we'll be living in a Ghost in the Shell (Laughing Man series), Ready Player One, Hunger Games/Squid Game environment soon enough
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Electric car impact on fuel availabilty and pricing in future(?)
- Thread starter JC220
- Start date
Well, we'll know the noose is tightening around the neck of ICE owners when they start taxing ICE vehicles by the mile driven, while exempting EV owners from these taxes.
Or as you say, they'll just do to gasoline taxes what they did to those evil cigarettes, and raise the taxes so they're pretty much unaffordable. Heck, California started pioneering mad gasoline taxes decades ago......
Speaking of cigarettes...... one question that perhaps someone here on the forum can honestly and logically answer with a straight face:
Why is it that cigarette smokers are under strict rules (no smoking indoors in public establishments, no smoking within XX feet of a building entrance, etc.) while marijuana smokers, whether legal or not, walk around everywhere smoking carelessly, free to roam? When marijuana smoke is proven to be even deadlier/more cancerous than tobacco smoke?
Anyone walked around the downtown of any big city lately? Seattle? New York City? San Francisco? Boston? Baltimore? Washington DC?
You LITERALLY have to put your outside air "recirc" function on, because otherwise you get marijuana smoke inside your car from all the people walking around, exhaling. But tobacco smoking ... NO NO NO BAD BAD BAD.
Anyone?
Not quite yet, but they are heading in the wrong direction:
Rivian Lays Off 10% Of Workforce As Fellow EV Startup Lucid Production Forecast Underwhelms. Elon Musk Expects Bankruptcies.
Rivian plummeted early Thursday after reporting Q4 earnings and revenue Wednesday.
www.investors.com
Once the darling of the EV world, the electric truck-maker Rivian is reeling
Electric truck maker Rivian was once seen as a rising star in the EV space. But now the company says it will lay off 10% of its employees, and its production targets for this year are coming in lower than expected.
www.latimes.com
"This year’s projections cast “a dark cloud around the story,” said Dan Ives, managing director and senior equity analyst at Wedbush Securities. “Cutting costs and headcount to reflect a softer environment and production issues,” he wrote in an email. “Rivian went from a Cinderella story to a horror show.”"
Disclaimer: I don't know which direction the above news outlets point - Right, Left, or Other. Apply grains of salt as required.
I actually corrected someone who singled me out for smoking Marijuana as i was next to a cigarette smoker, the new law here (NYC) is you can smoke anywhere smoking cigarettes is allowedWell, we'll know the noose is tightening around the neck of ICE owners when they start taxing ICE vehicles by the mile driven, while exempting EV owners from these taxes.
Or as you say, they'll just do to gasoline taxes what they did to those evil cigarettes, and raise the taxes so they're pretty much unaffordable. Heck, California started pioneering mad gasoline taxes decades ago......
Speaking of cigarettes...... one question that perhaps someone here on the forum can honestly and logically answer with a straight face:
Why is it that cigarette smokers are under strict rules (no smoking indoors in public establishments, no smoking within XX feet of a building entrance, etc.) while marijuana smokers, whether legal or not, walk around everywhere smoking carelessly, free to roam? When marijuana smoke is proven to be even deadlier/more cancerous than tobacco smoke?
Anyone walked around the downtown of any big city lately? Seattle? New York City? San Francisco? Boston? Baltimore? Washington DC?
You LITERALLY have to put your outside air "recirc" function on, because otherwise you get marijuana smoke inside your car from all the people walking around, exhaling. But tobacco smoking ... NO NO NO BAD BAD BAD.
Anyone?
I dont smoke the stickie ickie on the regular at all really, ill follow the rules if we all follow the rules.
I was in lower California last year and notice a sulfur type smell driving at night and remembered, this is an oil producing region and I started looking out for 'fake' buildings covering the pumps and gas was about 5/6 bucks maybe more...
Oh Rivian... the Bushwick office location has nothing but ice vehicles parked in the lotNot quite yet, but they are heading in the wrong direction:
Rivian Lays Off 10% Of Workforce As Fellow EV Startup Lucid Production Forecast Underwhelms. Elon Musk Expects Bankruptcies.
