Wooden Trim.

[036]

Let´s discuss it here- prices, pics of restoration, your whishes and notes.
To be short- i´m still looking for a Master, who could manage not only wishfull colour and "mirror" finishing, but also able to make a sharp "factory like" corners.
What i mean is- first 2 pics- new OEM part, bought week ago.
Rest are restored trims, which ( i´m sorry to say) i don´t like at all- corners are just not there..
My wooden trim was done a bit better, but still now i see some places were it had to be done better. Anyway, within week i´m going to meet another Master, i´ll give him one piece of trim from an old 124, for trial.
Results i´ll post here.

 

[jhodg5ck]

Madera is the best I've found state side. The first pieces they did for me didn't have Quite the crispness I was looking for, but they re-did the work free of charge to the level I was looking for. Heritage just made a mess of the wood I sent them, even after sending it back for a 2nd try.

They will book match and use a clear that is superior to the stuff MB originally used, far more resistant to cracks/fading etc.

Madera website:
http://maderaconcepts.com/NewSite/VehiclePages/mercedes_benz.htm


Jonathan

 

[036]

Concerning my wooden trim- as said, it´s one of the best restorations i saw, but not flowless

 

[gsxr]

Some of the wood pieces can be purchased new for a similar cost to refinishing... if you're not picky about having the exact original wood, or keeping all the color/grain identical, it can be easier (and sometimes cheaper) to just buy new. This varies depending on the wood piece in question though.

 

[036]

Madera website:
http://maderaconcepts.com/NewSite/VehiclePages/mercedes_benz.htm

I don´t see detailized pictures, i don´t see corners

 

[gsxr]

"Corners" are due to the wood being finished without holes, then they use a router to create the holes after the clearcoat is applied.

I'm not sure you'll get the sharp corners you want unless you buy a new piece? Maybe Jono can shed some light on this.

 

[036]

Some of the wood pieces can be purchased new for a similar cost to refinishing...

No, it is not true. I prefer to spent around 600-700 on complete restoration, as to pay around 2026 Euro plus tax by MB, and that will be a Mosaique...

 

[gsxr]

I don´t see detailized pictures, i don´t see corners

Dude, contact them directly, don't ask us. Maybe they will do custom work with special corners.

No, it is not true. I prefer to spent around 600-700 on complete restoration, as to pay around 2026 Euro plus tax by MB...

Example: E500 shift console wood p/n 124-680-92-17 is $225 USD plus shipping from parts.com, compared to ~$250 USD plus shipping for refinishing. So what I said is true, some pieces are cheaper to buy new than to have refinished. Of course buying EVERY PIECE OF WOOD IN THE CAR brand new will probably cost more than refinishing them. However that is not what I said.

 

[gerryvz]

A couple of years I priced out a complete set of wood for my 1989 560SEC. I think it came out to just about $3,000. This is quite a bit more money than it would cost to have the existing wood refinished to an equal or higher standard by Madera.

According to multiple MB friends I've known over the years (and work I've seen done), Jono's comments (with regard to "new" MB wood, used by MB since model year 1973 starting with the W116) are accurate with regard to using Heritage Woodworks in North Carolina. Heritage is really more of an expert on older MB wood, used up to and including model year 1972 on the W108/109 and perhaps for a few years after that on the 114/115, not so much on the urethane-coated MB wood used since 1973.

Madera really is the way to go for the modern-era MB wood refinishing. 036, why don't you just call or email Tony there?!?

Cheers,
Gerry

 

[jhodg5ck]

the last pieces Madera did for me had very nice/crisp corners around the various switch openings. Per my previous post, the 1st set they did for me were so-so, but a phone call/shipment back and everything came back Great. Been that way ever since. perhaps they were having an off day, IDK.

Indeed, some pieces for the 124 are cheaper then re-finishing..not so much on the SEC's.

If you want book matched/hand picked superb looking wood, Madera can accommodate you..

 

[DarkStar]

I plan to have a few pieces redone by Madera. I tried Heritage, but was not happy with the overall finish, customer service was poor and the pieces they restored cracked within a couple of years. Not money well spent.

 

[036]

the last pieces Madera did for me had very nice/crisp corners around the various switch openings.

Pics would say more than a lot of words

 

[500AMM]

Arkady,

What about the quality Bernard offers on refurbished trim? We've commented his steep prices before, but the quality looks good IMO. He could even offer a change in color, from brown to grey. Do you know who's his vendor?

I inquired for a complete set of Bird's Eye Maple (BEM) from Bernard, but I guess the prices was based on the fact that some of the BEM trims are NLA, especially the trim over the clima automatic. (I've bought some new OEM panels on Ebay - 8 hole Clima panel, gear panel and the two ashtray panels, so it's good a start.)

