notwithstanding.
Folks driving a Prius go warp speed. This is because:
(a) Its a beater
(b) its cheap
(c) go ahead - see if I care if I prang up my Prius. If you want my lane, you're gonna have to hit me to get in the lane. You care about your car more than I care about my Prius.
Today, on the drive down from Anaheim to San Diego, I saw about 5 Tesla Model S's. They actually look pretty nice.
Yes, let’s chill on the political generalizations & assumptions.
PeachParts is an EXCELLENT forum if y’all want to debate other Benz owners on some pretty fiery political topics & test those assumptions you may have.
From what I’ve seen, Tesla drivers generally tend to go the speed limit or above. My next door neighbor has a Model 3. Not my cup of tea. I actually don’t know how much longer Tesla is going to be around given the ongoing shenanigans of its founder and CEO. Seems he’scoming fallin' apart at the seams.
[video=youtube;wgEOtCJwQsY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgEOtCJwQsY[/video]
PeachParts is an EXCELLENT forum if y’all want to debate other Benz owners on some pretty fiery political topics & test those assumptions you may have.
From what I’ve seen, Tesla drivers generally tend to go the speed limit or above. My next door neighbor has a Model 3. Not my cup of tea. I actually don’t know how much longer Tesla is going to be around given the ongoing shenanigans of its founder and CEO. Seems he’s
[video=youtube;wgEOtCJwQsY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgEOtCJwQsY[/video]
https://www.independent.co.uk/voice...-paris-agreement-global-warming-a8573811.html
Anyone saw this with call to switch to fully electric....
Anyone saw this with call to switch to fully electric....
LOL. I saw that clickbait headline earlier today. A bunch of sites are parroting the same story:
"Terrifying climate change warning: 12 years until we’re doomed"
https://www.foxnews.com/science/terrifying-climate-change-warning-12-years-until-were-doomed
"We have 12 years to limit climate change catastrophe, warns UN"
https://www.theguardian.com/environ...-must-not-exceed-15c-warns-landmark-un-report
Meterologists can't accurately predict the weather next week, but "scientists" are certain we're all doomed in 12 years?
Apparently there was a similar dire prediction 6 years ago (not sure of the target date though). Wish I could find a larger version of that comic:
https://kellydog.blogspot.com/2012/07/were-doomed_19.html
Attachments
The media is trying to convince us…. I am not entirely convinced electric is the way forward for the same reasons others have stated here already. I am concerned for my classic fleet though.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-45786690
If these electric cars take over in years to come ( 5, 10 or 15 years time- which is appears they inevitably will) will the internal combustion engine end up getting taxed to oblivion or banned from use on public roads?
Will gas stations vanish as the revenue from fuel sales drops off – thus supply for classics could be problematic too? I’m thinking of a mad max type scenario here
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-45786690
If these electric cars take over in years to come ( 5, 10 or 15 years time- which is appears they inevitably will) will the internal combustion engine end up getting taxed to oblivion or banned from use on public roads?
Will gas stations vanish as the revenue from fuel sales drops off – thus supply for classics could be problematic too? I’m thinking of a mad max type scenario here
Asimov saw all this coming in the 1940s. Pretty amazing. The Will Smith flick was good also, IMHO
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/I,_Robot
87 300TD om606 compound turbo
94 e420
85 300tdt
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/I,_Robot
87 300TD om606 compound turbo
94 e420
85 300tdt
it's here.
Up close with the Taycan, Porsche’s first electric car
It’s unsurprisingly a stunner
www.theverge.com
it's here.
Up close with the Taycan, Porsche’s first electric car
It’s unsurprisingly a stunner
Massive fail by Porsche.
We're still waiting on a fix for my wife's Panamera which is supposed to be parked outside because of fire risk.
I learned an expensive lesson with the e-Hybrid... step 1, spend $120K on a commuter car. step 2 watch it depreciate like no other car on earth.
NFW am I paying $175K for Porsche's first electric car. NFW. It took them over a year to get the bugs worked out of our first year plug in Panamera, and that was on an existing platform.
I would say, that in the US, the Tesla is still the better buy????
Ace,
I drive the 405 freeway everyday in LA. A long time 33 mile one way commute. Recently cut to 22 miles to new office. Anyway I don’t have an EV so no HOV lane for me.
On most days on the 405 I can pick a Tesla out one stay within 5 minutes of it. On my afternoon commute out of the 33 mile commute I stayed ahead of the EV I had picked out that day.
Point being in SoCal the HOV lane is usually packed bumper to bumper and the people (I’m being nice calling them people) in it can’t see the forest thru the trees. They can make better time outside of the HOV lane.
To me an EV just to use the HOV lane is total waste of my hard earned $$$.
Say what you will but this is my last $0.02 on this issue.
lol
Get your vintage Beetle converted to an EV:
Volkswagen Will Now Convert Classic Beetles To Electric Power Which Is Maybe Even Better Than A New EV Beetle
That actually looks pretty reasonable for a conversion.
Dan
Volkswagen Will Now Convert Classic Beetles To Electric Power Which Is Maybe Even Better Than A New EV Beetle
That actually looks pretty reasonable for a conversion.
Dan
Yeah. I think it's harder to get right than it would seem. Battery and motor cooling being a challenge.
Tesla is light years ahead on this stuff. They even patented a better design for motor winding that gives them an extra few percent efficiency. When they integrate the dry anode and capacitor stuff from that Maxwell outfit they are going to have yet another advantage. Smarty pants greenies.
