Latest on control arms

[J. M. van Swaay]

Just had some tires mounted, car was on the alignment rack for a look see. When I looked I saw I need new LCA’s because the ball joints are pretty sloppy. Just spent the last hour reading the the threads here, not much current information. OE is NLA, seems anything else (Febi, TRW, Lemforder) is likely to be inferior. Any suggestions? FCP advertises the Lemforder, any chance these would be of European origin?

Thanks

 

[gsxr]

Just had some tires mounted, car was on the alignment rack for a look see. When I looked I saw I need new LCA’s because the ball joints are pretty sloppy.

JM, are you certain your ball joints have play? The late style LCA's rarely have worn / sloppy ball joints, unless the dust boot is compromised, allowing dirt & water to enter.

Just spent the last hour reading the the threads here, not much current information. OE is NLA, seems anything else (Febi, TRW, Lemforder) is likely to be inferior. Any suggestions?

This is correct. The OE late-style LCA's are NLA and all the aftermarket options are inferior - the ball joint in particular can have a frighteningly short lifespan, a few thousand miles or less. Jono has reported decent success adding grease to the new aftermarket ball joint, along with possibly replacing the aftermarket dust boot with OE, but this is a last resort IMO.

FCP advertises the Lemforder, any chance these would be of European origin

Nope, those Lemforders are made in Taiwan now. And, they are the early style with replaceable ball joints, not late style needed for your E500. The early style won't fit with 320mm front brakes unless you grind off several mm from the face of the LCA, along with cutting a hole in the brake dust shield.


I'd start by confirming you absolutely, definitely have play in your existing ball joints. The FSM shows checking this by prying vertically upward on the LCA below the ball joint, there should be zero vertical movement. Click here, see section B. [Edit: See post #57 here... yep, JM's ball joint was compromised on one side from a torn boot...]

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

OK, maybe the slop is elsewhere. I’ll get under there and have a closer look and feel with a pry bar. If it turns out the slop is elsewhere, can the bushings be replaced? While I’m at all of this, what parts are likely to need refreshing? I’m pretty sure everything is original…

 

[gsxr]

OK, maybe the slop is elsewhere. I’ll get under there and have a closer look and feel with a pry bar. If it turns out the slop is elsewhere, can the bushings be replaced? While I’m at all of this, what parts are likely to need refreshing? I’m pretty sure everything is original…

The rubber bushings can be replaced, new OE/Genuine bushings recommended... this is a bit of a chore if you don't have the special tools. And, a spring compressor is needed to remove the springs so you can remove the LCA. If the ball joint is good, replace the dust/grease boot proactively while it's apart.

"While you are in there" stuff includes anything else related to front suspension and steering... tie rod ends, idler arm, drag link, strut mounts. An alignment will be needed if the LCA's are removed and re-installed.

 

[nocfn]

The process to change the boot is the same to replace the control arm for the most part, is that right?

 

[gsxr]

The process to change the boot is the same to replace the control arm for the most part, is that right?

The boot can be replaced with the control arm bolted into the chassis, I believe. I'll be attempting this next month on my beater E420 which I just discovered needs new booties.

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

What about the shock/strut itself? Is it likely to be at the end of it’s service life after 30 years?

 

[Melville]

Are the case that the Sportline LCAs are still available? At least that's what I put on my wagon when the stock ones were NLA (before briefly coming back in stock). But this was a while ago so maybe that's changed...

 

[gerryvz]

I believe now that even the Sportline LCAs are NLA from MB. For some time, only they were available after the regular late LCAs went NLA.

I'll double-check on that and update this post.



Just confirmed per MB sources that only ONE of the Sportline LCAs is still available -- 1243303607. It can be purchased through MB Annapolis for $351.25 + MD sales tax and no shipping cost if picked up locally; or other online sources for OE parts as folks use.

The other side, 1243303707, is NLA and has been for the past 18 months or so.

An updated post on availability from mid-2023, which still holds true, is here.