 

[036]

Arnt, i didn´t contact Brenard about trim- i´m looking for someone cheaper and in the area, he is too far away. Soon i´ll tell you if i found one

 

[Christian_K]

About what Bernard you talk? "Large-Displacement-Bernard"?
036, so complete would-trim redone was 600-700€?

Will the whole wood actually be replaced or will he just grind-of the whole couple clearcoat-layers and spray them new with ~10layers of tinted clear-coat, like some german W125 DIY guys have done?
Like here (bottom of the page): http://w126-archiv.mercedesforen.de/index.php/Holzverkleidungen_reparieren

He described it that he almost entirely grinded all clearcoat away until the clearcoat cracks were gone, then he always sprayed 2-3 layers of clear, sanded it and repeated the procedure. At the end it was polished with car polish (cut-polish with abrasives)

Here is another DIY guide: http://www.autoschrauber.de/content/000338/holz-mercedes-interieur-lackieren-aufarbeiten.php
He advises to use "paint stripper" to get the old clear-coats off, as this wont damage the wood under it. Then use brown tinted clear-coat and respray it. Lot of work, but saves you big bucks.
At point 10 it even shows how to fully re-do it.

 

[036]

036, so complete would-trim redone was 600-700€? Will the whole wood actually be replaced or will he just grind-of the whole couple clearcoat-layers and spray them new?

Yes. It was 3 years ago.
And- every "case" is different, so it is impossible to call any fixed price.
Yes, we are talking "just" about renewing a clearcoat ( on a first hand it´s a looot of polishing after respraying). 99% it is only a clearcoat damage, no deep cracks.
But if you wish to change furnier itself it´ll be more expensive, you know why. I´ll tell you exact price of this also a bit later.

As said earlier, i´m going to report about a new project. Today i gave away for work a typical 20 years old set of wooden trim from 93 E500. Typical- i mean all the cracks, 3-4 different colours ( thank you sun....), many deep scratches and so on. This damage is not possible to repair only by polishing.
As soon as i get some pieces done- pics and prices will appear here.

PS Links you gave are interesting read, and only.
As it would be possible for someone who has no knowledge about engines to rebuilt an M119 just with some paper Instruction.

 

[Jelmer]

Especially note the color difference between the wooden door trim. I saw them today as well, and in real life the difference appeared even bigger than here. Can't wait for the results

 

[036]

Especially note the color difference between the wooden door trim. I saw them today as well, and in real life the difference appeared even bigger than here. Can't wait for the results

Two more pics to underline Jelmers impression.
I´m thrilled too, never worked with this guy before.

 

[DarkStar]

I was playing with a console from a 450SL (Zebrano wood) last night. The pieced had 100+ cracks in the clear coat, some had actually flaked off and was missing. It appears the color is not in the wood but rather in the clear. I think I can get a urethane tinted at Lowes or Home Depot.

I tried to sand thru the cracks of clear coat using a 220 disk on an orbital sander, it took a while, the stuff is thick !
I also tried a Jasco stripper....didn't have any effect on the coating....I was amazed! That stuff is wicked and has stripped everything I have ever tried to strip.
So I guess I continue to sand or look for another stripper...any suggestions on what to use?

 

[DarkStar]

I also did some work on the AC surround, used superglue to fill some cracks, then sanded everything with 600 grit, thru 2000....just need to polish next. I have had good success with this process before on burl wood with my 500E, was not sure if the Zebrano was going to work the same. So far so good.

 

[036]

Piiiiics!!!!!

 

[Christian_K]

Yes, i've read also a bit further about it. There are guys in german Motor-Talk forums which repaired cracks in their W220 Wood, by cleaning them, degrease them and filling the cracks by a syringe with 100% clear resin. The same kind of resin you use, when you do glass-fiber-resin laminating.

After that, you should sand it even and then polish it. They said you only then see the filled crack when you look veeeeeery close under special light (fluorescent lamps).

I think i will try that, as i have a crack in my rear rollobox .

 

[mbforever]

Hi.
I would like to restore the wood trim consol for my w107-500slc. Do you have an address of the Master or does he have any website?

Thanks in advance.

thang

 

[500AMM]

This is an interesting thread, should be made as sticky for the topic.
It is really painful to see the cracks appear on the panels year by year, and it is no typical places, it occures everywhere.

I've talked to a guy here in Norway who did a full repair on his W123 by removing the clearcoat chemically, followed by endless build up of clearcoat - really time consuming. I guess that technique has been mentioned already. The wood in the panels are veneer, which is layers of wood and glue, compressed and hardened under high pressure and temperature. I'm afraid the chemical paint remover could penetrate along the edges so the veneer will swell a bit. So I like the idea with resin or superglue, or even regular clearcoat can be used.

