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ignition module
- Thread starter henboy1
- Start date
That information is accurate. On a non-ASR car, the throttle body should open fully with the pedal pushed to the floor. You've verified this, correct? As mentioned in posts #12 and #16 above?
Lack of power is not related to throttle control, if the throttle plate is opening & closing normally. Based on your descriptions so far, it still sounds like either a fuel supply issue, or possibly plugged catalysts/exhaust.
At operating temp, the engine will idle smoothly on all 8 cylinders with no misfiring, right? And it will rev to 3000+rpm and hold those revs smoothly in park/neutral?
Replacing the engine harness is unlikely to cure a low power problem under load, assuming the non-ASR car has a bad harness in the first place - you haven't stated if it is original/bad or not. Very easy to see if the insulation is flaking off or not.
Photos or videos would help.
@sheward knows what he is talking about! Don't listen to banzworld How Do You Clean Your Throttle Body | Mercedes-Benz Forumhttps://www.benzworld.org › ... › W140 S-Class !!!
A video would have helped but I can't post them on here.Can someone see the manufacture date on my throttle body?I tried zooming in but couldnt see.I took the wiring harness from the parts car.The wiring harness looks good on the injector connector side and on the harness going to the throttle body.Someone had already cut it open on the cable that goes to the throttle body.I came home from the parts car and started going over my harness.GSX, yes, when I manually open the throttle on the firewall, the butterfly opens on the throttle body.Not sure if that was the check you wanted.
Guys, this is new ............................Car running and I rev it up, and it would go past 3000rpm.it did this on about 4 revs.I shut off the car and crank it back up and rev it again.This time it goes past 3000rpm.Did another fuel pressure test and it shows 50psi on start up.
What do you guys think ?CATS?Should I go get a temp gun and check the temps on the cats when it's warm?
Guys, this is new ............................Car running and I rev it up, and it would go past 3000rpm.it did this on about 4 revs.I shut off the car and crank it back up and rev it again.This time it goes past 3000rpm.Did another fuel pressure test and it shows 50psi on start up.
What do you guys think ?CATS?Should I go get a temp gun and check the temps on the cats when it's warm?
The ETA has either been rebuilt or replaced, there's a tamper seal which isn't factory. Photo isn't clear enough to see the date code but it looks to be old/original, not a newer date code. Again, with a non-ASR ETA, this is less critical because the throttle plate opens all the way when you press on the pedal (assuming the throttle cable is properly adjusted).
If the wires are good at the injectors, and also at the cam advance solenoids & temp sensors at the front of the intake, the harness may be ok as well.
Free test for cats is to remove the exhaust crossover pipe below the engine and go for a noisy test drive. Otherwise you can use an exhaust backpressure gauge.
Any warning lights on the instrument cluster, btw? Can't recall if you've mentioned that
If the wires are good at the injectors, and also at the cam advance solenoids & temp sensors at the front of the intake, the harness may be ok as well.
Free test for cats is to remove the exhaust crossover pipe below the engine and go for a noisy test drive. Otherwise you can use an exhaust backpressure gauge.
Any warning lights on the instrument cluster, btw? Can't recall if you've mentioned that
No, there is nothing warning . Don't have ASR ..I recieve my code reader tomorrow . If the cats are bad , do you think a code will be stored?
Plugged cats would likely not result in any fault codes, which is one reason why they are difficult to diagnose. General symptom is the engine will run ok at idle but has no power under load. They would have to be severely plugged to make it drive that poorly though. Engine vacuum may be lower than normal if they are that bad. Someone had posted details on this years ago, might find it searching old threads. I've never had any cats plugged badly enough to have done the vacuum test myself.
Glad you are making progress. You did not waste money on the ignition parts. The caps were bad and were soon to be a problem. If you feel you would like to put the money spent on the insulators into something else I will buy them from you. Most everyone here will advise you stay with new. It's hard to judge the condition of insulators even with clear pictures.
Thx for all your help . You mean the insulators on the parts car ? I never took them off .I just cleaned mine . For all your help and advice , you are welcome to come take stuff off the ASR car . You can come get that throttle body . I plan on stripping in about 2 months months .
