Engine oil recommendations

[gerryvz]

Thanks for sharing Gerry, you might want to take the report down or modify it so that your personal details aren't showing to all.

That's an old address where I haven't lived for the past 6.5 years, but yes, I should....

Phone number, I've had since 1997...it's well out there.

 

[Jeeze]

I am abit confused about diesel oil in the m119.
Would the Royal Purple 15-40 diesel oil be suitable?
.

 

[gsxr]

I am abit confused about diesel oil in the m119.

Diesel oil is acceptable to use, but doesn't necessarily offer any significant advantages over non-diesel oils.

Would the Royal Purple 15-40 diesel oil be suitable?

Yes, that would be fine.

 

[Jeeze]

Thank you! The RP is the only one I can find in that weight in my area. Everything has gone to 0W or 5W.

 

[gsxr]

10W-40 would also be fine, if you can find that locally. No need for 5W-xx but a 5W-40 would be acceptable as well.

I'd avoid anything 0W-xx.

 

[gerryvz]

The only compelling reason I would see to use a 15W-40 diesel oil is for its higher detergent properties (i.e. additives that scrub things under the valve cover and keep things clean) over oils designed for gasoline engines. This is because diesel engines generate more particulate matter and soot, both inside the engine and in the exhaust. Generally most "name brand" diesel engine oils (Chevron DELO400 or Shell Rotella, that ilk) are also rated as OK for use (meet the spec) for gasoline engine use. I have used Chevron DELO400 for many many years in my M104 engines, with zero issues. You can look at my M104 Top-End Rebuild thread and you will see that the M104 is extremely clean inside. I have used DELO400 in my G-wagen's M104 for the past 10 years, as well. I will of course be posting pictures when I pull the cylinder head (project starting very soon !!!) and you will see that it is also very clean inside.

 

[TerryA]

@Jeeze,
FYI, I use Royal Purple 20-50 Synthetic in my 500E for the 20K miles or so with no ill effects. Albeit I haven’t looked for it lately for my next upcoming oil change. I hope I can still find it.

 

[gerryvz]

Some interesting findings and observations in this video.

 

[gsxr]

Some interesting findings and observations in this video.

TLDR: Skip to 20:00 for the summary.

That was interesting... and simultaneously confusing, due to the lack of labels on the graphs displayed. Would it have been that hard to label each line on the graph? Or make the graph so the higher levels of wear (PPM) were above the lower level line?

Also interesting is that this focused almost entirely on cylinder wall and ring wear. Cam wear was only mentioned in passing and was NOT tested. As noted by the peanut gallery, ZDDP levels are primarily of concern to the folx with engines that have cam wear issues (like the M117).

Makes me wonder how the M119's Alusil cylinder walls affect selection of oil additive packages. There is no iron on the wall, the M119 rings ride against exposed silicon crystals. Waaaaay different than all the domestic engines with iron cylinders/liners.

 

[gsxr]

This video from the same guy also has some interesting tidbits buried in the low S/N ratio. Watch from about 16:00 - 19:20 or so. The video title is misleading IMO and isn't a good match to the content, but there is still some useful info buried in there. Watchable at 1.5x speed to save time.

Note at 17:40 that Project Farm test results are mythbusted: PF basically did not test/check for the relevant data, PF said old oil was ok to use, when it really is not.

TLDR: Don't use oil that is 10-20 years old. It may have degraded enough over time that it's not offering full protection.

 

[nocfn]

One might conclude that if you have 20 year old oil on the shelf, perhaps you have a hoarding problem, and perhaps, are quite lonely. Lets all reach out and have a group hug here.... reveal yourselves!

 

[French02chris]

Quick question... Would like a quick answer from someone living in cold climate in the winter..

I currently live in Florida and use rotella t4 15w40...no issues.

Moving to Maine and will be living there in the winter :
-should I keep 15w40?
Or switch to Rotella t6 5w40? (only during the winter months)

Ps : I don't want to change brand

Thank you.

 

[alabbasi]

I use diesel oil that I drain out of my 340k mile 7.3 super duty diesel after 15000 miles. Apparently it has high quantities of zinc and other metals in it

 

[nocfn]

Al, do you run it thru a seine or a sifter? Does it contain magnets?

 

[Jlaa]

Quick question... Would like a quick answer from someone living in cold climate in the winter..