Diesel powered cars manufacturing is dropping.
Will the EV, one day be the diesel car of yesteryear?
Meaning, that while the electric car might not take over the gas vehicle market, it might have its fair share of the market?
Or are EV's going to take over the market?
Will the EV, one day be the diesel car of yesteryear?
Meaning, that while the electric car might not take over the gas vehicle market, it might have its fair share of the market?
Or are EV's going to take over the market?
EVs wil eventually dominate the market. They are quicker, quieter, and smoother than ICE cars. Already we have 300 mile range models out there, range anxiety isn’t really an issue anymore. And with faster and faster chargers available, it’s just not an issue and will only get better.
It's going to be many decades before EVs (or whatever they evolve into) become dominant in the market. There are just too many ICE cars and related infrastructure, and commercial inertia for ICEs to go away in the next ten, or even 20 or 30, years.
Despite improvements in various aspects/facets, Hybrids and EVs have not caught on like they were predicted to in the past. I do see a lot of them on the road in California, but not elsewhere.
The other factor is collectors and older cars. The owners of them will not let them go away, and laws will accommodate older cars -- particularly ones will collector value.
Self-driving cars? We will definitely see that in the next 10-20 years, no question. Self-driving EV cars? For sure.
But you'll never ever -- EVEN ONCE -- see me in a self-driving car. I value the act of driving too much. Fortunately I've only got 25-30 years left on this earth, so I'll never have to give up my "manual" driving cars, and I'll always have gas-powered cars.
Despite improvements in various aspects/facets, Hybrids and EVs have not caught on like they were predicted to in the past. I do see a lot of them on the road in California, but not elsewhere.
The other factor is collectors and older cars. The owners of them will not let them go away, and laws will accommodate older cars -- particularly ones will collector value.
Self-driving cars? We will definitely see that in the next 10-20 years, no question. Self-driving EV cars? For sure.
But you'll never ever -- EVEN ONCE -- see me in a self-driving car. I value the act of driving too much. Fortunately I've only got 25-30 years left on this earth, so I'll never have to give up my "manual" driving cars, and I'll always have gas-powered cars.
Has this ever happened to you? It’s Sunday evening and you’re watching TV, relaxing with the family and suddenly remember that you need gas to get to work in the morning? You can either go get gas or get up a little early in the morning and fill up before work.
With an EV, you’re probably already plugged in.
With an EV, you’re probably already plugged in.
I think it is a matter of price and infrastructure.
If the price of a DD EV model were the same price as a Corolla, people might be more apt to start buying the EV.
Infrastructure...I don't see huge challenges.
I work near a Tesla repair and maintenance facility and the only thing that goes thru my mind, I wish the cost benefit analysis was such that I could justify a purchase.
If the price of a DD EV model were the same price as a Corolla, people might be more apt to start buying the EV.
Infrastructure...I don't see huge challenges.
I work near a Tesla repair and maintenance facility and the only thing that goes thru my mind, I wish the cost benefit analysis was such that I could justify a purchase.
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Gerry, watch out for this guy in your neighborhood... link courtesy of Sixto:
Yes, yes I do. I'd feel better about a guy sleeping in a car with autopilot, than I would about some dimwit fiddling with their phone in a car without it.That was on the news last night. And you think people distracted on their mobular phones are bad?
The problem is that autopilot is "not there" yet, and imperfect. And honestly, not designed to be an autopilot/fully autonomous. Perhaps in the future.
But I think I'd rather have someone paying partial attention and fiddling with their phone/radio than NO attention totally asleep at the switch. Sometimes, a little is better than NONE. But overall, I agree that phone users are roughly equivalent to a moderately impaired drunk driver.
But I think I'd rather have someone paying partial attention and fiddling with their phone/radio than NO attention totally asleep at the switch. Sometimes, a little is better than NONE. But overall, I agree that phone users are roughly equivalent to a moderately impaired drunk driver.
Oh, I'm not at all implying the "autopilot" function is anywhere near autonomous, nor am I crazy about the technology.
But given a choice, I'd take the former over the latter. The autopilot car will at least apply full braking when approaching a stopped vehicle (or other fixed object) while moving at high speed. A muppet playing with their phone will do nothing except wonder why there's suddenly an airbag in their face.
This is getting off topic, but there have been multiple studies which have shown that even HANDS FREE phone use is equivalent to drunk driving, as measured by reaction times. Hands-on, texting, or browsing is even worse. Nobody, I mean nobody, wants to admit this because everyone wants to use their phone behind the wheel. And insist they are capable of doing so safely, while nobody else can. Look at how many decades it took for DUI to become socially unacceptable. Phones are still new enough that it may take a decade or two more before a similar stigma is the norm (in USA).
But given a choice, I'd take the former over the latter. The autopilot car will at least apply full braking when approaching a stopped vehicle (or other fixed object) while moving at high speed. A muppet playing with their phone will do nothing except wonder why there's suddenly an airbag in their face.
This is getting off topic, but there have been multiple studies which have shown that even HANDS FREE phone use is equivalent to drunk driving, as measured by reaction times. Hands-on, texting, or browsing is even worse. Nobody, I mean nobody, wants to admit this because everyone wants to use their phone behind the wheel. And insist they are capable of doing so safely, while nobody else can. Look at how many decades it took for DUI to become socially unacceptable. Phones are still new enough that it may take a decade or two more before a similar stigma is the norm (in USA).
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