Sway bars/Anti roll bars remanufactured

[T0Pnotch55]

Hi everyone, hope you all having a great day, there is an opportunity to make a small batch of sway bars for the W124 chassis, specifically the sway bar from the V8 models. Why the V8 model bar design you ask, is because the V8 model sway bar can fit non V8 model but the non V8 model sway bar can’t fit on V8 model, so instead making 2 separate designs its easier and cheaper to make the design that fits all. The design that it was picked is the RennTech sway bar, that is 32MM thick all the way through and taper down to 22. Now, my question to all of you who might be interested is, what thickness would you consider be best and optimal?

- 30MM all the way through and then taper down to 22MM
or
- 32MM all the way through and taper down to 22MM

the rear will be sized accordingly to the front
- 30MM and 20MM
- 32MM and 22MM

Any suggestions on colors are welcomed.

Thank you all, will be waiting on comments.

 

[gsxr]

30mm with the ends 22mm would be my preference. This would be similar to (but still stiffer than) the AMG E60 bar. I personally think the 32mm bar was too stiff, and may cause excessive understeer.

20mm rear bar would be perfect. Ideally it would also have the flat section to locate the SLS linkage bracket.

Any estimates on price? Would these be sold individually, or as matching pairs?

 

[T0Pnotch55]

30mm with the ends 22mm would be my preference. This would be similar to (but still stiffer than) the AMG E60 bar. I personally think the 32mm bar was too stiff, and may cause excessive understeer.

20mm rear bar would be perfect. Ideally it would also have the flat section to locate the SLS linkage bracket.

Any estimates on price? Would these be sold individually, or as matching pairs?

can you clarify what do you mean by ‘flat section to locate the SLS linkage bracket’ ?

the priceing will be determined by the estimate of the manufacturer and the number of sway bars that will be produced, preferable to sell as a kit considering that its a small batc and its not cheap to do this nowadays, and would like to return the investment

 

[T0Pnotch55]

30mm with the ends 22mm would be my preference. This would be similar to (but still stiffer than) the AMG E60 bar. I personally think the 32mm bar was too stiff, and may cause excessive understeer.

20mm rear bar would be perfect. Ideally it would also have the flat section to locate the SLS linkage bracket.

Any estimates on price? Would these be sold individually, or as matching pairs?

do you have a picture by any chance with that flat section on the bar please? would be very helpful, the sway bars i have for the design are from E420, the rear bar does not have any flat spot on it, thank you for mentioning that

 

[gsxr]

do you have a picture by any chance with that flat section on the bar please? would be very helpful, the sway bars i have for the design are from E420, the rear bar does not have any flat spot on it, thank you for mentioning that

The 400E420E rear sway bar should also have the flat spot. It's very subtle and could be covered by dirt. It's just right of center on the passenger side of the bar. If you can't find it, I'll see if I can find a bar and take a photo.

 

[T0Pnotch55]

The 400E420E rear sway bar should also have the flat spot. It's very subtle and could be covered by dirt. It's just right of center on the passenger side of the bar. If you can't find it, I'll see if I can find a bar and take a photo.

are you talking about this flat spot?

 

[gsxr]

are you talking about this flat spot?

YUP! That is the flat spot. Doesn't look like much, but it properly locates the SLS linkage bracket. It also prevents the bracket from slipping out of adjustment.

Might be tricky to get the precise location ground into the new bars. If cost prohibitive to add this, it isn't required, but it makes installation on any car with SLS much more of a headache (all 036, all wagons, any other 124 with optional SLS).

 

[T0Pnotch55]

YUP! That is the flat spot. Doesn't look like much, but it properly locates the SLS linkage bracket. It also prevents the bracket from slipping out of adjustment.

Might be tricky to get the precise location ground into the new bars. If cost prohibitive to add this, it isn't required, but it makes installation on any car with SLS much more of a headache (all 036, all wagons, any other 124 with optional SLS).

i will talk with the guy’s who is going to make the sway bars and ill see what they say, i hope its not going to be a big increase in cost, i dont thing its a problem to add the flat spot in, it all comes down to what people will be willing to pay for a set like this, o made some rough estimates and it’s adding up, ill post an update here soon, im preparing to ship the sway bars to the company and i should have an estimate in the next 2 weeks, but thats just for the bars, bushings and brakets and everything else i have to source on my own so it will take a little bit to put a complete kit together, i hope there will be interest

 

[gsxr]

I'd highly recommend sticking with the OE Genuine Mercedes bushings - don't bother with polyurethane stuff. Shouldn't need to change brackets either. All we need are the bars, for most all 124 chassis applications.

