M119 Flywheel lock tool Group Buy

[JC220]

Hi all,

I posted some pics of a DIY crank lock tool I made and the question was asked if some more could be made. Hence this thread.

The issue is that once you separate the gearbox from the engine there is nowhere to use the factory crank lock tool to facilitate tightening of the flywheel bolts post rear main oil seal replacement.

There was another factory bracket tool to allow the flywheel lock to work in this scenario but I am advised it is NLA now.

These are photos of the simple and sturdy rear m119 crank lock tool I made.



If there is enough interest I would design and have plasma cut several of these (Min 12no I what I would produce to make it worthwhile) and offer for sale. The same fixing points etc as shown in the pics.

Price for a custom made tool would be £65gbp + shipping costs. It would be supplied in black satin paint finish and will be more elegant than the one pictured above!

Please reply to this thread if you want to express interest in buying one. If 6 people want to buy one then I will proceed to design and have the parts cut out by a specialist before welding myself and spraying.

A £20 deposit will be required from the 6 initial orders prior to production and lead time would be approx 2 - 3 weeks from that point to tools shipping out.

 

[JC220]

Note that for fitment / adjustment purposes the drill holes in the flat plate are approx 12.5mm (VS the m10 bolt) This allows fine tuning and essentially 360degree adjustability for locking the crank. Then you tighten the 2x M10 bolts with thick washers to clamp the tool and lock the crank hard!

 

[gerryvz]

JC, you can put me down for one. It's about time that I send some money back over your way....

 

[JC220]

JC, you can put me down for one. It's about time that I send some money back over your way....

Sure thing- thankyou Gerry!

 

[gsxr]

I'm in for one as well. Thanks, Joe!

 

[JC220]

Thanks Dave!

 

[gerryvz]

JC, you should add one (or two) to the list as extras. Reason being is that in my experience with "group buys," there is always someone who comes in waaaaay after the fact and desperately needs or wants the part, but either was a forum member or didn't see the thread about the group buy. It's a pain to stock them when you're fronting the money up front, but trust me, down the road you'll be able to charge double what you paid and the buyer will be glad to pay it.

These days, with things like the center arm rest hydraulic shocks, off-set rear lower LCAs and such, I'm always getting myself multiple sets because folks need them down the road and there are none left. I'm holding onto my spare BergWerks FGS module until I can get $2,500 for it.

Just a thought.

 

[JC220]

JC, you should add one (or two) to the list as extras. Reason being is that in my experience with "group buys," there is always someone who comes in waaaaay after the fact and desperately needs or wants the part, but either was a forum member or didn't see the thread about the group buy. It's a pain to stock them when you're fronting the money up front, but trust me, down the road you'll be able to charge double what you paid and the buyer will be glad to pay it.

These days, with things like the center arm rest hydraulic shocks, off-set rear lower LCAs and such, I'm always getting myself multiple sets because folks need them down the road and there are none left.

Just a thought.

Yes for sure Gerry! Good idea. I am putting 6 out there just as a means of justifying if there is sufficient uptake at the outset.

Aka not all members will see themselves requiring this tool now. But, if you are ever in to renew the rear crank seal then you will most certainly require it! And I am not aware of any vendors selling such a tool at the moment for use at the rear of a m119 when the gearbox is removed.

The only alternative is to use a bolt and pry bar to try and hold the flywheel but very I'll advised since damage to the ring gear is likely. Unlike using a strong tool that engages several pinion teeth securely.

I will perhaps have 20 cut out. And weld up / paint 12 for sale in the immediate with extras in reserve for the future.

 

[gerryvz]

I'm sure Jono would probably take one

 

[chicky]

Hi JC220,

Please put me down for the M119 crank tool. I hope you still have my email address, so you may send me a PayPal invoice (please include provision for commission of PayPal and projected delivery charges to Manila).

Thank you in advance

Best regards

 

[bb1]

Hey, one for me too....