Rivian plummeted early Thursday after reporting Q4 earnings and revenue Wednesday.
Once the darling of the EV world, the electric truck-maker Rivian is reeling
Electric truck maker Rivian was once seen as a rising star in the EV space. But now the company says it will lay off 10% of its employees, and its production targets for this year are coming in lower than expected.
"This year’s projections cast “a dark cloud around the story,” said Dan Ives, managing director and senior equity analyst at Wedbush Securities. “Cutting costs and headcount to reflect a softer environment and production issues,” he wrote in an email. “Rivian went from a Cinderella story to a horror show.”"
Disclaimer: I don't know which direction the above news outlets point - Right, Left, or Other. Apply grains of salt as required.
LA Times -- center to bordering hard Left
Investor's Business Daily -- center to bordering hard Right
Mercedes-Benz chief vows to build petrol cars ‘well into’ 2030s
The boss of German car giant Mercedes-Benz has said it will make petrol cars “well into the 2030s” as it watered down its targets for electric vehicle (EV) sales.
Mercedes-Benz chief vows to build petrol cars ‘well into’ 2030s
They WERE saying cars would be all-electric, and ICE would be dead, by 2030. 
Now they're saying ICE will be around "well into" the 2030's, implying 2034-2035 anyway.
And yup, I agree.... add a few decades. That assumes technology will keep improving exponentially, not incrementally.... ditto for infrastructure. Otherwise, add more decades.
Now they're saying ICE will be around "well into" the 2030's, implying 2034-2035 anyway.
And yup, I agree.... add a few decades. That assumes technology will keep improving exponentially, not incrementally.... ditto for infrastructure. Otherwise, add more decades.
A bit of related trivia I learned today:
In 1975, the USA produced 8 million BOE/D (barrels of oil equiv per day) which at the time was far below our needs. From our favorable energy position at the conclusion of WW2 in 1945, we had retreated to become heavily dependent on foreign suppliers by 1975.
By 2007, our production had fallen further still to 5 million BOE/D and our dependence on unstable foreign suppliers had increased w declining native output and increased domestic demand.
2011 saw the shale revolution and now the USA produces 13 million BOE/D and we are energy independent on foreign suppliers and are in a much much stronger position - much stronger, strategically speaking, than we have been in generations.
Does electrification of our transport infrastructure change our dependence / independence on foreign sources of materials?
In 1975, the USA produced 8 million BOE/D (barrels of oil equiv per day) which at the time was far below our needs. From our favorable energy position at the conclusion of WW2 in 1945, we had retreated to become heavily dependent on foreign suppliers by 1975.
By 2007, our production had fallen further still to 5 million BOE/D and our dependence on unstable foreign suppliers had increased w declining native output and increased domestic demand.
2011 saw the shale revolution and now the USA produces 13 million BOE/D and we are energy independent on foreign suppliers and are in a much much stronger position - much stronger, strategically speaking, than we have been in generations.
Does electrification of our transport infrastructure change our dependence / independence on foreign sources of materials?
if they can make another M159 engine fit into a M156 chassis a little easier, that would be amazing! they're still using them in the GT race cars still
Mercedes-Benz chief vows to build petrol cars ‘well into’ 2030s
The boss of German car giant Mercedes-Benz has said it will make petrol cars “well into the 2030s” as it watered down its targets for electric vehicle (EV) sales.finance.yahoo.com
Mercedes-Benz chief vows to build petrol cars ‘well into’ 2030s
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Here is a trending thread on Reddit - upset Tesla owner looking at his Tesla charging app, which has been loaded with the latest PG&E utility rates. The owner is upset because he/she/martian/dog is saving a grand total of zero dollars and zero cents using electricity over gasoline. https://www.reddit.com/r/bayarea/s/LJKfK5UXQk
That's pretty funny. The woman threatens the property owner that her husband is an attorney, despite trespassing on his property and using his services without permission.