I currently live in Florida and use rotella t4 15w40...no issues.

Moving to Maine and will be living there in the winter :
-should I keep 15w40?
Or switch to Rotella t6 5w40? (only during the winter months)

Ps : I don't want to change brand

Thank you.

I do not live in a cold clime, but I went through the effort of extracting this page from the MB Maintenance Manual dated March 1993 for you (so I don't mean this flippantly) ---- Supplement 5 page 0101.20/1 - see the viscosity recommendations for the M119 engine:

 

[French02chris]

I do not live in a cold clime, but I went through the effort of extracting this page from the MB Maintenance Manual dated March 1993 for you (so I don't mean this flippantly) ---- Supplement 5 page 0101.20/1 - see the viscosity recommendations for the M119 engine:

View attachment 192346

View attachment 192347

I do have the same manual and I did read it... I am looking for a answer from someone living in cold climate with real life experience about the oil they use!!
Thank you for your understanding.

 

[gsxr]

If you will be driving the car in winter, with cold starts in ambient temps below freezing... I'd lean towards the 5W-40.

However, the 15W-40 you are using is full synthetic and should be fine if you rarely get into (or below) single digits °F.

 

[Tanel]

Have you guys taken notice of this YouTube-video comparing 5W-20 to 20W-50 on the dyno?

For those who lack the time, here is a summary I wrote:

1. Engine used was a naturally aspirated ~600 hp dragrace-style LS V8 with 2618 alloy pistons, large aluminium connecting rods, loose tolerances, and a wet-sump. Normal configuration is with a supercharger attached and an output of 1300+ hp. [Tanel's Note: Dyno pulls ran to 7500 rpm. Unleaded fuel was used. Compression unknown].
2. Oil used was "Driven GP-1 20W-50 Semi-Synthetic Blend" and "Driven GP-1 5W-20 Semi-Synthetic Blend". [Tanel's Note: Both advertised to provide "maximum engine protection by utilizing Driven’s High Zinc (ZDDP) additive technology"]. Oil filter was "Wix Racing Filter".
3. With thin oil, the oil analysis showed that pre-filling the oil filter resulted in less wear than not pre-filling the oil filter.
4. With thick oil, the oil analysis showed that pre-filling the oil filter had no advantages to pre-filling the oil filter.
5. With thin oil, 12 dyno runs resulted in the oil going from 13 ppm iron to 61 ppm iron, and 30 ppm lead to 41 ppm lead (bearings being the only possible lead source in this setup). "Zero hour" oil had 9 ppm iron and 31 ppm lead.
6. With thick oil, 12 dyno runs resulted in the oil going from 11 ppm iron to 21 ppm iron, and 8 ppm lead to 14 ppm lead (bearings being the only possible lead source in this setup). "Zero hour" oil had 11 ppm iron and 11 ppm lead.
7. [Tanel's Note: Notice the higher initial iron and lead values of the thin oil. Iron wear was clearly better with the thick oil, lead results depend on if you look at relative or absolute numbers].
8. [Tanel's Note: The below average power figures are hard to compare to each other as they are derived from different rpm ranges. The notes and numbers presented do not add up perfectly, which could be due to video editing or a simplification of the narrative. We lack the raw data and this is best viewed as a trend and big picture kind of thing. Still, to the best of my abilities, below are the numbers I saw in the video].
9. With thin oil, from the 1st pull to the 12th pull, as the oil got hotter, thinner, and flowed more, increased windage losses resulted in a power loss of 5 hp in average (527 to 522hp, average range 3540 to 7440 rpm). Peak power was 640 hp on 1st run, 647 hp on 4th run, and 643 hp on 12th run.
10. With thick oil, from the 1st pull to the 12th pull, as the oil got hotter and thinner, power increased 11 hp in average (614 to 625 hp, average range 5880 to 9240 rpm). Peak power was 624 hp on 1st run, 636 hp on 4th run, and 640 hp in 12th run.
11. Going from 6 quarts to 10 quarts of thick oil (oil pan fits 11 quarts) resulted in a power loss of 12 hp in average (536 to 524 hp, average range 4500 to 7500 rpm). Peak power dropped to 609 hp (but it is unclear what the oil temperature was at the time of measurement).

