Has anyone bought a SDS system they liked recently?
-Mike
-Mike
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Anyone bought a SDS system recently?
- Thread starter quicksilver500
- Start date
Gerry that's great. I was mostly wondering where people were buying them and if there is a reliable source. I think I found these guys through one of Christian's posts...
http://www.obdresource.com/search.php?tag=mb+star
This is the unit I was looking at, they say for cars manufactured after 2012...but I think they mean before.
http://www.obdresource.com/mercedes...-benz-mb-star-05-2012-ibm-t30-OBDSTART30.html
-Mike
http://www.obdresource.com/search.php?tag=mb+star
This is the unit I was looking at, they say for cars manufactured after 2012...but I think they mean before.
http://www.obdresource.com/mercedes...-benz-mb-star-05-2012-ibm-t30-OBDSTART30.html
-Mike
There are dozens if not hundreds of vendor out there. And I've now seen a number of Chinese SDS clone copies - some that people paid a mint for, and others that were fairly inexpensive. I have yet to tell a difference between the hardware (and fundamentally on the software) for any of them. Most are using this virtual machine approach, which works fine, but just takes forever to get up and running...
I am a bit skeptical, based on what I've seen, that one Chinese clone vendor is offering anything better than any other vendor. These things are all manufactured by the same folks, and then sold to different vendors. I also put my clone SDS up next to a "real" SDS and cables, and just didn't see much difference. I'm sure with daily use (for example in a shop environment) that the "real" SDS is much tougher and rugged, but for occasional enthusiast use, the clone units are just fine.
This $920 unit at OBDResource.com is absolutely 100% identical to the Chinese clones that you can get for $200-300. Personally, I got my SDS via aliexpress.com, which was extremely safe and easy and utilized an escrow service for the payment, which gave a good level of confidence. Also, the vendor was extremely responsive to my emails, and just recently (in the past month or two, a full year after the transaction) I contacted her with another question, and she was again extremely responsive and helpful -- totally still around. There's no reason to pay $600 more when you can get the identical product - without markup - for $200-300 shipped airmail from China. The only thing you need to get is a used laptop for $100 or so via eBay. I got a ruggedized Dell laptop which has been fine, and works well in the shop environment with its ruggedized features. The laptop MUST have a serial port, though.
Cheers,
Gerry
I am a bit skeptical, based on what I've seen, that one Chinese clone vendor is offering anything better than any other vendor. These things are all manufactured by the same folks, and then sold to different vendors. I also put my clone SDS up next to a "real" SDS and cables, and just didn't see much difference. I'm sure with daily use (for example in a shop environment) that the "real" SDS is much tougher and rugged, but for occasional enthusiast use, the clone units are just fine.
This $920 unit at OBDResource.com is absolutely 100% identical to the Chinese clones that you can get for $200-300. Personally, I got my SDS via aliexpress.com, which was extremely safe and easy and utilized an escrow service for the payment, which gave a good level of confidence. Also, the vendor was extremely responsive to my emails, and just recently (in the past month or two, a full year after the transaction) I contacted her with another question, and she was again extremely responsive and helpful -- totally still around. There's no reason to pay $600 more when you can get the identical product - without markup - for $200-300 shipped airmail from China. The only thing you need to get is a used laptop for $100 or so via eBay. I got a ruggedized Dell laptop which has been fine, and works well in the shop environment with its ruggedized features. The laptop MUST have a serial port, though.
Cheers,
Gerry
Gerry
Finally had some time to check out the chinese clones. I landed on this one...
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/2012-mb-c3-star-mercedes-benz-diagnosis-multiplexer/532712682.html
I know it comes with an external and that is suppose to be slower, but I did read some articles on how it can be transferred to the internal drive. If you have any caution or feed bad let me know.
Thanks,
-Mike
Finally had some time to check out the chinese clones. I landed on this one...
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/2012-mb-c3-star-mercedes-benz-diagnosis-multiplexer/532712682.html
I know it comes with an external and that is suppose to be slower, but I did read some articles on how it can be transferred to the internal drive. If you have any caution or feed bad let me know.
Thanks,
-Mike
I transferred the contents of the external drive to my computer's internal drive, with no problem. I also backed up the hard drive to a disk image on another one of my hard drives, just to be sure it I had another backup copy of it.