If that had been me, and I was still living in Texas, any dawdling more than 30 seconds after a stern but polite order to leave the premises would have had me holding her and her car at gunpoint after a call to the Montgomery County sheriff, waiting for a deputy to arrive and arrest her for trespassing and theft. And in Texas, they would absolutely do it.
Here in Maryland, she would be well within her rights to take whatever power she wants to, with the homeowner having no legal rights or authority to remove her from the property.
Note to the owner of that charging station: I'd consider putting a lock-box over it to keep people like her out.
It is interesting what the folks in Hawaii did. There are some funny pop culture references, etc. But if you set those aside..."We're the government -- we know best."
"You don't need that gun that is your constitutional right to own and carry -- having guns makes other people feel less safe, so you shouldn't have it."
or there's Hawaii's take on it ... they just flip the bird to the US Constitution and their own state constitution altogether. Can't wait to see this idiotic state supreme court get humbled and fully PWNED in court.
Hawai’i Supreme Court Says No Right to Bear Arms in Public
The Hawai’i Constitution doesn’t recognize a right to bear arms in public, the Hawai’i Supreme Court said, criticizing the reasoning used by the US Supreme Court to recognize the right in the Second Amendment.news.bloomberglaw.com
"Gun use has changed and a “backward-looking approach ignores today’s realities,” the court said. “As the world turns, it makes no sense for contemporary society to pledge allegiance to the founding era’s culture, realities, laws, and understanding of the Constitution,” it said."
The US Bill of Rights was ratified in 1791 (which includes 2nd amendment). The opinion from the supreme court for this recent decision includes a statement:
Hawaii then allowed licensed firearms from 1896 onward. Those laws were already in effect when Hawaii was annexed as a territory (1898). It later became a state officially in 1959.
I think the judgement might be trying to force the federal hand. Hawaii has historical proof of more recently written firearm regulation before it was annexed as a territory. If appealed, they (Hawaii) might try to say that gun laws seem to be written in a way that can only be interpreted from 1791 (Bill of Rights) until 1833 (when Hawaii banned). The forcing the hand could be for the US supreme court (by appealing) to potentially deem the 2nd amendment as dated or out of date.
For what it's worth about my personal take: I'm not a government person
I have a concealed carry license, even though Arizona has constitutional conceal carry. I will drive my W124 until it dies, fuel is no longer available, or I die (whichever comes first).
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It's actually good news. They are rushing with EV nonsense for nothing than grabbing some quick cash trending.They WERE saying cars would be all-electric, and ICE would be dead, by 2030.
Now they're saying ICE will be around "well into" the 2030's, implying 2034-2035 anyway.
And yup, I agree.... add a few decades. That assumes technology will keep improving exponentially, not incrementally.... ditto for infrastructure. Otherwise, add more decades.
It was the same with home estates if I remember correctly that Miami was suppose to be drown by the sea because of the environment so the estates prices is lowered or people is moving out. Then a rich man is buying them all and sell it in high profit. Correct me if I'm wrong but that was during the early 2010s or so?
Unfortunately, though, as a state in the United States, Hawaii is bound by the US Constitution, which applies to all states equally and trumps all other laws and state constitutions. If this "historical" perspective that Hawaii has were true, Texas (which was also a Republic and a sovereign nation until it became a US state in 1845), could also take license with this given Hawaii's "reasoning". But, you see, they haven't, becuase Texas recognizes the US constitution.It is interesting what the folks in Hawaii did. There are some funny pop culture references, etc. But if you set those aside...
The US Bill of Rights was ratified in 1791 (which includes 2nd amendment). The opinion from the supreme court for this recent decision includes a statement:
Hawaii then allowed licensed firearms from 1896 onward. Those laws were already in effect when Hawaii was annexed as a territory (1898). It later became a state officially in 1959.
I think the judgement might be trying to force the federal hand. Hawaii has historical proof of more recently written firearm regulation before it was annexed as a territory. If appealed, they (Hawaii) might try to say that gun laws seem to be written in a way that can only be interpreted from 1791 (Bill of Rights) until 1833 (when Hawaii banned). The forcing the hand could be for the US supreme court (by appealing) to potentially deem the 2nd amendment as dated or out of date.
