Engine oil recommendations

[Sarkisv]

I had a collapsed lifter on my M119.982 and nothing in liquid form I poured into the engine made a difference.

I did take the opportunity to replace the plastic oiler tubes with metal ones from an earlier car.

Did the ticking start as soon as you started the car?

 

[R129 UK]

Did the ticking start as soon as you started the car?

Yes, it was present when the engine was both hot and cold.

 

[Sarkisv]

What year is your car/engine? If the oil tubes are plastic, you need to pull the valve covers and inspect them first, especially if you've never had the valve covers off before. Also inspect the chain rails while it's open. M119 lifters do not "gum up" and rarely cause ticking noises when all the oiler tubes are intact.

1999 S500. I removed the passenger side valve cover 16 years ago. None of the plastic oiler tubes needed to be replaced but i replaced them anyway. The driver's side is untouched. Ticking coming from both sides. There is no ticking at idle with LM Leichtlauf High Tech 5W-40. I added LM MoS2 & LM Lifter additive. i don't recommend either. i think the MoS2 clogged something in the engine because it jolted the engine at initial start up. I drained it and filled Motul 8100 10W-60. Ticking got much worse. Drained that and filled LM Touring High Tech Diesel 15W-40. Less ticking than with the Motul but more ticking that with the Leichtlauf. That's why i think it's gummed up lifters and not oiler tubes

 

[gsxr]

16 years! You are overdue to pull both valve covers and inspect all the timing chain rails. And, also check all the oil tubes. Don't be surprised to find some broken chain rails that need to be replaced.

It's unlikely the MoS2 clogged anything. Don't use any "flush" products.

If all oil tubes are good, then I'd pull all four camshafts and see if any lifters have failed / collapsed.

 

[Sarkisv]

What year is your car/engine? If the oil tubes are plastic, you need to pull the valve covers and inspect them first, especially if you've never had the valve covers off before. Also inspect the chain rails while it's open. M119 lifters do not "gum up" and rarely cause ticking noises when all the oiler tubes are intact.

I replaced the chain rail on the passenger side when I was in there 16 years ago. It was fine but I replaced it anyway. Eventually i need to open the driver's side but based on the intermittent ticking, i believe it's lifters. I'm thinking about trying Motul 300V. I'm making these oil companies right and myself poor at the same time

 

[R129 UK]

If all oil tubes are good, then I'd pull all four camshafts and see if any lifters have failed / collapsed.

You don’t need to remove the camshafts, you can progressively turn the engine via the 27mm socket on the crankshaft pulley to “free” each lobe and check the operation of each lifter. I used a wooden chopstick to push down on each lifter to find the offending one.

 

[Sarkisv]

People have removed, cleaned and replaced the faulty lifters. I was hoping to accomplish that with all the oils i poured in there. lol

 

[Sarkisv]

You don’t need to remove the camshafts, you can progressively turn the engine via the 27mm socket on the crankshaft pulley to “free” each lobe and check the operation of each lifter. I used a wooden chopstick to push down on each lifter to find the offending one.

Is it difficult to remove the camshafts to replace the lifters? I have a friend who used to be a technician. he said he wouldn't take on that task.

 

[Sarkisv]

16 years! You are overdue to pull both valve covers and inspect all the timing chain rails. And, also check all the oil tubes. Don't be surprised to find some broken chain rails that need to be replaced. It's unlikely the MoS2 clogged anything. Don't use any "flush" products.

If all oil tubes are good, then I'd pull all four camshafts and see if any lifters have failed / collapsed.

Sounds like a lot of work removing camshafts. Eventually, i need to go in there.

 

[gsxr]

Sounds like a lot of work removing camshafts. Eventually, i need to go in there.

Yeah, it's a fair amount of work, but not terrible. You can leave the sprockets attached to 3 of the 4 which simplifies things. Only need to do this if you find all 16 oil tubes are intact. There's still a chance you will find one or more popped oil tubes. The lifters may be quiet when cold even with a popped tube.