I think that's pretty much the same one I got and the same seller, and it's been just fine.
I think that's pretty much the same one I got and the same seller, and it's been just fine.
Got my system in, these guys were great. Shipped fast, booted up no problem, had one issue with com ports - there was a help doc on the desktop. Pulled codes within 20 mins of starting the computer up.
very cool!
Did you use a dedicated computer?
Does it show realtime CAN data?
Any sign of malware being loaded too?.....Isn't that the major complaint about not providing the diagnostic tool with its own x86 environment?
Doug
I did not find any malware on the hard drive that came with my SDS clone. I did install it onto a separate, ruggedized Dell laptop that is optimized for production/industrial environments. It has worked fine for me, over a year now. The laptop that has the SDS installed should be a separate, standalone computer that is NOT connected to your wireless network or a physical/Ethernet network (it will try to download software updates and Windows system updates, which are really NOT needed and may mess up the system) 
The SDS does provide real-time CAN data through its HHT emulation program, which provides a carbon copy on the computer screen of the pixelated HHT display. It is functionally and visually 100% identical to the HHT.
It provides many dozens of live/real-time data feeds. Enough so that you could spend an entire night (and burn an entire tank of gas idling the car) playing around with it. I am sure GSXR has already done this with the live data
The SDS does provide real-time CAN data through its HHT emulation program, which provides a carbon copy on the computer screen of the pixelated HHT display. It is functionally and visually 100% identical to the HHT.
It provides many dozens of live/real-time data feeds. Enough so that you could spend an entire night (and burn an entire tank of gas idling the car) playing around with it. I am sure GSXR has already done this with the live data
My experience was the same as Gerry, no mal where and it emulates the HHT the same as the factory units. I am using a dell laptop.
LOL ! Aye, that's an understatement. Although not necessary much of the time ... the blink code reader really is much faster and easier to work with. The SDS is more of a "heavy gun" when needed....
The SDSes will work with anything that is a 129, 140, and newer. It's super great starting on 210s and all newer cars -- MUCH more data and stuff to play with on more modern cars. Unfortunately being OBD-I and first-gen CAN/electronics, our .036s have relatively little built-in instrumentation & fault specificity compared to newer cars.
That's both a good thing ... and a curse..... I tend to look at it as more of a good thing (less complexity).
Cheers,
Gerry
I've bought both the SDS C3 and C4 from uobd2.com. They took 4-5 working days to deliver. The support during the order, and by phone, email and by skype afterwards has been very good. There is some delay when requesting for a technician to do remote support via TeamViewer if you need such technical help. The units I bought are applicable with any type of laptop/pc through an external hard drive and the diagnose box via pcmcia serial port adapter. The emulated Windows XP IBM T30/Dell 630 machine is started by launching the VMWare virtual file that comes with the hard drive, and the only thing you need to install on your native system is the VMWare Client that does the launch, plus the driver that goes with the diagnose box. They both come with the hard drive. Also, the port that the pcmcia serial adapter should be set up to use is port #1.
I've used a 9 year old IBM T60 laptop, running 1GB RAM on the virtual machine, which works but is slow. I succesfully ran the HHT on my 500E, and read all codes and could use all the functionality. To use Xentry you need to send the hardware id to them, in order to unlock it with the application ids you receive back. You can update the system online.
I've also tried a 3 year old laptop that was a lot faster. Took about 5-10 seconds to initialize the diagnose box with the virtual Windows host, and off you go. I bet a new laptop will perform even better. Alternatives are buying a T30 or Dell 630 laptop (in used condition) from the same dealer. But those are old laptops, so I'm sceptical if they are as fast.
Both the products I bought ($650 each) handle all Mercedes Benz cars, and also trucks (top version). You get a set of diagnose wires, I think there were 5 different ones for all the different models/systems. The latest firmware supports cars up to 2013.01 I think.
If you run the virtual machine using VMWare, the image is reset every time you launch it unless you decide to save the session. The VM is also running in a separate environment, so I don't think malware would be a problem. I also don't think it would be a problem connecting it to a wireless/ethernet network, as long as other clients are secured. The malware would end up on the virtual machine, which would be reset when you turn off the virtual machine session. Correct me if I'm wrong here. I've yet to detect any malware on those I bought. I really doubt they exist, if you buy from a serious vendor.
