Bolt on performance exhaust for the 500e (testing waters)

[400Eric]

Are you positive sure that the later harmonic balancer/pulley set-up isn't lighter too? I'm really thinking that it is. I can't imagine them changing it like they did and not lighten it too while they were at it like they did everything else. Plus, it looks lighter! That's gotta count for something!

Regards,
Eric

 

[126v8]

Yes Matt @ leistung Autohaus and I were discussing this conversion.

At the moment we are trying to determine transmissions that are readily available and CNC the proper components to make it work. But just to be warned we have budgeted 10k for this conversion project not including the trans!

But this is something that will be worked on in 2014.

We have a lot of projects to finish up, 16v goodies are almost done and we are going to play with the 500e.


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Would it be easier and or cheaper to do a 5 sp auto conversion for the 036?

 

[gsxr]

Would it be easier and or cheaper to do a 5 sp auto conversion for the 036?

Yes and yes. I'd love this with a factory TCU. Right now it's only possible with aftermarket TCU's which have some minor issues. I still haven't seen anyone put a 722.6 into a 124.034/.036 yet, but it has been done with 6-cyl 124's.

 

[126v8]

Yes and yes. I'd love this with a factory TCU. Right now it's only possible with aftermarket TCU's which have some minor issues. I still haven't seen anyone put a 722.6 into a 124.034/.036 yet, but it has been done with 6-cyl 124's.

What say you 5thscaleracer?

 

[J-Sauce]

Yes! I would love the 5 spd auto in my 036. I'd be much more inclined to shell out 2k for that than an exhaust.

 

[126v8]

Yes! I would love the 5 spd auto in my 036. I'd be much more inclined to shell out 2k for that than an exhaust.

5thscaleracer?

 

[gerryvz]

Man, I hope he didn't disappear already .....

 

[J-Sauce]

It's only been a day guys. Brreeeaaathee.

 

[5thscaleracer]

5spd auto vs manual???

So are you guys saying forget the exhaust and do a 5spd auto?




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[Glen]

A 5-speed auto or any manual trans will be much more expensive than a $1500 to $2000 exhaust and I suspect you'll have even fewer takers. I say stick to your plans.

 

[126v8]

Not really but you said you were looking into transmissions that were readily available and you were going to "play with the 500E." A 5 spd auto is very interesting.

 

[126v8]

A 5-speed auto or any manual trans will be much more expensive than a $1500 to $2000 exhaust and I suspect you'll have even fewer takers. I say stick to your plans.

Really?Isnt it just the TCU that would be the issue since each person can source the 5 spd trans themselves?

 

[szvook]

I can get a 5 speed auto transmission with very low miles installed tomorrow at a cost of $5k, but an exhaust that can yield the power being claimed above non of us have had, so I would more inclined towards the exhaust.

 

[KarlC]

an exhaust that can yield the power being claimed above non of us have had, so I would more inclined towards the exhaust.

Good point, lets see if he can get done what's been asked for for 20 years and not yet done.

 

[Glen]

Really?Isnt it just the TCU that would be the issue since each person can source the 5 spd trans themselves?

What about the custom trans mount, the modified driveshaft, the tunnel mods to accommodate the trans itself and also the shift lever? The devil is in the details.

 

[Germanautoservice]

Well I went ahead and ordered up some exhaust stuff, will be doing cats, x-pipe, all custom mandrel bent and tig welded. I have a couple muffler sections so final answer will be determined by sound and volume. gains will show on the dyno. Please note, because I am just doing this to show a proper exhaust will gain measurable power and torque I will be using aluminized pipe not stainless. If someone wanted stainless I could certainly build it but for test purposes this will be fine.

Parts will be here tomm....let the fun begin

 

[Jackasic]

man you guys ran him off already, crazy! J/K, 5thSR is a good guy, curious to see how this turns out.

 

[Maui]

Tough crowd.


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[Germanautoservice]

Its all in good fun

 

[126v8]

5thSR please go ahead with your idea.We really want to see this work.Big thanks to Germanautoservice for pressing on.Really looking forward.

 

[Germanautoservice]

totally off topic, but we are working on a intake manifold for this car as well. Just walked out of the machine shop, made a rather large pile of chips!

 

[126v8]

Good things on store for the 036 community at last!

 

[gerryvz]

man you guys ran him off already, crazy! J/K, 5thSR is a good guy, curious to see how this turns out.

Amazing, huh? Sort of like Benzworld 126 forum !