 

[r44raven]

One for me too, Joe!

 

[JC220]

Hi JC220,

Please put me down for the M119 crank tool. I hope you still have my email address, so you may send me a PayPal invoice (please include provision for commission of PayPal and projected delivery charges to Manila).

Thank you in advance

Best regards

Hey, one for me too....

One for me too, Joe!

Gents – thankyou all so much for the interest so far. This group buy is now officially on!

Participants in order (First come, first served basis is how the tools will be shipped out when ready)

1. Gerryvz
2. Gsxr
3. Nocfn (Via Conversation)
4. Chicky
5. bb1
6. r44raven
7. Jaymanek

This list will be kept updated and added to as required.

There are no deposits required just yet. Allow me to get to work designing the tool parts. Then this week I will speak with some potential suppliers and check the lead times for when they could have my parts ready. I will provide you all with an update here as soon as I find out the lead time of when they will be ready. Once I have the components it will only take me a few days to start shipping tools out.

So for the moment – the group buy is live – and I will be updating this week when I have a confirmed lead time from my chosen supplier. (To provide me with the cnc plasma cut mild steel plates I will design) Then I will advise regardingpayment etc. I simply want to get my supplier confirmed before taking deposits / payments.

 

[JC220]

There is actually one other main use for this rear crank lock. Note that the front engine timing mark is on the damper itself. And the waterpump / timing cover must be in place to read that timing marker.

Now, should you find yourself rebuilding an m119 or having a replacement good used motor to work on outside of the car (Like me at the moment), then this tool can be used to lock the crank once the front timing marker is aligned. Then you can pull the damper, waterpump and timing cover in order to replace all timing slide rails and the new IWIS single piece timing chain. (The only way to fit a single piece timing chain over the nose of the crankshaft is to remove the timing cover. Otherwise you must split and re-link the chain)

So in my own case – I will have to set the timing cover + damper back on for a moment to find 45 before TDC , then lock the crank at the flywheel before commencing fitting up the whole new timing rails and chain. This way I know the timing can’t slip and I do not require the timing cover, waterpump or damper on to complete that timing task with full visual on the whole chain too.

Again, there is no other way to lock the crank when the gearbox is off. And an added bonus is you can forgo the front damper assembly when you know the crank is locked off at the correct point for timing purposes.

 

[emerydc8]

Can you use this tool to lock the crank when loosening and tightening the large bolt for the front main seal or does the transmission have to be removed?

 

[JC220]

Can you use this tool to lock the crank when loosening and tightening the large bolt for the front main seal or does the transmission have to be removed?

This lock tool can only be used when the transmission is separated from the engine.

Eg if the trans is pulled for rebuilding and the motor in the car.

When the transmission is attached the factory tool is still available at the time of writing which goes into the starter motor slot.

 

[emerydc8]

Thanks JC.

 

[jaymanek]

I'll have one please

 

[gsxr]

When the transmission is attached the factory tool is still available at the time of writing which goes into the starter motor slot.

Clarification: With the transmission attached, there is no need to remove the starter. There is a plate on the opposite side that can be removed, however you will need to pull the exhaust crossover pipe to access this.

Photos here: http://www.w124performance.com/images/tools/M119_flywheel_lock/

 

[500AMM]

Joe, if I'm not too late, put me down for one tool please.

 

[JC220]

Joe, if I'm not too late, put me down for one tool please.

Yes no problem thanks for that.

Sorry for the delay folks! The tool is designed and things will happen soon. I have been checking around to see who is the best CNC place here to order the bits from.

There is a place that will take a couple weeks to produce the parts but they are highly recommended as the best around here and produce very accurate parts. I am awaiting their quotation by email and once I agree to it - there is a 2 - 3 week lead time for the parts to be made. I could get them quicker from another source but want to give members the best lock tool I can produce!

 

[bb1]

Any update?

 

[JC220]

Any update?

Fair question and very sorry for the delay on this.