 

[T0Pnotch55]

I'd highly recommend sticking with the OE Genuine Mercedes bushings - don't bother with polyurethane stuff. Shouldn't need to change brackets either. All we need are the bars, for most all 124 chassis applications.

i know the mercedes benz still sell the sway bar end bushings 22mm but i don’t know about the 30mm bushings, i dont have the part number for that one, i was planing to use the 22mm merc des bushings but i wasn’t sure about the 30mm bishings and brakets

 

[gsxr]

Front sway bar:
124-323-51-85 = 22mm outer bushing (hard version) - $9.50 MSRP each
129-323-01-85 = 30mm inner bushing - $11.50 MSRP each

Both are still available. Brackets are the same across all 124's.


The rear bar is a question mark... there's a 20mm rear bushing (210-326-04-81, $15 MSRP) but I can't remember if it fits directly into the 124 rear bar bracket. I think it does. IIRC, all 124's use the same rear bushing bracket.

 

[T0Pnotch55]

Front sway bar:
124-323-51-85 = 22mm outer bushing (hard version) - $9.50 MSRP each
129-323-01-85 = 30mm inner bushing - $11.50 MSRP each

Both are still available. Brackets are the same across all 124's.


The rear bar is a question mark... there's a 20mm rear bushing (210-326-04-81, $15 MSRP) but I can't remember if it fits directly into the 124 rear bar bracket. I think it does. IIRC, all 124's use the same rear bushing bracket.

thank uou for the part numbers, this will make it much more easy and less expensive, appreciate your help dude, monday im shiping out the sway bars and fingers crossed they are kot going to charge an arm and a leg, ill keep updated the post

 

[T0Pnotch55]

Hi everyone, sway bars were shipped today, the company that im trying to make this happen is called Betts Spring Manufacturing, i don’t know much about them but they are located in Fresno CA, and looks like they are very professional in what they do, hopefully everything goes smoothly.

 

[T0Pnotch55]

Hello everyone, quick update on the sway bars


So i want to ask your opinion on this, the company got back to me with some information, one thing i am not very happy about it is that they dont work with Metric size materials, they have only use standard, they have the possibility to do Metric size but then i have to place a bigger order number and it will be more expensive, what they offer at this moment is using Standard (usa measurement system) size and match as close as possible to the size that i want, so right now they are offering this:

1.188 inch = 30.175 mm wich i think i can work with that
and
0.831 inch = 21.1074 mm wich is not too bad

the problem i have is that i want to use OEM mercedes bushings and for the front bar the bushings should work fine but the rear i think its going to be a problem because of the 1.1mm difference in diameter between the bar and the bushing, what are your thoughts guys?

im just trying to keep it as affordable as possible

 

[T0Pnotch55]

unless Mercedes benz has a rear sway bar bushing that is 21 mm then there is no problem, i just don’t know that, if there is and someone know the part number then the problem is solved

 

[gsxr]

1.188 inch = 30.175 mm wich i think i can work with that

Zero problems here. The 30mm bushing will fit perfectly. Shoot, RENNtech used 30mm bushings on their 32mm bar!

0.831 inch = 21.1074 mm wich is not too bad

What's the next size smaller?

 

[T0Pnotch55]

What's the next size smaller?

the smaller size that they can do would be closer to 19 mm

 

[gsxr]

the smaller size that they can do would be closer to 19 mm

0.831 inch may be a typo - I assume that's 0.813, based on SAE sizing in 1/16" increments:

7/8" = 0.875" = 22.23mm
13/16" = 0.813 = 20.65mm
3/4" = 0.750 = 19.05

Pity they want more $$ and larger order quantity for metric sizes. The 19mm rear bar would have zero problems with 18mm bushing, and would be great for most 124's, but is a modest increase over the E500E stock rear bar. The 20.65mm rear bar is just a hair on the large size, I'm not sure if the 18mm bushing would work. And, I'm not sure if the 20mm W210 rear bushing fits into the W124 rear bracket - can't remember. I think a solution can be found but it would be nice to sort out before starting production.

Any chance you can find a small piece of 13/16" / 0.813" round bar stock to experiment with, along with the 18mm and 20mm factory bushings?

 

[T0Pnotch55]

0.831 inch may be a typo - I assume that's 0.813, based on SAE sizing in 1/16" increments:

7/8" = 0.875" = 22.23mm
13/16" = 0.813 = 20.65mm
3/4" = 0.750 = 19.05

Pity they want more $$ and larger order quantity for metric sizes. The 19mm rear bar would have zero problems with 18mm bushing, and would be great for most 124's, but is a modest increase over the E500E stock rear bar. The 20.65mm rear bar is just a hair on the large size, I'm not sure if the 18mm bushing would work. And, I'm not sure if the 20mm W210 rear bushing fits into the W124 rear bracket - can't remember. I think a solution can be found but it would be nice to sort out before starting production.