I've used a 9 year old IBM T60 laptop, running 1GB RAM on the virtual machine, which works but is slow. I succesfully ran the HHT on my 500E, and read all codes and could use all the functionality. To use Xentry you need to send the hardware id to them, in order to unlock it with the application ids you receive back. You can update the system online.
I've also tried a 3 year old laptop that was a lot faster. Took about 5-10 seconds to initialize the diagnose box with the virtual Windows host, and off you go. I bet a new laptop will perform even better. Alternatives are buying a T30 or Dell 630 laptop (in used condition) from the same dealer. But those are old laptops, so I'm sceptical if they are as fast.
Both the products I bought ($650 each) handle all Mercedes Benz cars, and also trucks (top version). You get a set of diagnose wires, I think there were 5 different ones for all the different models/systems. The latest firmware supports cars up to 2013.01 I think.
If you run the virtual machine using VMWare, the image is reset every time you launch it unless you decide to save the session. The VM is also running in a separate environment, so I don't think malware would be a problem. I also don't think it would be a problem connecting it to a wireless/ethernet network, as long as other clients are secured. The malware would end up on the virtual machine, which would be reset when you turn off the virtual machine session. Correct me if I'm wrong here. I've yet to detect any malware on those I bought. I really doubt they exist, if you buy from a serious vendor.
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What do you guys think of this one?
http://www.diagmaker.com/mb-star-c3...4.html?t=usa&gclid=CNHlvPr2tLkCFcN9OgodST8ADg
http://www.diagmaker.com/mb-star-c3...4.html?t=usa&gclid=CNHlvPr2tLkCFcN9OgodST8ADg
It's expensive, because it doesn't have the hard drive with it. You NEED the external hard drive (or an internal hard drive, whatever you prefer) becuase it has all of the software.
For about that price, you can order the full kit with the hard drive from a Chinese vendor (as I indicated in my other post about Exploring the C3). And you will need a laptop with a serial port (that is IMPORTANT) to connect to the car. You should buy a used IBM or Dell laptop to use. I have a label on my Dell laptop that says "For Garage Use Only" and it is a ruggedized version of the Dell made for industrial use. I got it on eBay for about $100 IIRC. Doesn't have to be a state of the art model, just needs to be able to run Windows XP and have a serial port.
You also have the option of buying an internal hard drive with the software loaded on it, which you just install in certain models of laptop (IBM T30 and a few other models) and you go from there.
Or, you can buy the whole thing (laptop + hard drive + cables + multiplexer) as a package from one of the Chinese vendors for around $400-600.
BTW there are no differences in the "aftermarket" (clone) SDS C3 systems. They are like Fake Rolex watches - ALL of them are made in China, and various vendors ... whatever side of the Pacific they happen to be on ... charge varying prices for the identical hardware. It all comes out of the same factories in China.
Cheers,
Gerry
Gerry, can you help me to understand what the main advantage of the SDS system is versus the hand held Snap-On unit as it relates to the 034/036? My understanding -- and it could be wrong -- is that the hand held unit will not give you live data but will still allow you to read the digital codes that allow you to better pinpoint a problem, like the six digital codes listed under DTC 2 of the EA/CC/ISC.
I am hesitant about getting into something that requires computer skills that could be well beyond my expertise. For Trae's surging problem, do you think it is likely that a hand held unit would give him the same answer as the more elaborate SDS?
I am hesitant about getting into something that requires computer skills that could be well beyond my expertise. For Trae's surging problem, do you think it is likely that a hand held unit would give him the same answer as the more elaborate SDS?
The Snap-On MT2500 setup (with appropriate cartridge & cables) will communicate with LH, BM, E-GAS, and DM properly; and will show live data and also codes from these modules. There is a glitch where it may not always show live data from the EZL, but it will show codes. It will NOT communicate with ABS/ASR (no codes, no live data) and will not pull blink codes from the SRS or HVAC systems. You need the "red brick" (three variations are available), MB software (the 2003 cartridge copies are available cheap), 38-pin cable and three keys (usually cheapest to buy from Snap-On website directly, not eBay).
The SDS will communicate with everything except HVAC or SRS, you still need an analog blink code reader for those. The SDS has a software error where it tries to communiate with SRS but claims there is a communication error. This is not correct, the SRS module in the W124 is not capable of digital communication. That started with the W140 chassis around 1994. I never understood why MB never fixed that software bug in the HHT / SDS.