As already said, it seems that the veneer has a nature color prior to coating and the color is in the urethane/clearcoat. However on Ebay it's among others birds eye maple veneer sold with different colors: http://www.ebay.de/sch/i.html?_nkw=...n+ahorn&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313
I'm not sure I would go into a re-veneer process.

 

[036]

Hi.
I would like to restore the wood trim consol for my w107-500slc. Do you have an address of the Master or does he have any website?

Thanks in advance.

thang

Well, as soon as "my" Master will be done with my first trim- i´ll post pics and prices. If you´ll like it- i could arrange your restoration.
He is basically working on Yachts
No website...

 

[500AMM]

Hi.

Any news on this?

I'm excitied to see the sharp corners at the edges around the switch cut outs. If this is fine and he can match the color nuances, I should like to be in for a job too.

Cheers

 

[036]

He is very busy now- yacht season is opened...As soon as i get any info i´ll post update immideately.
In the mean time i dissasemled and polished Jelmer´s trim. Here are some pics, mostly helping to diss- and assemble those boxes.
I hope you guys don´t need a description?


Front Box.

 

[036]

Big Box in the back.

 

[500AMM]

Hello Arkady.

Do you have any updates on this?

-a-

 

[bpat]

My wood trim is in good shape except for the center panel around the shifter. Looks like this piece is available from the dealer and perhaps also from parts.com. If I order it does anyone know how closely the color or grain on what I receive is likely to match my existing wood?

 

[gsxr]

My wood trim is in good shape except for the center panel around the shifter. Looks like this piece is available from the dealer and perhaps also from parts.com. If I order it does anyone know how closely the color or grain on what I receive is likely to match my existing wood?

It won't match very well... most of the wood pieces I've purchased new are considerably darker than the originals. I'm not sure if the originals are simply faded from sunlight over 20 years or if something else is the cause. Buying a new piece is easier, but if you want to retain the original color & grain, I'd send it to Madera Concepts for refinishing.

For the record: I bought new "limo" wood for both my 500's, so I could add extra factory switches. The difference in color & grain didn't bother me.

 

[bpat]

Thanks. I guess I'm willing to risk the cost of a single piece so I'll go ahead and order it. If anyone's interested I can post some pics when it's received so people can see the difference in color.

 

[KarlC]

My wood trim is in good shape except for the center panel around the shifter. Looks like this piece is available from the dealer and perhaps also from parts.com. If I order it does anyone know how closely the color or grain on what I receive is likely to match my existing wood?

I have the same issue, my wood trim panel around the shifter has cracks in the clear coat.

I am thinking of removing it and refinishing it myself, I have seen a few post on others that have done this.

 

[bpat]

Update: both my dealer and parts.com say the center wood trim piece (part # 124-680-92-17) is no longer available. So I may send mine to Madera Concepts. Is there a trick to removing it without doing too much damage?

 

[gsxr]

Update: both my dealer and parts.com say the center wood trim piece (part # 124-680-92-17) is no longer available. So I may send mine to Madera Concepts. Is there a trick to removing it without doing too much damage?

Seriously? No longer available? That's crazy... not even a supercession?

 

[bpat]

That's what they said. Are our center consoles much different from the standard 124's? Because they made a boat load of those. Actually many boat loads. So you think that piece would be available.

 

[gsxr]

That's what they said. Are our center consoles much different from the standard 124's? Because they made a boat load of those. Actually many boat loads. So you think that piece would be available.

Should be identical to the .034 chassis and all coupes/cabrios (with heated seats). Seems fishy to me. Guess I'll have to pester my dealer for more info. Sometimes lazy parts guys see a code they don't recognize (or understand) and tell people "no longer available", when that isn't exactly true.

BTW - Have you checked with Tom Hanson at the MB Classic Center? That would be worth a try!
http://www.mbusa.com/mercedes/enthusiast/classic_center#module-5

 

[Jelmer]

How bad are those cracks? There's a very large chance that it's only in the top coating layer and NOT in the wood itself. So it might be possible to have someone sand it all the way down and respray... Costly, but at least then the colors and patterns match.

 

[bpat]

It's hard to know but I'll bet the cracks are just in the finish layers and not in the wood, as you suggest. I see that some here have had there's refinished. Does any one know how hard these pieces are to remove?

 

[Jelmer]

Very easy, actually. Remove the plastic cover from around the shifter, unscrew storage box (two screws in the front), unscrew the two screws in the rear of the wood, and you can pull it out. Be careful though, since the window selector will probably come up with the wood, as will the heated seat buttons.

The center wood thingie (above the radio) is also easy: two screws on the buttom, and remove the fan dials and the rings under it and you're done.

Should be a 5 minute job.

 

[gsxr]

Update: both my dealer and parts.com say the center wood trim piece (part # 124-680-92-17) is no longer available. So I may send mine to Madera Concepts. Is there a trick to removing it without doing too much damage?