How does this translate to the M119? Before watching this it would never have crossed my mind to put 5W-20 in a high performance engine, less so to then rev it to 7500 rpm 12 times in a row. I still hesitate at the thought, but would no longer outright dismiss the idea of e.g. a high quality 5W-30 in a low stressed M119.

The knowledge on this forum is imense, surely we can do better than 20-30 year old OE recommendations. Maybe more members could post an oil analysis of whatever oil they have been running?

P.S: If someone validated the above summary, that would be great. A lot was not said, but read off their dyno monitors and notes.

 

[Alphasud40]

The oil geek guy on YouTube has enlightened me. I have watched a number of his videos recently and it’s given me a new perspective on engine oil. The only way to know how a modern oil translates on the M119 engine is to do an oil change to the test oil. Run the engine then drain and refill and draw a sample and have it analyzed. Then run the oil to the next service interval and sample it again. What Lake emphasized is look at the PPM numbers for iron, lead, tin and find out if the new oil increases or decreases wear. Lake has found modern engine oil designed for GDI engines is also good for flat tappet camshaft engines or engines like the M117 with a cam follower design. Again he stresses oil analysis to be sure. Personally he has a Porsche 996 engine with the M97 engine and he was trying different oils for that engine and giving speeches at Porsche gatherings. That engine has a similar construction to ours running aluminum cylinder bores.
The oil pump in the M119 produces plenty of volume. I bet running a thinner oil would give you several HP over a thicker oil. I would never run 20-50 in the M119.
For anyone who has an engine that has build up from extended oil changes or is seeing increased oil consumption they owe it to themselves to run a couple of oil changes with Valvoline Protect and Restore. Lake has also tested this oil and it really does clean the engine and most importantly the ring lands where oil consumption issues develop from light tension rings. I have repaired many engines for this issue. But now I’m going to try this for the next customer before recommending an engine replacement or tear down.

 

[Tanel]

The oil geek guy on YouTube has enlightened me. I have watched a number of his videos recently and it’s given me a new perspective on engine oil. The only way to know how a modern oil translates on the M119 engine is to do an oil change to the test oil. Run the engine then drain and refill and draw a sample and have it analyzed. Then run the oil to the next service interval and sample it again. What Lake emphasized is look at the PPM numbers for iron, lead, tin and find out if the new oil increases or decreases wear. Lake has found modern engine oil designed for GDI engines is also good for flat tappet camshaft engines or engines like the M117 with a cam follower design. Again he stresses oil analysis to be sure. Personally he has a Porsche 996 engine with the M97 engine and he was trying different oils for that engine and giving speeches at Porsche gatherings. That engine has a similar construction to ours running aluminum cylinder bores.
The oil pump in the M119 produces plenty of volume. I bet running a thinner oil would give you several HP over a thicker oil. I would never run 20-50 in the M119.
For anyone who has an engine that has build up from extended oil changes or is seeing increased oil consumption they owe it to themselves to run a couple of oil changes with Valvoline Protect and Restore. Lake has also tested this oil and it really does clean the engine and most importantly the ring lands where oil consumption issues develop from light tension rings. I have repaired many engines for this issue. But now I’m going to try this for the next customer before recommending an engine replacement or tear down.

Funny. I was just about to get some Valvoline Protect and Restore for the next oil change and send in a sample for analysis. If anyone else were to try it out before me, be careful of changing the oil filter much more regularly. There have been horror stories where Valvoline Protect and Restore has clogged a fresh oil filter within a couple of hundred miles.

As for the M96 and M97, I believe the main issue was the amount of polymer shearing (resulting in out of spec low viscocity oil) going on in those engines due to them having two cam chains (as seen below).

 

[Alphasud40]

Funny. I was just about to get some Valvoline Protect and Restore for the next oil change and send in a sample for analysis. If anyone else were to try it out before me, be careful of changing the oil filter much more regularly. There have been horror stories where Valvoline Protect and Restore has clogged a fresh oil filter within a couple of hundred miles.

As for the M96 and M97, I believe the main issue was the amount of polymer shearing (resulting in out of spec low viscocity oil) going on in those engines due to them having two cam chains (as seen below).

View attachment 197940

I agree on the oil filter change interval if the engine is really dirty. He did mention they were careful with the additive to prevent the oil from cleaning too effectively and loading up the oil filter.

 

[gerryvz]

Nothing wrong with heavier oils in the M119 if you live in warmer climates. I run 15W-50 RedLine, myself, and have for years. Just look at the MB oil viscosity chart.