I did send these details to a company to cut the parts but they never did respond to emails after the fact and I presume they were too busy or whatever the case was. I did not pursue it and know of another place I can send the details too instead since I dont want to go through that time wasting over again.

I have a vacation coming up now next week and lots of car projects on the go. I promise this WILL get done and the tools will be produced this spring. I will go for 12 first and if they go out then produce more on demand. I have a spare m119 to test them on.

It is most definitely a very useful tool the prototype was invaluable on my recent m119 rebuild.

I will get back to this in a few weeks and post update when available and see if the people who had previously expressed interest are still on board (no problem either way I will still produce them!)

 

[JC220]

I bought another m119 flywheel from Germany just now. This is so I can fully check and align the new tool(s) using my spare m119 block. So this is happening folks - stay tuned.

 

[4451533]

Gents – thankyou all so much for the interest so far. This group buy is now officially on!

Participants in order (First come, first served basis is how the tools will be shipped out when ready)

1. Gerryvz
2. Gsxr
3. Nocfn (Via Conversation)
4. Chicky
5. bb1
6. r44raven
7. Jaymanek

This list will be kept updated and added to as required.

There are no deposits required just yet. Allow me to get to work designing the tool parts. Then this week I will speak with some potential suppliers and check the lead times for when they could have my parts ready. I will provide you all with an update here as soon as I find out the lead time of when they will be ready. Once I have the components it will only take me a few days to start shipping tools out.

So for the moment – the group buy is live – and I will be updating this week when I have a confirmed lead time from my chosen supplier. (To provide me with the cnc plasma cut mild steel plates I will design) Then I will advise regardingpayment etc. I simply want to get my supplier confirmed before taking deposits / payments.

Anyone has this tool for sale?

 

[JC220]

Not this one yet I made my own but didn't get anyone locally to cut the parts yet. Probably not happening this summer not going to lie just too much on.

This lock style is only needed if you have the transmission removed and it is possible to make your own which is what I did.

If the transmission is still installed or can be put back on then there are m119 flywheel locks available from MB and aftermarket which occupy one of the starter motor holes.



If someone REALLY needs it I could lend the prototype homebrew one pictured in post #1 but postage across pond is very expensive and I would need a semi ridiculous deposit also to ensure its return! It's probably not worth looking at this unless for a member near me.

 

[gsxr]

Anyone has this tool for sale?

There are 2 different styles of flywheel lock tool, as Joe describes above.

One is meant for use with the engine + transmission bolted together, shown in post #26 above. This is most common, and used when the front crank seal is replaced.

The other (shown in the first post on this thread) is used when the transmission is NOT bolted to the engine. This is not common, and is used when the REAR crank seal is replaced.

 

[gerryvz]

Fair question and very sorry for the delay on this.

I did send these details to a company to cut the parts but they never did respond to emails after the fact and I presume they were too busy or whatever the case was. I did not pursue it and know of another place I can send the details too instead since I dont want to go through that time wasting over again.

I have a vacation coming up now next week and lots of car projects on the go. I promise this WILL get done and the tools will be produced this spring. I will go for 12 first and if they go out then produce more on demand. I have a spare m119 to test them on.

It is most definitely a very useful tool the prototype was invaluable on my recent m119 rebuild.

I will get back to this in a few weeks and post update when available and see if the people who had previously expressed interest are still on board (no problem either way I will still produce them!)

Any updates on this project?

 

[JC220]

Any updates on this project?

Sorry nothing since as work and projects just got and still are too busy. However, I did have the drawings done and my brother now has his own plasma CNC cutting machine so now I am reminded and if folks are still interested then I will get this underway early in the new year. (Need W140 project finished over Christmas break from work)

Price would be the same as I stated above £65GBP + postage. Note again this lock tool is designed only for use with the engine and transmission seperated. Therefore not everyone will require it unless you plan engine retoration work in the future in which case I found it critical hence why I made it.