The SDS will communicate with everything except HVAC or SRS, you still need an analog blink code reader for those. The SDS has a software error where it tries to communiate with SRS but claims there is a communication error. This is not correct, the SRS module in the W124 is not capable of digital communication. That started with the W140 chassis around 1994. I never understood why MB never fixed that software bug in the HHT / SDS.
Honestly, with the exception of the digital codes that help pinpoint more specific causes on one or two systems..... you can really get away with a home-brew blink code reader, which will pull codes from all systems (just not the few digital codes). A system like the Trisco PalmScan (which I have) makes all this just a BIT easier, because it provides all codes and readouts (again, sans the detailed digital codes) in a more user-frlendly handheld unit.
ONLY the MB HHT (handheld tester), the STAR C3/C4, and the SnapOn unit that Dave mentioned will give you live data. My experience, to be very honest, is that for the average Joe, me included, having live data is really something of a play-toy rather than something that is highly usable. IMHO, playing with live data on the 036 is a form of automotive masturbation. (Psst, don't tell that to GSXR). The reason I say this is because as first-generation CAN + OBD1 cars, our 034/036 cars have very very limited windows into the systems, limited depth of diagnostic codes, and limited streams of live data. When you compare this to say, a W210 and then a 211 or 212, you see HUGE changes and additions as to what data is accessible, identifiable, diagnosable, and reprogrammable if needed. Live data can help in some complex automotive diagnostic situations, but how many times have you seen posts here to the effect of "I analyzed the live data stream coming from my 500E, and determined that XXXX was happening, which led me to believe that Condition YYYYY was present, resulting in fix ZZZZZ." Usually it's more of a visual/mechanical/blink code based process, at least on our cars.
Our 036 systems are very crude by modern standards, and even the C3/C4 only include the HHT to access the live data in an "emulation" mode, meaning the HHT is recreated in software, and combined with the rest of the C3/C4 which is designed for the more modern cars up to the present time.
So bottom line, and reinforcing my earlier point ... using the C3 is like using the fork on a Swiss Army knife to eat a piece of steak. Works great, but there are dozens of other tools that the knife has, that will never be used to eat that steak, yet could be useful for other types of cooking, starting fires, cutting, dressing a piece of game, and so on. While the C3 is the "ultimate" and most capable tool for our 036 diagnosis, we're only using, and only will ever use, a small fraction of its capabilities on the 036. That's why the blink code home-brewer, the Trisco, or the MB HHT hardware unit (which is as rare as hen's teeth) are attractive options, because they are much more designed to match our cars in terms of the capabilities they provide.
If I could ever find a used, but reasonably priced HHT, I'd snap it up in seconds, and probably sell my C3 to someone who can better use it than me. All I need is an HHT. I use my homebrewer MUCH more than I use my C3, BTW.
Cheers,
Gerry
P.S. It's all one reason why I love the 126. All you need to diagnose things there, is a home-brew blink code tester (and very few systems to test) and a $40 digital multimeter to test voltages in the fuel injection system, and duty cycle. For $50 worth of tools, you have everything you need. And the late 126 only has three computers ...
ONLY the MB HHT (handheld tester), the STAR C3/C4, and the SnapOn unit that Dave mentioned will give you live data. My experience, to be very honest, is that for the average Joe, me included, having live data is really something of a play-toy rather than something that is highly usable. IMHO, playing with live data on the 036 is a form of automotive masturbation. (Psst, don't tell that to GSXR). The reason I say this is because as first-generation CAN + OBD1 cars, our 034/036 cars have very very limited windows into the systems, limited depth of diagnostic codes, and limited streams of live data. When you compare this to say, a W210 and then a 211 or 212, you see HUGE changes and additions as to what data is accessible, identifiable, diagnosable, and reprogrammable if needed. Live data can help in some complex automotive diagnostic situations, but how many times have you seen posts here to the effect of "I analyzed the live data stream coming from my 500E, and determined that XXXX was happening, which led me to believe that Condition YYYYY was present, resulting in fix ZZZZZ." Usually it's more of a visual/mechanical/blink code based process, at least on our cars.
Our 036 systems are very crude by modern standards, and even the C3/C4 only include the HHT to access the live data in an "emulation" mode, meaning the HHT is recreated in software, and combined with the rest of the C3/C4 which is designed for the more modern cars up to the present time.