Any chance you can find a small piece of 13/16" / 0.813" round bar stock to experiment with, along with the 18mm and 20mm factory bushings?

good point on the measurements, ill call them tomorrow to ask again if the measurements ar correct and ill update here

 

[T0Pnotch55]

good point on the measurements, ill call them tomorrow to ask again if the measurements ar correct and ill update here

i will try to figure something out, ill go to the meral store to get a pice of round stock and try to see what can be done

 

[T0Pnotch55]

clarification on why the Metric stuff would be more expensive, the manufacturer that im trying to work they are making stuff for mostly on american cars and they use primarily SAE size materials, they told me if i want metric they have to make special order of Metruc size material and vendors have a limit in how little you can buy from them (vendors sell supplies in bulk), so they told me i would have to make an order of at least 100-200 units wich makes it more expensive and more time for the process, i personally don’t mind if its not metric, if its close enough to the measurements im looking for im fine

 

[T0Pnotch55]

0.831 inch may be a typo - I assume that's 0.813, based on SAE sizing in 1/16" increments:

7/8" = 0.875" = 22.23mm
13/16" = 0.813 = 20.65mm
3/4" = 0.750 = 19.05

Pity they want more $$ and larger order quantity for metric sizes. The 19mm rear bar would have zero problems with 18mm bushing, and would be great for most 124's, but is a modest increase over the E500E stock rear bar. The 20.65mm rear bar is just a hair on the large size, I'm not sure if the 18mm bushing would work. And, I'm not sure if the 20mm W210 rear bushing fits into the W124 rear bracket - can't remember. I think a solution can be found but it would be nice to sort out before starting production.

Any chance you can find a small piece of 13/16" / 0.813" round bar stock to experiment with, along with the 18mm and 20mm factory bushings?

i confirmed with the manufacturer they miss typed the number, the correct size is 0.813 inch wich is 20.65 mm, this is perfect, now i have to confirm fitment on the car and i think we are good to go

 

[T0Pnotch55]

at this moment i have a little bit of a hard time to check the bracket fitment with the 20mm bushing using stock bracket, but this is not a problem because we can use polyurethane bushings and brackets for the rear sway bar, i don’t think it will be a big issue, amazon has a big variety of bushings and sizes, even better they have 13/16 size bushings wich is the same as the bar thickness and the design is similar as the oem bracket and bushing so no problem there

here are some pictures of the 13/16 inch bar with the 20mm mercedes bushing

 

[gsxr]

You don't want polyurethane bushings anywhere. They squeak, even when greased. There's a reason the OE/Genuine bushings are rubber with a Teflon-lined fabric insert. They are silent.

From your photos, it looks like the OE bushing will work fine - the rubber should compress to fit.

 

[T0Pnotch55]

You don't want polyurethane bushings anywhere. They squeak, even when greased. There's a reason the OE/Genuine bushings are rubber with a Teflon-lined fabric insert. They are silent.

From your photos, it looks like the OE bushing will work fine - the rubber should compress to fit.

i understand, the OEM stuff is better but you can’t always get the best of both worlds, i was just saying if the OEM will not work there is a solution

im just trying to bring something to the market that is currently unavailable and im trying my best, if the bushings is a deal breaker then i am sorry i cant do much about it

 

[gsxr]

The aftermarket brackets DO NOT fit the chassis floor. It would be a messy cobbled patchwork using aftermarket stuff. The only acceptable solution is stock brackets with OE bushing. I'm 99.44% certain it will work fine based on your photo.

 

[T0Pnotch55]

The aftermarket brackets DO NOT fit the chassis floor. It would be a messy cobbled patchwork using aftermarket stuff. The only acceptable solution is stock brackets with OE bushing. I'm 99.44% certain it will work fine based on your photo.

well then we should be good to go

 

[T0Pnotch55]

hi everyone, I am ready to place the order, I'm hesitating a little bit on how many should I order, I thought there will be a little more interest in this but it looks like not a lot of people reacted to this post, the minimum amount I can order is 10 of each, please leave a comment with your thoughts on that, the more I order the cheaper per unit it gets, thank you

 

[ArauzMotoring]

I’m interested in this, as long as the oem mounts work and I can use the factory end links to connect to these, I think it’d be nice to get the cars to have a bit more roll stiffness.

What’s the price looking like- assuming you get 10 orders of each front and rear bars?

Did you settle on what diameters they are going to be in the end?

Is there any anecdotal reviews of people installing bigger sway bars on the 500E?

My ideal tuning philosophy for suspension is let the let the shock damping control low speed movements and absorb fast speed movements nicely and not needing to rely on huge bars for less roll , but custom shock tuning for these cars is almost nill.. lol

 

[T0Pnotch55]

I’m interested in this, as long as the oem mounts work and I can use the factory end links to connect to these, I think it’d be nice to get the cars to have a bit more roll stiffness.