 

[gsxr]

What about the shock/strut itself? Is it likely to be at the end of it’s service life after 30 years?

If original, YES! Struts are still available. Always replace the foam stop buffer at the same time. If original, the accordion dust boot and strut mount should also be replaced as well. OE/Genuine only for these items (although for the strut mount, I believe the Febi "HD" mount is a Jono-approved alternative if desired).

Are the case that the Sportline LCAs are still available?

NLA, as Gerry describes above. The bushings are NLA as well if you buy the one side, you won't be able to get matching bushings on the other side. I wouldn't mix & match.

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Thanks! Looks like I’m due for a front end refresh. I have talked to six different shops, nobody wants to work on this car anymore at any price…. I’m hoping for some cooler south florida weather as it appears my wrenching days are not over.

 

[kwontumspeed]

The boot can be replaced with the control arm bolted into the chassis, I believe. I'll be attempting this next month on my beater E420 which I just discovered needs new booties.

Yes it can, with spring properly removed, etc. But unless you intend to support the LCA so that it doesn't drop much outside of it's designed articulation, you may risk damaging the bushings if they're aged. So I'd consider loosening the LCA bolts to prevent this which of course would require a proper alignment after.

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Guess I’ll need a spring compressor, anybody have experience with this one? Hoping it would be at least a little better than the $60 Chinese version.

 

[Jlaa]

@J. M. van Swaay, if you get those Schwaben spring compressor tools, please report back about their construction quality!
I have a set of generic PRC $60 MB spring compressors that I used once. I'm not dead, but I don't know if I'd use them again for fear of being dead. :-(

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

I ordered one, I’ll report back after I have used it…

 

[Jlaa]

Here is the Spring Compressor Tool Comparison Thread: Klann vs. Sir Tools Spring Compressor Comparison | Brakes, Suspension and Steering

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Finally got back to this project, life gets in the way sometimes but that’s a good thing. The E500 is in the “maintenance spot” in the garage, it’s been a while since we’ve had an extra car, nice to be able to work projects as you have time for them without a deadline. The spring compressor arrived about two weeks ago, appears to be the same cheap Chinese version available on EBay for half the price. Guess I was suckered in by the fact that it was a “Schwaben” brand, pretty sure the Chinese want you to think it was manufactured in Germany. I’m such a putz…. I’ll probably grease it up real well and use it

Anyway, I already have my plan to handle the compressed spring as a live grenade…. Now that I’ve had chance to look (and feel) closely, I think the alignment tech lied to me when he said the ball joints had play. In all fairness, the boots are torn but that may be a fairly recent thing. Maybe the tech just looked at the boots, made the conclusion the ball joints were bad and then charged me for an alignment he didn’t have to do. Tech is also the shop owner, maybe he had other things to do that day? I’ll never know for sure.

Hope to spend some more time on this in the next week or so, hoping a reboot and new bushings will spare me the the fact that the control arms are NLA.

J.

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Had some time to spend on this project, I have one control arm out and laying on the bench. Couple of observations and questions:

First, the alignment shop told me they did not make any adjustments but it certainly appears that at least two of the cam bolts have been recently repositioned. (see picture). Not sure what to make of this, makes me wonder what the state of alignment was before removing the control arm. I marked the positions of the cam bolts prior to removal but I wonder if I should use these marks when I reinstall.

The spring compressor I used seemed adequate but I’m sure I would have appreciated the Klann/Miller/MB high quality tool. I think I’m OK with my decision to use the cheap one, mostly because I only plan to use it twice. (once on each side). If I thought I might be doing this job on multiple cars I might think differently.

The visible rubber on the bushings looks degraded but when the control arm was disconnected at the ball and the spring removed, I did not feel any play or lumpiness when raising/lowering/pulling/pushing by hand. Because I’m this far in I’m planning to replace the bushings anyway but I’m not sure if it was really necessary.

The ball joint looks and feels serviceable, (see picture) I can’t detect any play/slop when manipulating by hand and there is reasonable resistance felt when moving the pin. I’m planning to reboot and reuse. What grease should I add to the ball area before installing the new boot?