Purchased an Infrared thermo .I am getting 246 degrees before the cat and 250 degrees after.I did various measurements and before and after is consistent.A muffler shop tells me , if the cats were clogged I wouldnt be able to rev up the car.
This must have something to do with the harsh shift anbd vacuum.Maybe the tranny put the car in limp mode.......my guess.I recieved the code reader in the mail.I will read the manual tonight and scan it tomorrow
This must have something to do with the harsh shift anbd vacuum.Maybe the tranny put the car in limp mode.......my guess.I recieved the code reader in the mail.I will read the manual tonight and scan it tomorrow
Catalyst plugging is not a binary thing, it's analog. Catalysts can allow revving up the car in park (no load) but restrict power when driving. The tests I described above are the valid test, not whether it will rev or not. I don't know if there will be any temperature difference if plugged.
Plugged cats can also cause low vacuum which would cause a harsh shift. There is no "limp mode", this is a completely mechanical transmission.
Use the code document on this forum that I linked to previously, it is specific to the 140 chassis with M119 engine. Whatever code sheets came with the reader, toss them in the trash.
These are the codes I am getting before I cleared the ECU . For example pin #5 had no codes . Pin # 19 had code 7, 20 and 25.
Disregard the 25 written on the far Bottom .
Please see attached . I couldn't reset some terminals with the code reader . The reset that worked was the DTC reset button .
Since I just reset , I will drive around and rescan tomorrow
Disregard the 25 written on the far Bottom .
Please see attached . I couldn't reset some terminals with the code reader . The reset that worked was the DTC reset button .
Since I just reset , I will drive around and rescan tomorrow
There is no attachment to your post, can you try again?
There is no module connected to pin #5. What code document are you using?
Pin #19 (DM) codes indicate ignition issues. As described in the instructions in the document I referenced previously, not all systems have blink codes available, but all the powertrain modules will have blink codes.
There is no module connected to pin #5. What code document are you using?
Pin #19 (DM) codes indicate ignition issues. As described in the instructions in the document I referenced previously, not all systems have blink codes available, but all the powertrain modules will have blink codes.
Do you see the attachment ? For example pin #7 , I had two blinks and then the next test I had three blinks ......2,3
Attachments
On pin 19, I had ignition issues when I initially changed the cap and rotor.At one point , I had a crank and no start.I went back and checked everything.One of the distributor wires wasnt pushed in.This happened twice on the driver's side.I am sure that triggered code 7,20 and 25 .Tomorrow will be a clear slate
Great. Thx
I am posting before and after codes cleared
Attachments
Pin 8: Check all fuses on the BM/GM module in the CAN box. You also may have issues with either the serpentine belt slipping, or the AC compressor speed signal.
Pin 17: This is a hot mess, if you got all those codes AFTER clearing. You are sure Pin 17 was cleared, right? Make sure the knock sensors are plugged into the EZL (code 5), that is the 3-pin connector at the EZL. Ignore code 8 and 18 for now.
The last codes on pin 17 indicate a permanent misfire on cylinders 1, 4, 6, 7. These are all from the passenger distributor. The car would run terribly if these four cylinders were misfiring all the time. You said it was not misfiring... so either it *is* misfiring and you don't realize how smooth the engine should be, or the codes were not fully cleared. Clear all those codes again and make sure you get ONE BLINK from pin 17 before starting the car again.
Pin 17: This is a hot mess, if you got all those codes AFTER clearing. You are sure Pin 17 was cleared, right? Make sure the knock sensors are plugged into the EZL (code 5), that is the 3-pin connector at the EZL. Ignore code 8 and 18 for now.
The last codes on pin 17 indicate a permanent misfire on cylinders 1, 4, 6, 7. These are all from the passenger distributor. The car would run terribly if these four cylinders were misfiring all the time. You said it was not misfiring... so either it *is* misfiring and you don't realize how smooth the engine should be, or the codes were not fully cleared. Clear all those codes again and make sure you get ONE BLINK from pin 17 before starting the car again.