 

[Sarkisv]

Yeah, it's a fair amount of work, but not terrible. You can leave the sprockets attached to 3 of the 4 which simplifies things. Only need to do this if you find all 16 oil tubes are intact. There's still a chance you will find one or more popped oil tubes. The lifters may be quiet when cold even with a popped tube.

Thank you for the advice gentlemen

 

[szvook]

How's the Motul 300v 5W-40 working for you?

I have switched to Motul 300v 15W-50 Competition and it’s working fine. With the 5W-40 oil, I noticed that the oil pressure was a tad lower than I preferred on very hot days.

 

[Sarkisv]

I have switched to Motul 300v 15W-50 Competition and it’s working fine. With the 5W-40 oil, I noticed that the oil pressure was a tad lower than I preferred on very hot days.

May i ask where you buy it?

 

[szvook]

May i ask where you buy it?

I used to get it from Stokes Tire Service in Santa Monica. But now my service shop gets it for me.

 

[bgalakazam]

Thanks to Gerry and the thread I decided to move to the Delo 400 15W-40 for my M104 (went with the XSP synthetic since car has been using synthetics in the past). I used 10W-40 in my M119 and M113 before. When I got the car and the two oil changes in Germany (to include the one that was done with the head gasket reseal), the Germans put 5W-40 (Liqumoly and Addinol last ones). Weather was milder, rarely below 0 C unlike here in Colorado. Last change was Dec 2024 2,000km ago. I probably would have went longer, but wanted to make the switch to 15W-40.

I did notice with each change, the filters were in pretty bad shape. 2 Mann's, 1 Mahle, 1 Bosch. I probably won't be driving the 5,000 miles a year so I might just keep an eye on the filter and replace it annually. Mann is like $9.

Question is should I run the $50 oil analysis on the most recent 5W-40 I took out (2,000km 1yr 2mo) after the fresh head gasket and timing chain tensioner replacement? The mechanics didn't find anything wrong and only suggested the tensioner since they had the engine open.

 

[gsxr]

If you've never had UOA (Used Oil Analysis) and it's an engine you are about, it wouldn't hurt to get one for grins. Generally you only bother with UOA if you are concerned about a specific problem (excess wear metals, contamination from coolant) OR you are attempting extended drain intervals and want to make sure the TBN isn't getting too low at your target interval.

Anyway. You could use the WIX analysis kit for half the price... link. You pay to ship the sample in, it isn't prepaid. Blackstone is nice but they are expensive, although the personalized comments and "universal averages" can be helpful if you don't understand what you are looking at.

BTW - samples sent in for UOA should either be collected when warm or hot, as the oil is being drained, OR pulled from the sump via the dipstick tube using a pump like this. If you already drained the oil into a container, the sample may not be valid, especially if the container wasn't clean (i.e., may have residue from other drained oil in the past).

 

[geraniumtr]

Dave, surprised you didn’t mention there wasn’t a need to replace the tensioner on his M104 motor plus the engine doesn’t need to be ’open’ to replace it as his mechanic stated.
Anyway on my 330K mile E320 I use conventional 10W-40 with 3K change intervals including filter. Never any issues. I will note I’ve never done an oil analysis.

Regards,

Peter

 

[gerryvz]

The timing chain tensioner on an M104 is a pretty simple and bulletproof device that doesn't really ever wear out. You MUST be careful when RE-installing an M104 tensioner after removing it, because it uses a ratcheting spring mechanism internally that holds its position. You have to completely disassemble the tensioner (easy to do) and then re-assemble it, and then install it. If you re-install an M104 chain tensioner without disassembling and resetting it, it is almost a certainty that you will snap one of your camshafts. We have had members here on the forum who did not do this, and, yes, snapped a cam.

The M117 and M119 timing chain tensioners are of a completely different design, and rely partially on oil circulation/pressure, with no "ratcheting" action to keep the tensioner at.