Finally, does anyone know of a shop that I could send the arms to to have the bushings pressed in? (are you reading this Jono?) I think I could probably fashion a tool for this job as one of our members has but I would rather outsource this to someone reputable.

Thanks for reading, as always tips and suggestions are welcome! J.

 

[nocfn]

MEH I have a similar dilemma. Take them off to replace the boots and repack (aligned by mb when I i did all the steering stuff upon purchase) and still need alignment. Presently have some tire wear so I rotate often as I ponder.... Or shall I just install the new MB OE control arms( "ON THE SHELF ALREADY") and refurbish my OE arms with bushings and balls later and place on the shelf.... and still need the alignment. As the husband of an occasional garage widow - I may just replace with new and refurbish the old. :scratches head:

 

[TerryA]

I noticed when I had a job in Torrance, CA where a lot of roads are rough due to earth movement (Torrance is the city before Palos Verde where there are homes being destroyed earth movement.)

Anyway, at that time, at somewhere around 120K miles I replaced all of my control arms, the shock and the front sway bar bushings and then had my car 4 wheel aligned by a good Indy alignment shop in Costa Mesa, CA and have no problems since. So far I’m a happy camper at 143K+ miles.

 

[gsxr]

JM, I'd put the eccentrics back in the same position as when you removed them. You're going to have to get an alignment afterwards anyway.

The rubber bushings may be fine, although they look terrible externally. I believe Klink had weighed in on this years ago. IIRC he said unless they are really bad externally / visually, internally they are probably fine and will function normally. New ones are a good idea, however, each bushing goes in a specific location AND specific position / orientation. Be super careful when installing the new ones as you can't remove them and do it over, without damaging them and buying another set. If you pay a shop, make sure they know what they're doing. I'd shell out for the OE/Genuine bushing kit now that all the aftermarket are really aftermarket (not reboxed OE/OEM with MB part numbers embossed, like they used to be years ago).

I think Jono says to use Red Line grease for the ball joint. Any quality name-brand grease should be fine. Load it up with grease and install the new boot. Be really careful installing the circlip, it's a PITA to get that in place without accidentally puncturing the new boot. (Don't ask how I know.)

 

[BRABUS124]

I'm not sure if this is right help on getting the right sportline bushings feel and quality back to those who has the 500E or the E500 but I found SKF is making the LCA bushing kit for LCAs and it's sold as beeing as only for sportline option.
Meaning that we should be able to buy complete new LCA for both models and then change the bushings with a shop press. I bought 2 kits 1, for each side. And the bushings seams very firm/hard. But I'm not sure if it's the real deal or miss stamped by the seller? What is your opinion? The part number is
VKDS 338069

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Just starting on the parts order for this project. As far as I know the Genuine MB bushings are still available but good to know there might be an acceptable alternative. I think the real problem is the unavailability of a quality control arm/ball joint (either sportline or standard, and either early or late). To my knowledge the only ones available are are cheap Chinese where the ball joints have a life expectancy of a few thousand miles. Do you know the country of origin for the VKDS bushings?

 

[gerryvz]

If anyone needs them, I have a new / never used pair of MB OE front lower control arms for the W124 (late model, so as work with larger brakes/wheels).

These were the very last pair available in the US, and are the "Premium Line" of OE LCAs made by TRW for MB. I was able to snag the last one per the MB "Paragon" system locally at MB Arlington VA; and the other one I sourced through MB Annapolis from the national parts warehouse.

Price, of course (and I do say this with all seriousness -- NOT tongue-in-cheek) is USD $5,000 for the pair, shipped anywhere in the US. Overseas shipping is at additional direct cost of shipping above USD $5,000.

Thanks.

 

[TimL]

Just starting on the parts order for this project. As far as I know the Genuine MB bushings are still available but good to know there might be an acceptable alternative. I think the real problem is the unavailability of a quality control arm/ball joint (either sportline or standard, and either early or late). To my knowledge the only ones available are are cheap Chinese where the ball joints have a life expectancy of a few thousand miles. Do you know the country of origin for the VKDS bushings?