Yes, the serpentine belt is slipping causing noise on start up.The previous owner replace the tensioner and it still squeals , but this is only when cold.All noises goes away when warmed.I am thinking a pully other than the tensioner is causing this.
I changed the EZL from the parts car but the symptoms where still the same.So, should install the EZL from the parts car?I will check again for that 3 pin connector on the EZL.The engine doesn't seem to shake.Not sure but I may be wrong.The cap , rotors and and plugs have been changed on that side.What would you suggest, replace the coil on the passenger side and see?
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cleared by using the car's diag reset button because the code reader will not clear some of them.I am willing to do another cleared test
1. check the fuse that sits on top of the modules(Can Box)
2.,Check the plugs on the EZL and possibly replace
Anything else to check?
1. check the fuse that sits on top of the modules(Can Box)
2.,Check the plugs on the EZL and possibly replace
Anything else to check?
Gotcha!Will clear again , and rescan.
Make sure the serpentine belt is the correct length. The tensioners almost never fail. I hope the PO didn't install a junk aftermarket tensioner. Also try to figure out which specific pulley is causing the squealing. If you shut off AC does the noise stop?
The hand-held coder reader MUST be used to clear each individual code, one at a time, on each pin. Takes forever. Sounds like you may not have fully cleared everything. After clearing you should read ONE BLINK on each module. If not, repeat until you get ONE BLINK. The "diag reset" button you mention is only connected to pin 19 and does the same thing as if you had the code reader plugged into pin 19. The codes on pin 19 may not fully clear until after you re-start the engine, this is normal.
The hand-held coder reader MUST be used to clear each individual code, one at a time, on each pin. Takes forever. Sounds like you may not have fully cleared everything. After clearing you should read ONE BLINK on each module. If not, repeat until you get ONE BLINK. The "diag reset" button you mention is only connected to pin 19 and does the same thing as if you had the code reader plugged into pin 19. The codes on pin 19 may not fully clear until after you re-start the engine, this is normal.
Gotcha. Ac doesnt even work.Freon is leaking and probably low He said he changed the compressor and Ac was working.I havnt gotten there yet, since this was minor to me.
A bit tedious but I was able to clear each pin using the reader . Yes, pin 19 was the hardest . Cleared and drove for about 10 miles . Do you see the loose wires coming from under the EZL ?
. Looks like those loose wires are going to the cam / distributor on the driver's side .I also changed The EZL .The four module fuses are good . 2nd attempt after clearingAttachments
Ok.Will do tomorrow
I am looking at the distributor routing diag and it leads me towards the passenger side plug/wires/distributor and coil.
^^^
I just changed the EZL from the parts car.I will trace the wires going to the passenger coil.
Yes, that was the irony that confused me . No sign of a miss , engine vibration etc ........except driveability . I just learned something about these carsIt sounds OK in the first video, but if you can unplug a coil and there's no difference...!!!
One more thing , I forgot to include a video of the unplugged coil for the driver's side on idle . There was definite miss and a spark from the coil .It sounds OK in the first video, but if you can unplug a coil and there's no difference...!!!
Yes, solved . Thanks to you and gsx and few others . Yes, the coil that leads to the passenger side distributor was bad ..The previous had no covers on them . I grabbed the one from the parts car . This $700 car needs a lot of work , including a paint job . Looks like he lowered the car . I am not into the wheels or lowered cars . I have a huge project . Let me know you're coming down south . Thx again
Great. I can take no credit as, other than resolving some secondary ignition problems with my own cars, my drivability knowledge is academic and comes from reading this forum.
I'll follow up in the near future on the ASR parts car.
I know of another S420 parts car 1.5 hrs. north of here. I have been in touch with the owner and will let you know if it's a non ASR car and what might be available.
I'll follow up in the near future on the ASR parts car.
I know of another S420 parts car 1.5 hrs. north of here. I have been in touch with the owner and will let you know if it's a non ASR car and what might be available.
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Great . Keep me posted