Anyone currently interested drop a note here please. If there are at least 10 then it will enthuse me enough to get the first batch of 10 made and shipped. I will not require or accept any deposits etc - I will make them for those who sign up now and payment will only be sought when I have them tested, produced and ready to go.

 

[JC220]

I know I am very late to get back on this so are the following members still interested please given the passage of time? (Who expressed interest before)

@gerryvz
@gsxr
@nocfn
@chicky
@bb1
@r44raven
@jaymanek

 

[JC220]

There was a second m119 crank lock tool I made before which DOES work in the car and is easier to access and use VS the factory tool:

This was during me making it but you can see where it goes - in the lowest slot / inspection cover from below the car:



Edit - I went looking for the above tool and gosh darn it Ive LOST IT!!

So ill be making these too as I definitely want mine back again. This plate fits tight into the recess and the 2no m6 bolts clamp it to the trans. There are also 2no M8 Bolts (werent drilled yet in the photo above)



and these were supported with solid metal bushings welded behind the plate. These are the exact depth to the ring gear and the bolts go in where the torque converter bolts are. This serves as a very quick and very solid crank lock.

This tool will be made and can be a little cheaper than the larger rear tool at £45. Or buy both versions for £100.

Note this tool CAN be used in car - but not when engine block and oil pan are seperated which is why the first version is required in that case.

 

[gsxr]

JC220, yes, I am still interested - thanks for the update!

Edit - both tools, please!

 

[chicky]

Hi JC220, please put me in for "buy both versions for £100." Thank you

 

[JC220]

Ok I found the photos of the second m119 crank lock tool I made before for in car use:



This time around ill have the standoffs turned so they are not square stock. It is 4mm Plate - very solid tool in use and it bolts onto the ring gear / TC itself. I made this at the time for convenience really as the factory tool is not ideal access wise on a 500E. It will be etch primed and sprayed satin black and supplied with flange head bolts.

 

[skikrazey]

JC220 count me in for both tools please!

 

[744Brillantsilber]

@JC220, I am interested in a set of both too.

 

[500AMM]

This tool will be made and can be a little cheaper than the larger rear tool at £45. Or buy both versions for £100.

Note this tool CAN be used in car - but not when engine block and oil pan are seperated which is why the first version is required in that case.

Joe, I am in for a set please!
It's good to see those two bolts are 10.9, they have to be tightened pretty well to avoid any flex when torquing the crank damper center bolt.



I haven't wrenched on this yet so maybe a stupid question, but can you elaborate how the oil pan is playing in on this?
.

 

[JC220]

Joe, I am in for a set please!
It's good to see those two bolts are 10.9, they have to be tightened pretty well to avoid any flex when torquing the crank damper center bolt.

View attachment 157824

I haven't wrenched on this yet so maybe a stupid question, but can you elaborate how the oil pan is playing in on this?
.

Thanks for that and given the good interest shown by all here I will get the first prototypes cut to test within the next 2 weeks and will aim to have all blanks ready for welding during the Christmas break from work.


Ref the oil pan, the in car lock tool sits within the oil pan's recess and so it is held by same.

If you were doing a full timing job with oil pan off (upper and lower) then this tool will not work as there is no oil pan to restrain it.

With the engine and trans separated or upper oil pan off it is better to use the other lock tool designed to bolt to the engine block itself.

I hope this clarifies your question if not come back to me

 

[JC220]

Hi all,

2022- wow how time flies! I'm sorry for the lack of updates on this. I had trouble finding a reliable supplier to cut the plates for me.

I have now located a good source local to me and he has produced other parts for me. I will be progressing this forward again now in the coming weeks.

I will produce 12x of each M119 lock tool first and see how that goes. (1x set will be mine so 11x available to 500E board members in first production run)

So stay tuned for updates. I have transmission plates to complete in the next week or so then I'll move onto these. They will be getting yellow zinc plated so this all adds lead time so give me 4 or 6 weeks to come back with update. Those who expressed interest before will be given first refusal / priority.