The Diesel-rated 15W-40 motor oils (Shell Rotella, Chevron DELO 400, etc.) are all excellent options for the M104, but a stronger consideration should be the viscosity of the oil based on the climate where you live and where the engine will be operated. If you live in climates that get much below freezing in the winter, and intend to operate the engine in those conditions, 15W-40 would be about the thickest oil I would go. I would consider 10W-40 for more northern climes and freezing-weather operation, as this is a bit thinner and better on the engine for cold winter starts. The 15W-40 would be fine for southern and western US climes.

I have continued to use 15W-40 here in Maryland, in the 8.5 years I've lived here, but I don't operate my M104 very often, if ever, in sub-freezing temperatures. Same with my M117, which I use 20W-50 grade oil in. It ONLY gets driven in temperatures that are above 45-50F, which is just fine for a thicker oil like a 20W-50, which the M117 just loves.

I would NOT go below a 5W oil for the M104 or M119 (you could perhaps go up to -50 in hotter climes), and I would NOT go below a 10W oil for the M117.

 

[gerryvz]

Question is should I run the $50 oil analysis on the most recent 5W-40 I took out (2,000km 1yr 2mo) after the fresh head gasket and timing chain tensioner replacement? The mechanics didn't find anything wrong and only suggested the tensioner since they had the engine open.

I do an oil analysis on every car I own, at every oil change. I realize this is probably overkill, but I enjoy data, and I enjoy monitoring what's in the oils removed from my engines.

The real benefit of doing these analyses is really reaped over time, when you have multiple oil changes under your belt. Then you can see any changes or patterns in wear-related metals in the oil. These patterns are where you really identify any issues.

Here is the latest analysis I had done, which was late last year when I did my own first oil change on my 2007 E63 AMG. Also an analysis on my G-wagen's M104.

 

[gsxr]

Dave, surprised you didn’t mention there wasn’t a need to replace the tensioner on his M104 motor plus the engine doesn’t need to be ’open’ to replace it as his mechanic stated.

Peter, you are right! I misread his post and thought the work was already completed. If the work isn't done yet, then yes, no point in replacing the tensioner unless damaged (which is unlikely). The tensioner is not a "while you are in there" replacement item on the M104/M119/M120 engines.

Re-reading the post, I'm still unclear if the head gasket job was already done, or if it's planned for the future.

 

[bgalakazam]

The head gasket job was done, along with some other seals while I was still in Germany. Thanks, I'll send it to get a baseline. Car is 184k km and I would keep it. It's garaged and driven only when warm, so I'll stick to the 15W-40 going forward. Days below 0C in the springs are rare due to the constant sun.

 

[bgalakazam]

Attaching report. Any reason for concerns or are the high values probably due to recent job? No strange noise, engine is very smooth (even more so after going with the 15W-40). Air filter is 2yrs and 2,000km old. No leaks, shakes, hesitation, etc.

 

[gsxr]

Attaching report. Any reason for concerns or are the high values probably due to recent job? No strange noise, engine is very smooth (even more so after going with the 15W-40). Air filter is 2yrs and 2,000km old. No leaks, shakes, hesitation, etc.

Numbers look fine. See what the next analysis shows. You can go much longer than 2000 km's! The oil was still new.

 

[Sarkisv]

YUP! That is what I use in all my Mercedes engines, gas & diesel. Good stuff. I buy from Summit Racing or Jegs in 4-gallon cases, even better when they have a coupon of some sort off $xxx purchase. For a low-use car, 5kmi over several years is fine, and the UOA confirms it.

The jpg doesn't appear. What Brand and weight of oil?

 

[R129 UK]

The jpg doesn't appear. What Brand and weight of oil?

There’s a site-wide issue with images and attached files at the moment. It will be fixed.

 

[gsxr]

The jpg doesn't appear. What Brand and weight of oil?

I am using Red Line 10W-40 in most cars that I care about. The beaters get Mobil-1.

10W40 Motor Oil

Popular for medium and heavy-duty gasoline engines in light trucks

www.redlineoil.com

 

[3300-500E_JP]

Hello,

I use Moty's 15W-50. Japan is hot.