It says “made in China” on the box. Those rubber parts look ramshackled…..

 

[BRABUS124]

Just starting on the parts order for this project. As far as I know the Genuine MB bushings are still available but good to know there might be an acceptable alternative. I think the real problem is the unavailability of a quality control arm/ball joint (either sportline or standard, and either early or late). To my knowledge the only ones available are are cheap Chinese where the ball joints have a life expectancy of a few thousand miles. Do you know the country of origin for the VKDS bushings?

It says China on the side. But that ain't always in any cases mensing poor quality or materials. Even the nuts are the oval shaped locking type and most Nas quality pruduct don't deliver that type of locking nuts they just deliver the blue plastic type locking nuts.
Anyway I'm always using stainless steal grade A2 nuts as I have those available in any size and form.

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Working on a parts order, just read a post from Klink that said struts rarely go bad. I have the strut still connected at the top and the steering knuckle still attached but can slide the strut up and down, feels smooth with light resistance. Is there a way to check the condition/function of the strut?

 

[gsxr]

I'm not sure if this is right help on getting the right sportline bushings feel and quality back to those who has the 500E or the E500 but I found SKF is making the LCA bushing kit for LCAs and it's sold as beeing as only for sportline option.
Meaning that we should be able to buy complete new LCA for both models and then change the bushings with a shop press. I bought 2 kits 1, for each side. And the bushings seams very firm/hard. But I'm not sure if it's the real deal or miss stamped by the seller? What is your opinion? The part number is
VKDS 338069

It's unlikely those SKF / VKDS bushings are the same firmness / Shore hardness as the OE Sportline bushings. Also note they are made in China and have no Star logo, nor Mercedes part numbers.

All brands of aftermarket bushings are marketed as "compatible with" a long list of MB part numbers, often including Sportline numbers. This makes it look like the aftermarket bushing is "Sportline", when it probably isnt.

Genuine Sportline bushings are extremely stiff... like polyurethane.

 

[BRABUS124]

It says “made in China” on the box. Those rubber parts look ramshackled…..

They are a very difrent feel. They don't feel bad qualiti and I even had them squeezed on in a press witch they handle very well

 

[gsxr]

Working on a parts order, just read a post from Klink that said struts rarely go bad. I have the strut still connected at the top and the steering knuckle still attached but can slide the strut up and down, feels smooth with light resistance. Is there a way to check the condition/function of the strut?

JM, the struts should have substantial gas pressure. You should have to use quite a bit of muscle to compress them from the resting position. If it moves easily... they may be toast. New ones are still available new from the dealer. Get new stop buffers (036-specific, dealer only) and if the accordion dust boots are damaged or torn, replace them at the same time (OE only).

 

[BRABUS124]

It's unlikely those SKF / VKDS bushings are the same firmness / Shore hardness as the OE Sportline bushings. Also note they are made in China and have no Star logo, nor Mercedes part numbers.

All brands of aftermarket bushings are marketed as "compatible with" a long list of MB part numbers, often including Sportline numbers. This makes it look like the aftermarket bushing is "Sportline", when it probably isnt.

Genuine Sportline bushings are extremely stiff... like polyurethane.

I'm to very suspicious but I can guarantee they are hard as none of my other control arms on the shelf with standart bushings. I tried to squeeze them in a press. They are very hard indeed.

 

[TimL]

JM, the struts should have substantial gas pressure. You should have to use quite a bit of muscle to compress them from the resting position. If it moves easily... they may be toast. New ones are still available new from the dealer. Get new stop buffers (036-specific, dealer only) and if the accordion dust boots are damaged or torn, replace them at the same time (OE only).

@J. M. van Swaay, you are already going through a significant effort for the LCAs. Seize the opportunity to get new front shocks from MB before they are gone. Shortly after I got my car I did a suspension refresh at 89k miles and it transformed the car. Yes, more cost in the near term, but the shocks are still available and not too crazy price wise. Doing this now beats having to redo all of this at a later stage with NLA parts at a much higher price. Just my $0.02

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Thanks Dave. They move pretty easily so new struts will be part of this refresh.