So bottom line, and reinforcing my earlier point ... using the C3 is like using the fork on a Swiss Army knife to eat a piece of steak. Works great, but there are dozens of other tools that the knife has, that will never be used to eat that steak, yet could be useful for other types of cooking, starting fires, cutting, dressing a piece of game, and so on. While the C3 is the "ultimate" and most capable tool for our 036 diagnosis, we're only using, and only will ever use, a small fraction of its capabilities on the 036. That's why the blink code home-brewer, the Trisco, or the MB HHT hardware unit (which is as rare as hen's teeth) are attractive options, because they are much more designed to match our cars in terms of the capabilities they provide.
If I could ever find a used, but reasonably priced HHT, I'd snap it up in seconds, and probably sell my C3 to someone who can better use it than me. All I need is an HHT. I use my homebrewer MUCH more than I use my C3, BTW.
Cheers,
Gerry
P.S. It's all one reason why I love the 126. All you need to diagnose things there, is a home-brew blink code tester (and very few systems to test) and a $40 digital multimeter to test voltages in the fuel injection system, and duty cycle. For $50 worth of tools, you have everything you need. And the late 126 only has three computers ...
I politely disagree with Herr Honcho. There is a LOT of data available from our OBD-1 systems. However he is correct that unless you know how to interpret what you are seeing, it won't help much. But it can help a lot if you can post the data to a forum where someone else can interpret it for you. The only advantage of the HHT over SDS is speed. No waiting for XP to boot or for emulated software to run. Functionality is identical.
Thanks, guys. Looking at Dave's DTC handout, the only digital codes I'm seeing are the three-digit codes under the EA/CC/ISC, where there is more than one meaning to the one or two digit blink code. Are there other digital codes for the 034/036 on other modules? I can't find any if there are.
Not to beat a dead horse, but is it true that an HHT or Snap-On tester would allow me to read these digital codes that I couldn't otherwise read with the blink code tester and pretty much nothing more?
Not to beat a dead horse, but is it true that an HHT or Snap-On tester would allow me to read these digital codes that I couldn't otherwise read with the blink code tester and pretty much nothing more?
That's the reason why we keep you around here and that you make the big bucks as chief 500E MB Mycologist.....
Correct. Only E-GAS has 3-digit codes.
Correct. The only way to access those 3-digit codes is with a digital scanner like the SDS, HHT, Snap-On, or similar scanner with MB OBD-1 digital capabilities.
And the amount of extra money that you have to pay to read those digital codes (and play with live data, if you are so inclined) via HHT, SDS or Snap-On is many hundreds of dollars more than the blink-code reader, which gives you all other codes, plus the "basic" blink codes for the system(s) where the digital codes provide drilldown.Correct. Only E-GAS has 3-digit codes.
Correct. The only way to access those 3-digit codes is with a digital scanner like the SDS, HHT, Snap-On, or similar scanner with MB OBD-1 digital capabilities.
For most people it's not an economically feasible proposition.....
For basic code reading, yes. The analog blinker box is great. MOST of the time, this is all that is needed for general diagnostics. But in some instances, the digital codes from E-GAS can be very useful in pinpointing which item is causing the problem (specifically, E-GAS blink code #2). Basic DIY'er = blinker box. Advanced DIY'er = digital scanner.
Well, it depends. Most dealers will charge $100+ just to pull codes and give you a printout, nothing else. And the dealers don't always interpret the codes properly... they can tend to throw parts at a problem. The $300-$500 investment up front for the SDS could pay for itself with one problem where you didn't have to pay $$$$ to the dealer or indy shop. Again, it depends on your DIY level. It makes a lot more sense for the advanced DIY'er.
Additionally, if you have 2 (or more) cars with M119's and LH injection, this is a HUGE help. You can compare live data between the two cars. That makes it easy to determine if a particular value is waaaay different on the car that is running well vs the car that is not.
On this forum, this would pretty much solely be YOU. And of course Jono and Jackasic as shop/business owners, so they would be beyond the DIY category. The rest of us are DIY peons.....