For what it's worth about my personal take: I'm not a government person
Also, the language of the state constitution of Hawaii literally mirrors the second amendment and related language. The state constitution should trump any "historical perspective" gobbledygook. If they want to change it, the Hawaii state legislature should change it. However, the second amendment in the US constitution, and Supreme Court clarification of it, reigns supreme in all states in the US, and will for Hawaii as well -- as long as Hawaii remains a US state.
With the recent US Supreme Court Bruen decision, it is slightly easier to get a concealed carry permit in Maryland (though the legislature here in Annapolis is literally this week deliberating on a bill that will require all permit owners to carry a $300K insurance policy in order to carry -- again, like a poll tax, something that is blatantly unconstitutional. It's not legal to have to pay a fee or pay money to have a constitutional right. Getting permits this year is on my wife's and my bucket lists, for both of us. The crime here (even in Annapolis) in the populated parts of Maryland, is getting really out of hand. We will no longer set foot in Baltimore (excepting the Ravens and Orioles stadiums, which are on the very edge of downtown), and pretty much not in Washington DC either anymore. We will be selling our tickets to the 2024 Army/Navy game, which will be held at FedEx Field in Washington DC in December, because we don't want to expose ourselves unnecessarily to the crime and car-jackings that are running rampant in DC at the moment.
Musk said Tesla cars would rise in value, but the opposite happened
By Peter Valdes-Dapena, CNN
Published 4:00 AM EST, Sun March 3, 2024
Back in 2019, Elon Musk made an astonishing claim for Tesla vehicles. Tesla cars, he said, would go up in value, not down, after purchase.
The reason for that is Tesla’s full self-driving capability that, Musk has said, requires only some additional software updates and regulatory approval before Tesla vehicles on the road today will become fully independent. He repeated this claim as recently as June 2023.
“You can think of every car we sell or produce that has full autonomy capability as something that in the future may be worth five times what it is today,” he said in the company’s third quarter, 2023, earnings call.
And not only would the price of a used Tesla go up, but Musk also predicted a world in which Tesla’s driver assistance suite, which the company calls “Full Self-Driving” despite not fully self-driving the vehicle, would on its own be worth $100,000.
Because, with regulatory approval, your self-driving Tesla would be able to go “work” as a taxi on your behalf. All you’d have to do is sit back and collect the cash.
But four years after Musk’s 2019 prediction, the average used Tesla Model 3 is selling for $29,000. And regulatory approval for FSD has not arrived, either, as the company incrementally attempts to improve the software.
To be clear, used cars do not generally rise in value. Except for that crazy time in the early 2020s when all automotive production virtually came to a halt and almost all cars became, for a year or so, appreciating assets. Beyond that market quirk, though, Musk has been wrong.
Used Teslas have dropped precipitously in value over the past year or two, as Tesla has struggled to maintain its commanding dominance in the market for new electric vehicles. By aggressively slashing price of its own new cars and SUVs, Tesla has also created a domino effect, pushing down the values of other EVs, as well.
A domino effect
In 2020, Tesla made 80% of all EVs sold in America, according to Cox Automotive. By 2022, its EV market share had fallen to 64%. Last year, it fell further to 55%.
This was a natural development as more competitors entered the market. Car shoppers can now choose EVs from Ford, Hyundai, Kia, Audi, Volkswagen and others.
Tesla’s response was, evidently, aggressive price cuts, as it tried to slow the erosion of its EV market share. Sticker prices for new Teslas dropped about 21% over the past year, according to Cox Automotive.
During the past year, the price of a used 2021 Tesla Model 3 sedan has dropped, on average, about 29%, going from $40,522 in January of 2023 to just $28,700 in January 2024, according to data from Edmunds.com. In general, model year 2021 used vehicles of all types lost about 19.5% in value over that same period.