 

[400Eric]

5spd auto vs manual???

So are you guys saying forget the exhaust and do a 5spd auto?

At this point in time, the 5spd auto swap is still prohibitively expensive, but I'm thinking that if others were to attempt it, the cost could, would and should come down. I too would LOVE to have a 5spd auto, but not if the kit is too costly. If it's too costly, one could just instead buy a Benz that has the 5spd auto already installed by the factory, as Dave did!

This doesn't need to be a either/or proposition, give us BOTH the exhaust AND the trans swap! Just keep the prices in line! Please!

What about the custom trans mount, the modified driveshaft, the tunnel mods to accommodate the trans itself and also the shift lever? The devil is in the details.

I do not believe that tunnel mods are necessary.

totally off topic, but we are working on a intake manifold for this car as well. Just walked out of the machine shop, made a rather large pile of chips!

THIS SHOULD BE GOOD!

I was beginning to think that I was the only one here who seems to be aware of the fact that the intake manifold needs help big time. It leaves a lot to be desired! Please start a new thread on this topic in this section!

Whatever you are doing, make the plenum bigger while you are at it, and please eliminate that damn EGR plumbing that is blocking the flow! (Run the plumbing outside of the manifold if you have to! That's how MB should have done it!)

Regards,
Eric

 

[Germanautoservice]

The plenum needs to bigger, I did delete the egr. No need for it. Now this intake will be more for a turbo application but I will revisit for a na normal driver. I'm mounting the tb much different from factory so it won't be for all. But I know even na this will unleash a lot of power.

 

[400Eric]

I can't wait!

 

[gsxr]

totally off topic, but we are working on a intake manifold for this car as well. Just walked out of the machine shop, made a rather large pile of chips!

Now THIS definitely has my attention. I've mentioned before that I think more gains are possible with intake mods vs exhaust. Pat, please start a new thread for your normally-aspirated intake mods, with photos please!

 

[samiam44]

Amen Dave!


I'd be curious on a layout- where are you planning on the X-cross piece? If you get toward cats- I would be interested.

 

[Germanautoservice]

Once I have the car on the lift I'll start looking at layout. The x-pipe needs to be in the correct place to be able to do what it's suppost to do. It's all about physics and last time I checked that hasn't changed in a while lol. Have to achieve proper heat levels and flow. Hotter gases flow better pulling exhaust thru the car, this creating horsepower and torque....

 

[szvook]

For optimum results, the x-pipe needs to be placed futher back towards the muffler(s) and the exact location does need to be calculated based on the measured gas temperatures.

 

[Germanautoservice]

Now THIS definitely has my attention. I've mentioned before that I think more gains are possible with intake mods vs exhaust. Pat, please start a new thread for your normally-aspirated intake mods, with photos please!

Dave, the current manifold im building is more for the drag strip and performance and the drag strip, im sure with some of the more strict emission states it wouldn't fly. but I will be making a more emissions friendly manifold for the folks stuck in those states. MN doesn't have emissions so its not to tough. This current design is a total revamp of the manifold.

 

[5thscaleracer]

No one ran me off... I am reading more than posting..

Just so everyone knows

We will mock up a 500e over the winter, my pipe bender does not resume business until feb 2014 so I can't mass produce anything till then.

I will try to have a running proto of the exhaust for sound checks and dyno numbers to see where I am at.

The only things that are slowing me down in the 500e development are.
1. Cylinder head pnp on my 16v project
2. New headers for the 16v

my goal is to finish these over the winter and jump on the 500e.

But we will look into a manual trans and consider possibly an auto trans.



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[Germanautoservice]

Happy to report should be putting the new intake manifold on the car tomm eve. We will se how it works... Lol

 

[Roma_500E]

I do not understand why people so worry about power gains from the exhaust ? 036 has enough power for what it is.

For me I am looking to get better (deep brutal but smooth MB ) sound. In addition some nice exhaust tips pattern (Brabus) . So I would love to get exhaust that would replicate brabus muffler (especially sideways tips) and have great sound. I do not care about power gain, anyway it is not gonna make big difference. IMHO

 

[Germanautoservice]

I do not understand why people so worry about power gains from the exhaust ? 036 has enough power for what it is.