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Also, thanks Tim, good suggestion.

 

[gsxr]

JM, if your dealer cannot get E500 struts A1243205030 or A124320503064 which are normally specified for your car...

...instead order A1243204330 (for early 500E), this part number is identical except for the strut pinch bolt hole is slightly smaller. Drill out the hole slightly so the 14mm bolt slides through easily. $450/ea MSRP, Laredo has them for $308/ea discount, link below. Contact them if the S&H charges seem too high, they should adjust to something reasonable. Also try promo code HOLIDAY24 for an extra 5% off (may expire today).

https://www.mbpartsource.com/search?search_str=A1243204330

 

[BRABUS124]

@J. M. van Swaay, you are already going through a significant effort for the LCAs. Seize the opportunity to get new front shocks from MB before they are gone. Shortly after I got my car I did a suspension refresh at 89k miles and it transformed the car. Yes, more cost in the near term, but the shocks are still available and not too crazy price wise. Doing this now beats having to redo all of this at a later stage with NLA parts at a much higher price. Just my $0.02

These front stuts are know as NLA for more than a year here in Europe

 

[gsxr]

These front stuts are know as NLA for more than a year here in Europe

see post #35 above...

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Thanks (again) Dave! If I buy the MB struts will I need a hardware kit (B712319)? Planning on including a new strut mount, (1243201444) stop buffer, (1243230644) and dust boot (1243230192) with the order.

 

[gsxr]

Thanks (again) Dave! If I buy the MB struts will I need a hardware kit (B712319)? Planning on including a new strut mount, (1243201444) stop buffer, (1243230644) and dust boot (1243230192) with the order.

The late/M14 hardware kit A1249900199 is only needed if you want to replace all the nuts & bolts. You can re-use the old hardware if it's undamaged and not corroded, just add blue threadlock when assembling. The hardware kit was $37 MSRP (each), but went NLA around 2021 and has been superceded to each of the individual part numbers within the kit, which is a nuisance for ordering. You can choose to only order certain nuts or bolts if desired (EPC screenshot below).

Make sure to order 2 of each item (struts, mounts, stop buffers, dust boots). New struts do NOT include any hardware / nuts / bolts. You may at least need new plastic straps A2013236240, at least those are cheap ($0.50 each!).

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Parts are ordered (MB Naperville). They said the struts (early with small pinch bolt) will come from Germany. Now I just need to conjure up a press tool to install the bushings…

 

[gsxr]

Now I just need to conjure up a press tool to install the bushings…

Make sure to press against the outer diameter at the shell, not the face of the bushing. Apply rubber-safe lube when installing.

Photos of the OE tool are at this link. The extra pieces in the tool set are designed to flare the center tube, to slightly compress the bushings and allow the LCA to slide into the frame pocket with less effort. You can simulate this with a short lug bolt, the R12 ball seat is pretty close to the flare angle needed.

I forget if there are aftermarket tools available, if so, might be worth looking into... I couldn't find any from a quick search.

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Forgot to add some new rotors and pads to this order, pads are close and there is a pretty good lip on the rotors, probably should just do it now while everything is already disassembled. What’s the current recommendation for rotors and pads? ATE, Zimmerman, genuine MB? Car is mostly a weekend driver, no track or performance parts needed, just good quality (and minimum brake dust) are the only considerations. Thanks, J.

 

[gsxr]

Forgot to add some new rotors and pads to this order, pads are close and there is a pretty good lip on the rotors, probably should just do it now while everything is already disassembled. What’s the current recommendation for rotors and pads? ATE, Zimmerman, genuine MB? Car is mostly a weekend driver, no track or performance parts needed, just good quality (and minimum brake dust) are the only considerations. Thanks, J.