Tesla generally does not respond to media inquiries and did not answer questions about its pricing strategy.
Generally speaking, price changes in new vehicles have a direct impact on the price of used vehicles of the same make and model. Logically, people expect to pay less for a used car than they would for a new one. So when the price of a new car drops, the value of used versions of that model are pushed down as well.
Why buy a used car if you could get a brand new vehicle for only a little more or maybe even less, after all?
“What were the most depreciated vehicles in the industry? It’s Tesla,” said Ivan Drury, an auto pricing analyst with Edmunds.com. “It’s an exorbitant amount of money.”
Lower resale value
Brayden Wall, who lives in Colorado, bought a used 2020 Tesla Model 3 about two years ago for $51,000. He recently offered it at a Tesla dealership as a trade in, he said, and was offered only $22,000 for it.
Wall said he does not regret his decision to buy a Tesla, only his timing.
“I understand vehicles drop in value and are not investments,” he said in a text message. “But losing well over 50% of a $50,000 purchase in 18 months is a huge kick in the ass.”
The rapid drop in value of used Teslas was a big part of the reason that, in January Hertz announced it was selling 20,000 electric vehicles, the large majority of them Teslas. Rental car companies count on being able to sell cars on the used market after a certain time, which makes resale values critical to the business. Tesla’s cratering resale value hurt Herz’s bottom line.
“[T]he deployment of Teslas has become a more expensive proposition because when the [manufacturer’s suggested retail price] came down, the residual came down and the depreciation went up,” Hertz chief executive Stephen Scherr said during an earnings call last month.
The downward pressure on Tesla’s own car values has caused price competition throughout the market for used EVs.
“Tesla doesn’t throw a pebble in the pond,” Drury said, “They’re throwing boulders and it does make waves. It does have repercussions that affect the entire used EV industry.”
For instance, the average price of a used 2021 Ford Mustang Mach-E fell almost 37% over the past year. In terms of its size, price and specifications, the Mach-E is a very close competitor to the Tesla Model Y, which dropped 31% over that same period. Meanwhile, the average price of all other used model year 2021 EVs has dropped about 34%, although that figure can vary greatly, Drury said.
This is what happens in the EV market when Tesla makes a move because, although it’s less dominant, it still has an outsized impact.
Source:
VAG is a having a rough go.
The months-long import hold on certain models is just beginning to clear.
Porsche stores have been starving of inventory. And Audi is struggling with some of their products, as well.
Personally, I believe the number was much greater than 13K units, as that may not have included all the vehicles being held on the other side of the pond.
When are we going to get serious about slave labor being used to mine materials for batteries?
The months-long import hold on certain models is just beginning to clear.
Porsche stores have been starving of inventory. And Audi is struggling with some of their products, as well.
Personally, I believe the number was much greater than 13K units, as that may not have included all the vehicles being held on the other side of the pond.
When are we going to get serious about slave labor being used to mine materials for batteries?
And here come the ones born the minute before last to the rescue... https://www.cnbc.com/2024/03/09/the...ollectible-cars-market-from-tesla-to-bmw.html
maw
This won't help anything either.
Full article (quite long, worth reading):
PDF version if the above is paywalled:
Amid explosive demand, America is running out of power
AI and the boom in clean-tech manufacturing are pushing America’s power grid to the brink. Utilities can’t keep up.Vast swaths of the United States are at risk of running short of power as electricity-hungry data centers and clean-technology factories proliferate around the country, leaving utilities and regulators grasping for credible plans to expand the nation’s creaking power grid.
In Georgia, demand for industrial power is surging to record highs, with the projection of new electricity use for the next decade now 17 times what it was only recently. Arizona Public Service, the largest utility in that state, is also struggling to keep up, projecting it will be out of transmission capacity before the end of the decade absent major upgrades.
Northern Virginia needs the equivalent of several large nuclear power plants to serve all the new data centers planned and under construction. Texas, where electricity shortages are already routine on hot summer days, faces the same dilemma.