These engines were designed for and are happiest with heavier oils than today’s cars tend to be specified with.

Even our 2004 4Runner (which is being sold tomorrow) is spec’d for 5W-30 by Toyota. That’s about as thin as I would go for an M119.

As far as an M117 is concerned, I wouldn’t let a modern oil near it. Been there, did that in the “oughts” with Chevron Supreme 20W-50 Dino on my 560SEC, changed every 2,000 miles religiously. Didn’t have enough ZDDP and lost both cams and some followers because of it.

Rebuilt the heads and new cams in 2010 in my garage (build thread is on 126board.com) and after 65K miles all is well with Brad Penn oil with appropriate ZDDP. That’s oil that is designed for flat tappet / follower applications.

If you don’t believe me or want to debate on the ZDDP vs modern oil situation on M117s, just talk to Jono. He’s seen it all and will strongly suggest staying away from modern oils in the M117.

Jono = @jhodg5ck

 

[195910]

For both modern and classic M-B engines, have a look at the Noack test which is the more recent test, and read about how oil viscosity degrades after 1000km. I think 0W40 and lower viscosity is a bad idea at least for our region. M-B was using 10W40 / 15W40 on the M119 when it was new, I remember my oil 1991 500E developed a camshaft adjusters rattle after switching to 0W40 17 years ago.

 

[TerryA]

To the best of my knowledge my 500E has run 20-50 oil all of its life. I bought it with 89K miles running 20-50 Dino oil. I did a couple of oil changes with Dino oil and then tried 15-50 Mobile synthetic. It didn’t like the 15-50 so on the next change I went to 20-50 Royal Purple full synthetic. And have now used it for probably 45K miles. I run 5K on oil & filter changes in my car and am up to 143K miles and no problems.

I have no plans to change to any lighter oil.

 

[195910]

To the best of my knowledge my 500E has run 20-50 oil all of its life. I bought it with 89K miles running 20-50 Dino oil. I did a couple of oil changes with Dino oil and then tried 15-50 Mobile synthetic. It didn’t like the 15-50 so on the next change I went to 20-50 Royal Purple full synthetic. And have now used it for probably 45K miles. I run 5K on oil & filter changes in my car and am up to 143K miles and no problems.

I have no plans to change to any lighter oil.

Nothing wrong with that, 20W50 is in the M-B spec range for the M119 if the car is operated in mild to warm weather condition.

What is shocking is that some manufacturers are requiring 0W16 / 0W20 / 0W30 oils even in extreme heat!
Contrary to the Manufacturer's recommendation, Land cruiser owners in the gulf still use 5Kkm interval mineral 20W50 even on +2018 cars! at first I thought this is very backward, then i realized it wasn't a totally bad idea.
Now that Land cruisers were forced to join the 21st century (Smaller displacement, direct injection, turbo charged, cost reducing short cuts because of the development and production costs) these old tricks are not possible, and people are finding out how unreliable this new engine is.

 

[gerryvz]

Now that Land cruisers were forced to join the 21st century (Smaller displacement, direct injection, turbo charged, cost reducing short cuts because of the development and production costs) these old tricks are not possible, and people are finding out how unreliable this new engine is.

Our 2024 Lexus LX600 (which is a J300 Land Cruiser with more luxury) is using the 3.4-liter twin-turbo engine. Lexus specifies 0W-20 full synthetic oil for the application, changed every 5,000 miles. We'll see how the reliability goes on this engine. I do think the twin-turbo V-6 is a step down from the V-8 from the previous LX570/Land Cruiser (up to 2021 model year).

Our 2023 Lexus IS500 has the naturally aspirated 5-liter V-8, and the owner's manual specifies 5W-30 or 0W-20 synthetic oil, changed every 5K.

With these new vehicles, we'll go exactly with what Lexus says, exactly when they say it.

The majority of these J300 Land Cruisers and Lexus LX600s are going to the Gulf States. It was very very difficult to get one here in the US, and took a couple of months to get the color and interior we wanted.

 

[Alphasud40]

I think in the long run Toyota and Lexus will have this engine sorted and reliability will be good. They have a history of making really good drivetrains. I just sold my F350 because I don’t need anything that HD anymore and bought my friends 05 Tundra with the 4.7 V8. I will probably have the truck till I’m too old to drive. One of the most reliable trucks ever built.