Before replacing, use calipers to measure front rotor thickness. New is 30mm, wear limit when installing new pads is 28.5mm, absolute wear limit is 28.0mm thick.

Original front 320mm rotors are directional, unfortunately one side is NLA from the dealer. You can use the remaining available part number (129-421-17-12) on both sides (yes, one will be "backwards"). $94 each list, about $70 each from discount dealers. I'm not seeing any aftermarket rotors available from mainstream vendors except possibly Ate of unknown origin. I'd stick with a pair of OE.

Brake pads, depends what's important to you (the eternal blonde/brunette/redhead debate). A ceramic pad will give you minimum brake dust but the tradeoff is somewhat mediocre pedal feel after break-in (and, terrible brake feel during break-in). For your weekend driver this is probably fine. I like Porterfield R4-S pads but these are medium dust and are quite expensive.

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Thanks again! I measured, I’m still in spec but barely. I did some quick checking online, I’m pretty sure ATE is now of Chinese origin, but Zimmerman may still be manufactured in Germany. Because of my OCD tendencies, I’m not sure I could install a left side rotor on the the right side…. That means MB rotors are not an option. Think I might try the Zimmerman. By the way, what is it that makes the MB rotors have an L and an R?

 

[gsxr]

Think I might try the Zimmerman.

I didn't see any Zimmermans available for the 320x30 size (p/n 129-421-17-12 left, 129-421-18-12 right). If you could find a pair, that would be great.

By the way, what is it that makes the MB rotors have an L and an R?

ONLY the 320x30 rotors are directional. The internal cooling vanes are angled in opposite directions. For severe use (autobahn speeds, road racing) the additional cooling may be helpful. For USA-legal speeds, it absolutely won't matter... which is why you could install two OE MB rotors of the same part number on both sides.

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

AutohausAZ lead me to believe they were available for a 94 E500, maybe not…

 

[gsxr]

AutohausAZ lead me to believe they were available for a 94 E500, maybe not…

Nope. You absolutely can not trust online catalogs for fitment information, i.e. do not enter your year/model and expect accurate results to be displayed. You must search by part number and only by part number, after obtaining the correct part numbers from the EPC.

AHAZ is showing 300mm brake rotors that fit some R129 and early 500E only. These do not fit the E500. Their catalog is wrong. The change from 300mm to 320mm front brakes occurred late in 1993 500E production, all facelift E500's have the larger 320mm front brakes.

 

[TimL]

@J. M. van Swaay I bought the two MB 320mm discs for my car and although I drive it hard I so far haven’t bumped into an issue with the fact that the cooling vanes are facing in the wrong direction on one side. I think @gsxr is spot on (as always) with his assessment that this simply won’t be an issue outside a track or autobahn setting. I’d just go ahead and buy the MB discs if I were in your shoes.

Love that you are giving your car a refresh- such a cool color car!

 

[J. M. van Swaay]

Update:

A big box of parts arrived yesterday, struts, bushings, ball joint boots, strut mounts, strut boot, and strut bump stop. I wanted to wait until I had the new parts in hand to remove the existing bushings. Followed the FSM procedure exactly, bushings came out very easily.

The rubber part of the bushing that was enclosed in the control arm bore was still in very good condition, I don’t think replacement was really necessary. I cobbled together a “press tool” (pictures attached) and it worked perfectly. I was expecting to struggle with this but again, by following the FSM recommendation to coat the bushing and bore with soft soap they slipped in with minimal effort. Followed Dave’s recommendation to use a lug bolt to flare the center tube, worked great!

Greased ball joints and installed new boots, used some stainless steel safety wire instead of coil clip to secure bottom of boot, did not want to risk damage by trying to work the factory clip into place. I have one side almost done, won’t be able to get back to this till next week.

Looking forward to finishing this project.

J.

 

[gsxr]

Looks great, JM! I assume you are installing the new bushings in the same orientation as the old, with the rubber "nubs" matching the number+location of the original. This is critical and the FSM isn't very clear, the easiest way is to mark the LCA and install new ones so it looks the same when completed.