The soaring demand is touching off a scramble to try to squeeze more juice out of an aging power grid while pushing commercial customers to go to extraordinary lengths to lock down energy sources, such as building their own power plants.
“When you look at the numbers, it is staggering,” said Jason Shaw, chairman of the Georgia Public Service Commission, which regulates electricity. “It makes you scratch your head and wonder how we ended up in this situation. How were the projections that far off? This has created a challenge like we have never seen before.”
[snip]
Full article (quite long, worth reading):
PDF version if the above is paywalled:
I’m not so sure about that. As we build out infrastructure to support those needs, we will automatically be securing power for EV’s. Yes, we’ll have some struggles along the way but that’s what fuels innovation and investment.
"Infrastructure" has multiple components. If there are plenty of transmission lines and EV charging stations, that will not help if there is not enough generation capacity to feed the expanded grid.
If, as the article claims, massive datacenters are creating huge consumption... requiring even more infrastructure vs if we "only" needed to support a linear growth in EV's... this is a problem. Sure, the new demand will fuel innovation and investment, but who is going to pay for that investment? At least some of that burden will be shouldered by a lot of people who don't want or need it.
The next 800-lb gorilla entering the room is that it's borderline unpossible to bring online large amounts of NEW power generation quickly (i.e., years, not decades). Nuclear is taboo, so is fossil fuel, and Green cannot be scaled to the needed capacity. Innovation is still limited by the laws of physics. Last I heard, fusion still wasn't working (and if it ever did, might face the same NIMBY obstacles as fission generation).
VERY sore topic.
There's an approved proposal to run high voltage transmission within 1/4 mile of my home.
200' towers. Going though properties that are in conservation easements. And designated historical areas.
All to feed to data centers.
It's going to be an ugly, UGLY fight.
This infrastructure doesn't just happen. And the costs aren't being fairly distributed.
There's an approved proposal to run high voltage transmission within 1/4 mile of my home.
200' towers. Going though properties that are in conservation easements. And designated historical areas.
All to feed to data centers.
It's going to be an ugly, UGLY fight.
This infrastructure doesn't just happen. And the costs aren't being fairly distributed.
Because demonstrably none of that is true (except maybe "working hard" -- maybe).
I'll spare you the thousands of reasons why.
maw
Yeah, we don't want the newbs around here to get confused.Some people take the bait even on my poor attempts at humor ….
So I just throw cold water on it.
maw
I wouldn't buy it for one dollar
Sort of defeats the purpose... back to that whole "the tech not working" thing... the tech ain't techin'
maw
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Excuse me. This is a Benz-site sir. The perfect car for a kid's first car is a 20+ year old Mercedes-Benz with no options that costs four figures.With EV prices down and used ones less than ever, it seems to me that they are perfect for a kid's first car to drive to school or work. Older ones have limited range so your kids will never be too far away
.
OK, so here's an update from GVZ with regard to my first "true" experience with an EV:
My wife and I spent a week in Orlando on a mixed business + pleasure trip. The last couple of days we rented a car, because we wanted to visit some places outside of the immediate Orlando area. Specifically we wanted to re-visit the NASA Kennedy Space Center Visitor's Center at Cape Canaveral. This is about 60 miles from Orlando.
I rented a car through Avis, and the clerk asked me if I wanted a Tesla. Not having rented one before, I said "sure" and he directed me to the parking garage to where the car was. I arrived at the car and got inside. It was a black Tesla Model 3 -- nice enough -- the exact car that my next-door neighbor owns. I immediately found that the car only had a 68% battery charge, which equated to around 150-160 miles of range. Which was fine, as it would be enough to get us to the Kennedy Space Center and back again with range to spare.