By the way, this Yoink was/is accepted, and appreciated !!It's not just that, but for GVZ to yank his chain.and have a sparring partner
I bought a full C3 Star setup from Pro Auto Diagnostics UK in late 2016- around 700USD IIRC. It came with a Dell laptop and the C3 Multiplexer was made in France. It worked A1 on a variety of Mercedes models of mine and only had light / careful use. However the hard drive supplied made it painfully slow (Like 3, 4 minutes just to start up) so I had my IT guy install a new Solid state HDD cloned from the original HDD and it is much faster now. HOWEVER- upon trying to use it it will now not connect. Error message as below.
Has anyone else had the issue above?
My IT guy is good and tried everything he could to eliminate the new HDD being at fault – even by fitting in the original HDD again to test. Still the same result. I am not sure what is going on with it but it is now down & out. I am in talks with the supplier to see if he will test / reinstall / repair it for me at my expense (Since it is long out of the 1 Year warranty) I may end up junking it and buying yet another setup off him – this time a C4. That is if my C3 setup is terminal and non repairable for whatever reason. It could be a hardware issue with the multiplexer for all I know.
EDIT - I just phoned the supplier and he agreed for me to send him the laptop for repair. He said the error message would suggest the software is corrupted and a fresh install should cure it. Fingers crossed! It really is awesome having your own Star setup. On my W211 I was able to do my own offline coding and diagnostics so it was a life saver.
Has anyone else had the issue above?
My IT guy is good and tried everything he could to eliminate the new HDD being at fault – even by fitting in the original HDD again to test. Still the same result. I am not sure what is going on with it but it is now down & out. I am in talks with the supplier to see if he will test / reinstall / repair it for me at my expense (Since it is long out of the 1 Year warranty) I may end up junking it and buying yet another setup off him – this time a C4. That is if my C3 setup is terminal and non repairable for whatever reason. It could be a hardware issue with the multiplexer for all I know.
EDIT - I just phoned the supplier and he agreed for me to send him the laptop for repair. He said the error message would suggest the software is corrupted and a fresh install should cure it. Fingers crossed! It really is awesome having your own Star setup. On my W211 I was able to do my own offline coding and diagnostics so it was a life saver.
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Joe, any chance you just need to re-enter the license keys? The SDS system uses both a LAN / MAC ID, and also a separate "Hardware ID". The latter may somehow be generated based on the laptop components, and the hardware ID may have changed after the SSD upgrade.
If your EPC + WIS worked fine after the swap, but DAS / Xentry did not, a new license key may fix it. Worth a try anyway. Did your system include a keygen? If you don't have the developer mode, you'll want that for a W211.
If your EPC + WIS worked fine after the swap, but DAS / Xentry did not, a new license key may fix it. Worth a try anyway. Did your system include a keygen? If you don't have the developer mode, you'll want that for a W211.
Joe, any chance you just need to re-enter the license keys? The SDS system uses both a LAN / MAC ID, and also a separate "Hardware ID". The latter may somehow be generated based on the laptop components, and the hardware ID may have changed after the SSD upgrade.
If your EPC + WIS worked fine after the swap, but DAS / Xentry did not, a new license key may fix it. Worth a try anyway. Did your system include a keygen? If you don't have the developer mode, you'll want that for a W211.
Hi Dave,
I bought the system ready to go out of the box so to speak. As such the vendor did not include any of the license keys or what not. Indeed he keeps this information back and instead offers unlimited 24 hr phone support which is very good to be fair as he resolved some issues before for me in the past. At first the EPC and all that stuff was down when new the solid state HHD was installed - it would not access those programmes. My IT guy said it was possibly looking for the HDD serial code to match the original drive. So he changed the new Solid state HDD's serial number to match the original HDD and the other software worked OK again after that. ‘Just’ this connectivity issue remained.
It could be the C3 mulitplexer is somehow faulty. The last car I tried to connect to it, prior to the HDD upgrade was a friend’s W124 with the banana connectors. Star could not connect on that occasion. I did not try to connect Star to any other car IIRC until months later post HHD upgrade when this new issue arose. (So it could have been like this pre HHD upgrade)
The Vendor of the C3 system is taking it back to install my new Solid State HDD (now removed) and do a fresh software install.
I will also send him the C3 mulitplexer and cables too and ask him to verify it is functional before he does any of the software stuff. I’ll have to pay for all this since it's out of warranty but that’s OK I’m already in the hole for the new Solid State drive + labour and have a large paperweight to show for it!