 

[Jim Rosenthal]

I had used Rotella 15W-40 in it's various forms in my marine diesels for years. I then switched to Mobilgard SHC-1, which I found out about from a Cummins diesel guru on the West Coast (Tony Athens at Seaboard Marine, in CA) But I don't put a lot of hours on the engines, and the Mobilgard is 2-3x the price of Rotella- not unusual for a synthetic, but each engine takes 15 quarts. I will probably go back to Rotella. As far as what to run in my 500E, I can't recall what's in there, now, but I think it's due for an oil change and I will probably use RP.

 

[French02chris]

Alright....I now live in Maine and it's time for my winter oil change.
So, IF anyone lives in New England....can I use :

Valvoline High Mileage with MaxLife Technology Motor Oil SAE 5W-30​

in my 379K miles 1993 400E ???? (in the winter only -Dec thru March )
Is it an Approved MB oil????
I won't need to drive a lot ( probably one day per week)
Currently ( as I wrote in another post ) I have Rotella 15w40 Dino oil in the car.

EDIT : Also since I use Rotella T4 15W40, should I just switch to Rotella T4 10W30 ???

Thank you once again...

 

[gsxr]

If you want to run thinner oil in winter, I'd stick with a 10W-30 (not 5W-30) and make sure it's not dino.

Rotella T4 15W-40 is a synthetic blend and would be fine cold weather, the pour point is rated at -36°.

Shell doesn't seem to make Rotella 15w40 Dino anymore... was this old stuff you had on the shelf from years ago?

 

[French02chris]

If you want to run thinner oil in winter, I'd stick with a 10W-30 (not 5W-30) and make sure it's not dino.

Rotella T4 15W-40 is a synthetic blend and would be fine cold weather, the pour point is rated at -36°.

Shell doesn't seem to make Rotella 15w40 Dino anymore... was this old stuff you had on the shelf from years ago?

nope...that was a month or so ago
so I guess that 10W30 T4 is also blend? should I get that instead?
honestly, I only plan to drive on the "warmer" days in Winter ( so when it's sunny and probably 15-20 degrees or more out)
no plans on going out when it 10 or less!!! LOL

 

[gsxr]

Check the exact stuff in the sump now... if it's a synthetic blend, pretty likely the pour point of the 15W-40 is plenty low enough for winter use above zero degrees Farenheit. I wouldn't replace it with 10W-30 unless you're going to be cold starting waaaaay below zero °F.

 

[French02chris]

Check the exact stuff in the sump now... if it's a synthetic blend, pretty likely the pour point of the 15W-40 is plenty low enough for winter use above zero degrees Farenheit. I wouldn't replace it with 10W-30 unless you're going to be cold starting waaaaay below zero °F.

yes...currently it is the synthetic blend 15w40 ( their new bottle )...I just check the bottles!
definitely will not cold start at less than 10 degrees!!!!
I honestly don't need to drive anywhere but grocery shopping in the winter ( I am a wedding photographer and I only work on wedding from March to mid November)
So, I guess I will stay with my 15w40 . I only drove 1200 miles or so since my last oil change.
Thanks again.

My 2nd issue now would be my battery.....lol
which i plan to remove from the car and keep it warm inside ( the car sleeps outside) and only put it back when I need to go grocery shopping
probably leave it on battery tender inside ( I have no way to plug a tender if the car is outside.....no outlets outdoors)

also new radiator arriving today!!! so I am putting it in on Monday ( going to a friend's house who has a warm garage...I will work on it while he works on his 1971 Dodge Dart swinger)

 

[TerryA]

@French02chris,
Chris, For the first time I just switched to Valvoline’s HiMile MAX LIFE 5-30 in my 2015 KIA Optima Beater at 101K miles.

My intent with this car was to drive the wheels off of it, do no DIY wrenching on it and just get any work or service done by the KIA Dealer or and Indy Tech. I purchased the car with 12,800 miles on the clock.