I drove the car back to our hotel (the Sheraton Dolphin in the "Swan and Dolphin" complex at Lake Buena Vista) and picked up my wife. We set out for Cape Canaveral. Here are my driving impressions of the car:
Tesla Superchargers are definitely the way to go, vs. Level 1 or Level 2 chargers which take much much longer (we didn't deal with those) and are the chargers that you typically find in parking garages, apartment complexes, and so forth. If you are at say 50% battery on a Tesla, you can definitely within 15 minutes get up to pretty much a full charge and be on your way. This is overall more or less comparable to a gasoline fill-up. However, the full range of a Tesla Model 3 at 100% charge is only 268 miles. It's roughly comparable to my 560SEC or G320 just before the "reserve" light comes on for both of them -- I can stretch both vehicles to 300 miles gasoline range, but usually I'm looking for gas at levels below a quarter tank. But gasoline stations are MUCH easier to find everywhere than having to google for charging stations, etc.
The car's design is starting to feel very dated to me. They need to update the exterior sheet metal with a new design, pronto.
Overall, I would not buy a Tesla at this time. However, the experience made me more open to considering an EV in the future. I can definitely see the benefits of them, and there is much less mechanical complexity. The power whoosh is pretty alluring. However, there is something about the sound and mechanical cacophony of a V-8 that I just don't think I can overcome (whether MB M117, M119 or Lexus). All in all, I love the smell of gasoline.
The last thought I have is that somehow, I just don't feel that the Tesla/EV experience is 100% at prime time yet. It's close, and probably excellent for people who are urban/suburban. But for example, if we had wanted to drive from Orlando to Miami, I would have had to do more planning and put more thought into the journey that I would have with a gas car, where I'd have just hopped in and went, and found a gas station where I needed to.
So my hat is off to you EV beta testers out there. You are innovating for the rest of us and advancing things forward. But -- at least for now and well into the future -- I am going to remain with gasoline powered ICE cars. Less stress, and I enjoy maintaining and driving my MB ICE cars.
Cheers,
Gerry
My wife and I spent a week in Orlando on a mixed business + pleasure trip. The last couple of days we rented a car, because we wanted to visit some places outside of the immediate Orlando area. Specifically we wanted to re-visit the NASA Kennedy Space Center Visitor's Center at Cape Canaveral. This is about 60 miles from Orlando.
I rented a car through Avis, and the clerk asked me if I wanted a Tesla. Not having rented one before, I said "sure" and he directed me to the parking garage to where the car was. I arrived at the car and got inside. It was a black Tesla Model 3 -- nice enough -- the exact car that my next-door neighbor owns. I immediately found that the car only had a 68% battery charge, which equated to around 150-160 miles of range. Which was fine, as it would be enough to get us to the Kennedy Space Center and back again with range to spare.
I drove the car back to our hotel (the Sheraton Dolphin in the "Swan and Dolphin" complex at Lake Buena Vista) and picked up my wife. We set out for Cape Canaveral. Here are my driving impressions of the car:
- VERY smooth and lineary delivery of power. We had the car in "Chill" mode (yes, that's what it is called) and it was plenty fast on acceleration. There is a faster mode, but with traffic and all, we didn't really have the runway/highway to make much use of it.
- The lack of engine noise was a bit weird at first, but we more or less got used to it, especially when my wife connected her phone to the car via Bloot, and fired up her Sirius XM app for some good music
- Controls were pretty mimimalist, and included only two stalks - one for the turn signals, and one for the gear selection/wipers/etc. Everything else was controlled via the large center tablet/touch-screen. Once you paged through all of the software, it was pretty intuitively easy to use. I would say that overall, the software was MUCH easier to use than that on my wife's 2023 Lexus IS500F. Much less drilling down through menus -- the large Tesla screen real estate presented much more stuff on the first screens. It was nicely done.
- The car handled VERY well -- no complaints
- By the time we got to Cape Canaveral, we were down to around 40% battery power. There were three EV chargers (Level 1 only) at the Visitor's Center, and ALL THREE OF THEM WERE HOGGED FOR THE 6+ HOURS WE WERE THERE BY THE SAME CARS. This really pissed me off, because I would have like to have had 2-3 hours on a charger to boost my power back up while we were inside the Visitor's Center. Alas, it was not to be. I stepped outside of the gates TWICE during the day and -- YEP -- the same three assholes were there hogging the spots/power.