What’s the price looking like- assuming you get 10 orders of each front and rear bars?

Did you settle on what diameters they are going to be in the end?

Is there any anecdotal reviews of people installing bigger sway bars on the 500E?

My ideal tuning philosophy for suspension is let the let the shock damping control low speed movements and absorb fast speed movements nicely and not needing to rely on huge bars for less roll , but custom shock tuning for these cars is almost nill.. lol

the factory end links will work, there is no change in that, the only change is the thickness of the bar, all the mounting points remain the same as factory

the bars are not going to be thicker than what has been done before, renntech out 32mm thick bars in the front on the E60 so i think the measurements that was decided should work just fine, you can google ‘sway bar measurements for w124 500e’ and you will see a spreadsheet with all the sizes that has been out on this chassis

the thickness will be
rear bar
13/16 inch wich is 0.813 inch wich is 20.65 mm

front bar
1.188 inch wich is 30.175 mm

i guess you can talk with a suspension shop in regards to this setup in combination with a good set of shocks and springs and see what they say, i want to bring this product to market because currently there is none available

 

[gsxr]

Sizes look good. What is the estimated cost to forum members, for the pair front+rear? Do you have to pack & ship them, or will the manufacturer drop-ship for you (which would make it easier)?

 

[Glen]

What’s the cost of the front bar?

 

[T0Pnotch55]

Sizes look good. What is the estimated cost to forum members, for the pair front+rear? Do you have to pack & ship them, or will the manufacturer drop-ship for you (which would make it easier)?

i will be the one who will have to pack and ship, no prices at this time because i have not decided on how many to order, but a rough estimate for the kit and bushings probably might be around 5-600$ plus shipping, wich i think its a decent price considering market prices on similar parts upgrade for mercdes, THIS IS NOT THE PRICE, THIS IS JUST A ROUGH ESTIMATE

 

[T0Pnotch55]

What’s the cost of the front bar?

unfortunately i will only sell complete kits, im sorry

 

[Glen]

unfortunately i will only sell complete kits, im sorry

Bummer, still thanks for making the effort to have these made. If I didn’t already have a 21mm rear bar, I’d be interested.

 

[T0Pnotch55]

Bummer, still thanks for making the effort to have these made. If I didn’t already have a 21mm rear bar, I’d be interested.

do you mind if i ask where did you got the rear 21 mm bar?

 

[Glen]

do you mind if i ask where did you got the rear 21 mm bar?

A member had a group buy many years ago, search “Feind” and you’ll find it.

 

[T0Pnotch55]

hi everyone, here is a small update, getting this approved and then they will start production

 

[gsxr]

Looks great! Just curious, what's with the 3 mounting holes at the rear bar?

 

[T0Pnotch55]

the OEM has only one hole and i thought to add 2 more for adjustability, the OEM hole is in the middle

 

[jnes]

Intresting.. According to the blueprints the color of the bars would be blue? Is there other color options available? Extra charge? Will there be a notch in the rear bar for SLS bracket?

 

[gsxr]

Will there be a notch in the rear bar for SLS bracket?

Drawing does show a notch in the rear bar for the SLS bracket, if I'm reading this correctly:

 

[T0Pnotch55]

Intresting.. According to the blueprints the color of the bars would be blue? Is there other color options available? Extra charge? Will there be a notch in the rear bar for SLS bracket?

unfortunately to keep it simple and cost effective there will be only one color, i didn’t really thought much about it since its under the car and its not visible, i apologize if this is an inconvenience, the notch for SLS clearances will be made

 

[Taco]

I'm definitely interested in this, blue is perfect with my car. Any idea about the price once you reach your order threshold?

I'm planning on doing many other upgrades, but need to budget before i go too crazy

 

[T0Pnotch55]

I'm definitely interested in this, blue is perfect with my car. Any idea about the price once you reach your order threshold?

I'm planning on doing many other upgrades, but need to budget before i go too crazy

hi, i don’t have a price yet, but ill do my best to keep the price as low as possible, ill post an update here shortly

 

[anton28]

I'm interested, sign me up for a front and rear unit.

 

[anton28]

@topnotch55, how's the process going? Do you think we will see the parts this year?

 

[T0Pnotch55]

@topnotch55, how's the process going? Do you think we will see the parts this year?

yes it will be done by the end of the year 100%, I apologize is taking so long

 

[Tdorokhin86]

Any updates on time when it’s gonna be available? Are you gonna do some for wagons also ? Very interested

 

[gsxr]

Any updates on time when it’s gonna be available? Are you gonna do some for wagons also ? Very interested

I believe these bars should fit all 124's include wagons, coupés, and cabrios.