Anyway, after a Tech working on my car informed me it was using oil. The Optima requires 5-20 on the oil cap and the last oil change was done by the KIA Dealer who insisted on using full synthetic for the change. I had been using semisynthetic 5-20 to that point. The car had approximately 96K on the clock when the KIA Dealer put full synthetic in it. To this point I had been getting an oil change and filter every 5K miles with no problem. All of a sudden there’s a problem with using oil and I think it’s from the change to full synthetic. So I did the current oil change myself at 101K miles using the Valvoline 5-30 MAX LIFE (I went to 5-30 ilo of the 5-20 spec) to see if it might help the oil consumption.

Currently, I have only put 1K miles on the oil change and am monitoring the oil level for consumption. No decision yet if it’s working.

This may be TMI for most out there but IMOP,
My point is that changing to a full synthetic oil on a high mileage car may be a problem and lead to higher oil consumption and leaking gaskets.

Anyway, That’s my story and I’m sticking with it!

 

[French02chris]

@French02chris,
Chris, For the first time I just switched to Valvoline’s HiMile MAX LIFE 5-30 in my 2015 KIA Optima Beater at 101K miles.

My intent with this car was to drive the wheels off of it, do no DIY wrenching on it and just get any work or service done by the KIA Dealer or and Indy Tech. I purchased the car with 12,800 miles on the clock.

Anyway, after a Tech working on my car informed me it was using oil. The Optima requires 5-20 on the oil cap and the last oil change was done by the KIA Dealer who insisted on using full synthetic for the change. I had been using semisynthetic 5-20 to that point. The car had approximately 96K on the clock when the KIA Dealer put full synthetic in it. To this point I had been getting an oil change and filter every 5K miles with no problem. All of a sudden there’s a problem with using oil and I think it’s from the change to full synthetic. So I did the current oil change myself at 101K miles using the Valvoline 5-30 MAX LIFE (I went to 5-30 ilo of the 5-20 spec) to see if it might help the oil consumption.

Currently, I have only put 1K miles on the oil change and am monitoring the oil level for consumption. No decision yet if it’s working.

This may be TMI for most out there but IMOP,
My point is that changing to a full synthetic oil on a high mileage car may be a problem and lead to higher oil consumption and leaking gaskets.

Anyway, That’s my story and I’m sticking with it!

Well....nice story
For my part, I was under the assumption that Rotella T4 15w40 was STILL dino oil, but apparently they switched in Jan 2021...LOL
So, for me that is about 20 oil changes done!! car seems to like that oil anyways, so I will keep it in the car this winter and see how it works out.
IF i need to change, I will go with Rotella T4 10w30 then as @gsxr wrote not to go with 5w30

 

[gsxr]

Even at near-zero temps, I'd be surprised if you noticed audibly slower cranking speeds with the Rotella T4 15w40. Having the battery indoors in warmer temps, AND on a maintainer, will be a huge help with cold starts. Don't let the engine idle excessively (5+ minutes), after 1-2 minutes, start driving but go easy on the throttle until the temp gauge starts moving.

I think you might notice slower cranking if it was below zero, maybe.

 

[French02chris]

Even at near-zero temps, I'd be surprised if you noticed audibly slower cranking speeds with the Rotella T4 15w40. Having the battery indoors in warmer temps, AND on a maintainer, will be a huge help with cold starts. Don't let the engine idle excessively (5+ minutes), after 1-2 minutes, start driving but go easy on the throttle until the temp gauge starts moving.

I think you might notice slower cranking if it was below zero, maybe.

for sure!!! I actually always do that, even when I lived in Florida...lol

 

[mbzgurl]

I got confused about which oil to use. It's winter in the desert and time for an oil change. So which oil and filter should I be looking for?
I like Redline but they were sold out of oil last time I checked. I use Lucas oil mostly. I don't use my car very often. I haven't driven it for the last year and put only 2,000 miles at most per year when I do drive it.

 

[gsxr]

I got confused about which oil to use. It's winter in the desert and time for an oil change. So which oil and filter should I be looking for?

Don't overthink it.

For oil, any locally-available synthetic will work. Pick a viscosity that generally matches your expected seasonal temperature range. 10W-40 usually works fine year-round most places in USA.

For the filter, either OE/Genuine, or any name-brand OEM aftermarket: Hengst, Knecht, Mann, Mahle.

 

[mbzgurl]

Don't overthink it.

For oil, any locally-available synthetic will work. Pick a viscosity that generally matches your expected seasonal temperature range. 10W-40 usually works fine year-round most places in USA.

For the filter, either OE/Genuine, or any name-brand OEM aftermarket: Hengst, Knecht, Mann, Mahle.