- Since it was 6PM and we were leaving, we did a search for the nearest Tesla Superchargers. We found one about 11 miles away, in Titusville (which happens to be where our Cousin Pierre has his shop), and it was more or less on the way back to Orlando. So we headed over there, and it was one of 16 Superchargers located in the parking lot of a Target.
- We powered up for a total of 30 minutes at the Supercharger, and went from around 35% power up to 98%. It would have taken probably 10 more minutes to get to that last 2% of power, so we decided that 98% was enough and took off. We were impressed with the speed that the Supercharger did charge up the battery. The total cost for the "fill-up" was around $15.00. There were Teslas of all shapes and sizes coming in and out of the Supercharger area all the time we were there. Many of them came in, parked, plugged in, went into Target to shop, and then came out with a (mostly) charged car. Seemed a good use of multi-tasking, IMHO.
- The trunk of the Model 3 was VERY deep, and handled all three of our suitcases (including my wife's very large one) with aplomb
- We turned the car into Avis at the Orlando Airport yesterday with no drama at all. I'd say we put around 175 miles on the car, total, in a couple of days of driving.
Tesla Superchargers are definitely the way to go, vs. Level 1 or Level 2 chargers which take much much longer (we didn't deal with those) and are the chargers that you typically find in parking garages, apartment complexes, and so forth. If you are at say 50% battery on a Tesla, you can definitely within 15 minutes get up to pretty much a full charge and be on your way. This is overall more or less comparable to a gasoline fill-up. However, the full range of a Tesla Model 3 at 100% charge is only 268 miles. It's roughly comparable to my 560SEC or G320 just before the "reserve" light comes on for both of them -- I can stretch both vehicles to 300 miles gasoline range, but usually I'm looking for gas at levels below a quarter tank. But gasoline stations are MUCH easier to find everywhere than having to google for charging stations, etc.
The car's design is starting to feel very dated to me. They need to update the exterior sheet metal with a new design, pronto.
Overall, I would not buy a Tesla at this time. However, the experience made me more open to considering an EV in the future. I can definitely see the benefits of them, and there is much less mechanical complexity. The power whoosh is pretty alluring. However, there is something about the sound and mechanical cacophony of a V-8 that I just don't think I can overcome (whether MB M117, M119 or Lexus). All in all, I love the smell of gasoline.
The last thought I have is that somehow, I just don't feel that the Tesla/EV experience is 100% at prime time yet. It's close, and probably excellent for people who are urban/suburban. But for example, if we had wanted to drive from Orlando to Miami, I would have had to do more planning and put more thought into the journey that I would have with a gas car, where I'd have just hopped in and went, and found a gas station where I needed to.
So my hat is off to you EV beta testers out there. You are innovating for the rest of us and advancing things forward. But -- at least for now and well into the future -- I am going to remain with gasoline powered ICE cars. Less stress, and I enjoy maintaining and driving my MB ICE cars.
Cheers,
Gerry
I saw this same asshole-ery at my previous job. Folks would arrive at work and leave their Tesla on the charger the whole day. Nice. Interesting too that there is a fee for charging. I guess I was super naive in that I assumed using the charging station would be eaten by Tesla. Silly me
I know that there is a $0.50 charge (per minute?) for cars that are fully charged that stay plugged in? I thought I saw something about that.
I just got the bill for the rental and it didn’t have anything per the $15 charge for the power. But the Tesla charger said I put in $15 worth of electricity. I figured that the rental company would pass the charge through, like they do with tolls, after the fact. We’ll see, I guess.
I just got the bill for the rental and it didn’t have anything per the $15 charge for the power. But the Tesla charger said I put in $15 worth of electricity. I figured that the rental company would pass the charge through, like they do with tolls, after the fact. We’ll see, I guess.
04DEC2023:
02JAN2024:
www.vancouverisawesome.com
02JAN2024:
Canada's first-ever electric fire truck sidelined with water leak
Vancouver's $1.8-million truck in service for a month before sent to Minnesota for repairs.
www.vancouverisawesome.com