For me I am looking to get better (deep brutal but smooth MB ) sound. In addition some nice exhaust tips pattern (Brabus) . So I would love to get exhaust that would replicate brabus muffler (especially sideways tips) and have great sound. I do not care about power gain, anyway it is not gonna make big difference. IMHO

its never enough enough power!!! 15-20 hp same in torque is huge. My e55 is fast out of the box, now with 1050 hp at the flywheel I still want more from that....
It's a sickness roman... Lol
On a side note roman, we are attending the Paul walker memorial cruise, are you? If so ride with our group. Let me know

 

[Roma_500E]

its never enough enough power!!! 15-20 hp same in torque is huge. My e55 is fast out of the box, now with 1050 hp at the flywheel I still want more from that....
It's a sickness roman... Lol

Well yes , it is E55 . The 036 is completely other story . Note that decent 2004 E55 W211 is cheaper than decent 1992 500E with the two generation in difference !! That makes a point about 500E. All AMGs (except Hammer W124/C124, W124 E60, W126/C126 AMGs) are built to be abused/raced/modified. Agree on that.

On a side note roman, we are attending the Paul walker memorial cruise, are you? If so ride with our group. Let me know

I wish but did you look outside on streets ?
I do not want cruise on Subaru, lol . None of the MBZs will be drivable on summer tires in such a nasty weather.

 

[5thscaleracer]

Did I get thread jacked? I think I did...


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[gerryvz]

Did I get thread jacked? I think I did...


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We have good moderators here, they will take care of that.

 

[Aston Martin]

Happy to report should be putting the new intake manifold on the car tomm eve. We will se how it works... Lol

what is the update, waiting for end result

 

[-Mackan-]

I'm very interested, keep up the good work!

 

[500AMM]

Once I have the car on the lift I'll start looking at layout. The x-pipe needs to be in the correct place to be able to do what it's suppost to do. It's all about physics and last time I checked that hasn't changed in a while lol. Have to achieve proper heat levels and flow. Hotter gases flow better pulling exhaust thru the car, this creating horsepower and torque....

Hello.

Interesting reading on this thread. Yes, hotter exhaust gasses flows better due to faster expansion, supposed the expansion is given to happen with correct collector location and pipe size. It would be nice to see your calcs on the exhaust, are you using a data program?

-a-

 

[Germanautoservice]

I do have a program I use, lots of math involved. But with our current temps of -25 the influx of broken cars has over run the shop. Personal projects are on hold. :-( will resume the project soon. Haven't forgot....

 

[500AMM]

I do have a program I use, lots of math involved. But with our current temps of -25 the influx of broken cars has over run the shop. Personal projects are on hold. :-( will resume the project soon. Haven't forgot....

Aha - that sounds good! This is thermodynamics and physics at its best, and the only way to proven success.

I see you have a hard climate at the moment, so take care but do enjoy the extra income too. Over here we have a historical mild winter with a lot of rain and no snow below 500m altitude - even the ground frost is gone.

-a-

 

[8899]

No one ran me off... I am reading more than posting..

Just so everyone knows

We will mock up a 500e over the winter, my pipe bender does not resume business until feb 2014 so I can't mass produce anything till then.

I will try to have a running proto of the exhaust for sound checks and dyno numbers to see where I am at.

The only things that are slowing me down in the 500e development are.
1. Cylinder head pnp on my 16v project
2. New headers for the 16v

my goal is to finish these over the winter and jump on the 500e.

But we will look into a manual trans and consider possibly an auto trans.

Any updates???

 

[5thscaleracer]

Finishing up Cla exhaust kit and a few other kits before doing the 500e.


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[Cannoli]

The plenum needs to bigger, I did delete the egr. No need for it. Now this intake will be more for a turbo application but I will revisit for a na normal driver. I'm mounting the tb much different from factory so it won't be for all. But I know even na this will unleash a lot of power.

Not to high-jack this thread, but any chance of you considering a new manifold to use a CARB approved supercharger like Whipple's? Similar to MB's design.

http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/product.asp?ProdID=1162

 

[Jackasic]

doable, you will just need to run stand alone to make it work. the carb comes from the efi tuning, not just the SC alone.

 

[5thscaleracer]

Alright my projects are starting to thin out..

16v header -done
cla parts - done
332x32 bbk kit for w201 & w124 - almost done
so I should be starting on the 500e exhaust project soon.

 

[gerryvz]

Alright my projects are starting to thin out..

16v header -done
cla parts - done
332x32 bbk kit for w201 & w124 - almost done
so I should be starting on the 500e exhaust project soon.

Cool.

 

[126v8]

Looking forward