 

[doolar]

Hi Joe, I'd like one if there's any possibility!

All the best, Thomas

 

[JC220]

Hi Joe, I'd like one if there's any possibility!

All the best, Thomas

Yes no problem Doolar - ill check later if each person wants one type or both tools once I post photos of them as obviously people need to see what they are looking at ordering first

 

[JC220]

This is happening now!

I have finished my final designs for both crank lock tools and triple checked dimensions using a spare M119 engine, ring gear and transmission with TC.

Once the first tools are made I will also be test fitting on my 500E.

I am going after work today to meet the watercut guy and load the drawings to his system. So I expect to collect the mark 1 test parts within a week or so.

I will post photos of both tools and double check numbers of who is interested so far and create a clean up to date list for clarity and how many are left in the first production run. (1st production run can be extended from 12 if there is enough interest)

Re zinc plating, whilst I like yellow zinc the MB factory m119 crank lock tool is silver zinc plated. So ill add a poll here and members interested can vote what finish you prefer! (Meaning the highest no of votes will dictate the final zinc colour finish) I will add the poll with first tool pictures coming within a week or so.

 

[JC220]

I can share a sneak peak of the 2D view of the crank tools - (Deliberately skewed view)



The left one is what bolts to the block on rear of right cylinder bank. Full adjustment for locking crank precisely depending on timing settings if required.

The right image is the crank lock tool that goes below the engine, easy to fit and bolts into the torque converter and onto transmission case. These have advantages over the MB factory tool as already described in this thread.

The M119 text cutouts help reduce weight as they are to be made from thick steel and will also make the tools easy to identify what they are for in the future!

Both tools are TIG welded in multiple parts of course, these are just 2D preview images of the intent as sneak peak.

 

[JC220]

Current list who have expressed interest so far:

(I am taking this as 1x PAIR of tools each at £100GBP. If incorrect please advise)

@gerryvz
@gsxr
@nocfn
@chicky
@bb1
@r44raven
@jaymanek
@500AMM
@skikrazey
@744Brillantsilber
@doolar

11x + 1 for me in first batch brings it to 12. If anyone else is on the fence and wants a set speak now and ill see if I can extend 1st batch numbers by 1 or 2 more sets.

If anyone tagged above is no longer interested due to the passage of time that is no problem at all but do please let me know here or by PM!

There is now a poll on this thread for preffered zinc colour of the new tools. The factory MB m119 crank lock tool is silver zinc but happy to go with silver or yellow zinc depending on which gets the most votes, so please vote in poll now! (A couple weeks away from plating stage but I would like to start ordering in the hardware)

 

[doolar]

Perhaps add a ”Doesn’t matter” alternative to the poll? I have no idea why I’d want one over the other.

 

[JC220]

Perhaps add a ”Doesn’t matter” alternative to the poll? I have no idea why I’d want one over the other.

Yes that's OK, maybe I am overthinking it

Silver would probably make the most sense.

 

[gerryvz]

I am re-confirming my interest/commitment for a tool when you get them completed and ready to ship. If you need payment sooner, please let me know.

 

[dreaming.haze]

If there is a set available, I'd be in for them. Great work putting these together.

 

[JC220]

I am re-confirming my interest/commitment for a tool when you get them completed and ready to ship. If you need payment sooner, please let me know.

Thanks Gerry! Thanks also for the offer of payment but its OK I will await having the actual parts in hand and showing photos here before seeking any payment.

If there is a set available, I'd be in for them. Great work putting these together.

You're in!. Thank you. I'd say just one more set left available in this first production run for anyone else. And if there is enough interest a second run will be done later.

 

[gerryvz]

By the way, I don't care what color these tools are plated. As long as they do the job, as advertised.

Perhaps pink or purple, if you really wanted to press me for my color preference? That way they'd be super pretty and really stand out in my tool chest drawer.