UPDATE: I checked with my dealer. They said there are no codes preventing an order from being placed, and no supercessions. Although there may be zero stock, you can still place an order, and the wood piece may be built on demand. If your local dealer (and/or parts.com) refuses to place the order, then order it through the MB Classic Center. I have a feeling you may be pleasantly surprised.

 

[gerryvz]

My understanding is that for anything other than high-volume wood pieces (i.e. a Zebrano piece that would be used in a regular US-spec E320 wagon or sedan with ACC), that wood for youngtimers is produced on demand. I believe the piece that I purchased about 8 years ago for my E500, which has all of the notches cut out (for my ASR OFF switch) was custom-made after I placed the order. It took a few weeks to receive it after I ordered it.

Cheers,
Gerry

 

[bpat]

I may check out the MB Classic center as you suggest. At the moment I'm toying with the idea of trying to repair or refinish it my self, though I may talk myself out of it. I'm pretty sure that I could make it worse instead of better without too much trouble.

 

[500AMM]

Hello.

Color variations on new panels, NLA, repair, reveneering, Madera Concepts, MB Classisc Center...etc..

How is the quality between the work at Madera Concepts versus MB Classisc Center?

 

[8899]

Example: E500 shift console wood p/n 124-680-92-17 is $225 USD plus shipping from parts.com, compared to ~$250 USD plus shipping for refinishing.

Parts.com is not showing the shift console wood available. Comm blocked???

 

[gsxr]

Parts.com is not showing the shift console wood available. Comm blocked???

No, there is nothing online that will tell you if a part is Comm Blocked, you need to call a dealership and ask them to check their internal systems.

If a price does not show on parts.com that could mean a number of things but again, you can't find out what's going on without contacting either a dealership, or the Classic Center. It could be as simple as an error in the parts.com pricing file, i.e. they might be missing a few part numbers. MBFL still shows a price for this item.

 

[ponton]

I know this thread has been inactive for a while, but I have finally found something I may be able to offer some advice on. The finish is usually what cracks, as was mentioned previously and it does have a pigment to it. I did some experimentation with some w126 panels and none of the chemical strippers I tried had any effect. The most it did was craze the surface. The coating is also very thick and the veneer is very thin so it requires care. I was able to remove the coating with some judicious use of a heat gun (obviously it will burn with too much heat). Then its just a matter of cleaning up the wood, staining the wood or using a urethane with tint to build up thickness and polishing to a high lustre. With regard to the crispness of the edges, I am curious if one could mount the wood in a fixture flush with the surface and then cut the wood out using a router to give it the crisp edges. I wonder how they achieve that look at madera. This is a project I played around with here and there for a few weekends until larger catastrophes pulled me away. Gotta love some mirror finish wood. I have really perusing the site and can't wait to get my 500E one of these years.

Regards,

Ian

 

[500AMM]

I know this thread has been inactive for a while, but I have finally found something I may be able to offer some advice on. The finish is usually what cracks, as was mentioned previously and it does have a pigment to it. I did some experimentation with some w126 panels and none of the chemical strippers I tried had any effect. The most it did was craze the surface. The coating is also very thick and the veneer is very thin so it requires care. I was able to remove the coating with some judicious use of a heat gun (obviously it will burn with too much heat). Then its just a matter of cleaning up the wood, staining the wood or using a urethane with tint to build up thickness and polishing to a high lustre. With regard to the crispness of the edges, I am curious if one could mount the wood in a fixture flush with the surface and then cut the wood out using a router to give it the crisp edges. I wonder how they achieve that look at Madera Concepts. This is a project I played around with here and there for a few weekends until larger catastrophes pulled me away. Gotta love some mirror finish wood. I have really perusing the site and can't wait to get my 500E one of these years.

Regards,

Ian

Hello Ian.

Madera Concepts don't manage sharp edges on the cut-outs and panels. But they do as best as they can, read post #8: http://www.500eboard.com/forums/sho...er-switch-HVAC-console-panel&highlight=Madera

As far as I have understood, and from studying the panels, the panel edges and cut-outs are final machined after the coating process.

 

[mbforever]

Well, as soon as "my" Master will be done with my first trim- i´ll post pics and prices. If you´ll like it- i could arrange your restoration.
He is basically working on Yachts
No website...

036.

Any news about the Master?


thang

 

[DarkStar]

My shifter console was repaired by Heritage....didn't last ...they slapped some clear over the cracks and it failed pretty quickly.
I just stripped it myself (PITA) and found the wood was split. Not sure if it can be fixed. May try to contact Madera and see if they can fix it based on pictures doesn't sound like buying new is an option.

The first coat of stripper caused the clear (dark brown actually ) coat to lift, its really thick!