View attachment 200646

 

[mbzgurl]

That's a useful chart. Thanks. I'm not gonna over think this one. I will be checking out what the SEMA show has for new oil. I'll let you know what I find.

 

[gsxr]

Forgot to mention... while I am still a big fan of Red Line oils, the price has gone stupid at $65 per gallon. I'd only use this for something you want the best protection for (like an AMG 6L M119 engine, or M156/M159), or for really severe service like road racing.

For normal street use, extended drain intervals & oil analysis helps offset the insane cost of Red Line vs pedestrian synthetics, but it's still not cheap. My high-mile E420 beater gets whatever synthetic is on sale at oil change time.

 

[rayhennig]

I don't get overly tense about oil issues with my M104.980. Mainly it's had fully synthetic 5W40 because that's what the MB dealer - where I bought it - used when I had it serviced by them from 1998 for a few years. When I used local garages, I supplied similar but often the Diesel equivalent.

Latterly, since about 2022, my son's had a stock of MB's 5W30 Diesel oil - 229.51?. I've had a few fills of that. No issues. Can I tell the difference? Not really.

Tomorrow's oil change is getting an MB filter and MB's 5W40 - 229.5? "petrol" oil. As it's in stock in my cellar. That's the last of it so it'll be back to 5W30 for the next one.

Have I done the right thing in the 27 years I've had the 300CE? Well, at 1/2 million Kms, something must be right.

Still not overly tense.

Best to all.

RayH

 

[JC220]

One thing that is worth noting on classics is the filter element degradation.

So whilst most of these cars may not cover alot of miles this then becomes a bigger concern. For example on my own 500E I only cover a couple hundred miles a year. So you would think the engine oil would be OK for a few years.

Technically it is- but the filter element would not last that long. The oil soaked paper can break down over time. I have seen this on several MB's. I think later V8s can have a fleece type filter but IIRC M119 is only a paper filter element.

The paper filters can soften and squeeze inwards. In bad cases parts of the paper can start coming off and going into the oil galleries.

Because of this personally, I always change the filter element annually. Maybe not always the oil itself if it has only a coupe hundred miles on it and its £££ oil but the filter life needs to be kept in mind. More age related and not mileage IMO.

Example here: Thread 'Oil filter horror show' Oil filter horror show | Off-Topic Discussions

 

[gsxr]

@JC220 is correct. The paper filter element can become brittle over time. It doesn't hurt to replace the filter more often than the oil is changed.

I'm not aware of any "fleece" type filter element available for the M119. Singer would probably redesign it to a dry sump with external filtration, lol.

 

[rayhennig]

It doesn't hurt to replace the filter more often than the oil is changed.

In my case, oil and filter changes will be annual at the very least. Possibly 9 months. Always oil and filter at the same time.

Tomorrow's is at max 13 months but may be half that as my records got corrupted. I vaguely recall doing a springtime change at the same time as my son did his 190D2.5.

Dementai setting in?

As an aside, we oil change our 2 MBs in about 90 minutes. About 2 hours for an Opel/Vauxhall Insignia - horrid car.

R

 

[Funny Bunny]

I do annual oil and filter change with redline 10w40 day before winter storage. I never change my oil filter housing o-rings because they never leak and they still look fresh after 3 years (also because I’m too lazy).

 

[rayhennig]

Tomorrow's is at max 13 months but may be half that as my records got corrupted.

Judgung by the number of filters I have in stock, today's oil change is more likely a 6 monthly.

R

 

[rayhennig]

today's oil change is more likely a 6 monthly.

I think I was lying again. Records suggest I've done 9000 Kms since last October so today's change was 13 months ago.

R

 

[Melville]

I recently took my 500E for its annual oil change and check-over by my favorite shop. Now that I'm only averaging about 500 miles per year, the current cost of Red Line, and because my usual source of Red Line (Amazon) only had it in 55 gallon drums (at $2,600), I asked the shop to use the closest they had to Red Line. Preferably, 10w40 and full synthetic. So, while I was there, they called around and got Red Line at $65 / gallon. They didn't mark it up, which was nice. Their view was that, overall, it's a small extra expense, and they know this is my "special car", so I should keep giving it the good stuff. Still, for next year, I think I'll do more research on this thread before oil change time and have my oil ready.