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lubing the sunroof
- Thread starter Prime
- Start date
To fully clean & lubricate the sunroof mechanism, the angular lift arms must be removed from the car. That includes removing the sunroof trim panel, metal sunroof itself, drip rail, and lift arms. The headliner and frame can remain installed. It takes several hours to do all this. Thoroughly clean off all old lubricant from *everything* that previously was lubed. Order all new felt pads (shown in photo below), replace all of them, and lube with fresh Gleitpaste. If you do not loosen/remove the screws which change the sunroof alignment, it should all go back together and not require any adjustment.
Photos of my sunroof repair project (to replace a broken lift arm) are at this link. Factory procedures for sunroof repair work are at this link. The important jobs are numbers 77-100 and 77-170. The special tools should not be required if you are only taking it apart to clean & lubricate - again, do not loosen/remove the adjustment screws (shown here and here).
UPDATE: The official factory procedure to "clean & grease sun roof rails" is at this link.
Photos of my sunroof repair project (to replace a broken lift arm) are at this link. Factory procedures for sunroof repair work are at this link. The important jobs are numbers 77-100 and 77-170. The special tools should not be required if you are only taking it apart to clean & lubricate - again, do not loosen/remove the adjustment screws (shown here and here).
UPDATE: The official factory procedure to "clean & grease sun roof rails" is at this link.
Depending on usage, an annual lubing of the rails should be all that is required for general, ongoing maintenance. I'd say that every 8-10 years, the felt pads should be renewed. In no way is this required every year, or even every few years.
Most folks recommend the MB "gleitpaste" that GSXR mentions; however from MB this can only be purchased in large quantities that would last most all of us a full lifetime. There are sources where you can purchase smaller amounts - probably a few folks on the forum can chime in as where to get this. Perhaps Mr. Hodgman would sell it, and I think George Murphy of Performance Analysis also sells smaller (aspirin-bottle-sized) amounts via mail-order.
There are substitutes that work well, and are just as good as the Gleitpaste. Personally, I have always used the white Lubriplate grease #1200-2, which is available in small cans. My mechanic's have used that for decades with no issues, and they gave me a new can for free many years ago. I also use this for door hinges, trunk latches, door locks and the like and it works quite well. Lubriplate is commonly available at many auto supply shops. Comes in a black and silver can, 1-quart, or tubes. Just use a tiny paintbrush or other small brush to spread it; I have a small hole drilled in the top of the can and the pencil-diameter brush handle sticks out with the bristles down in the grease. This keeps them together without contaminants getting into the grease. More info here.
Sunroof work tends to be among the most time consuming and expensive non-drivetrain work out there. If you are not comfortable with it, sunroof repair and maintenance is best left to a professional Benz mechanic. It's not rocket science, per se, but there are lots of parts involved and care has to be taken in the dis- and re-assembly of things. A few years back I had a broken lift-arm on my 560SEC sunroof; I had my mechanic repair and refurb the whole roof and the cost was nearly $700. Nearly all of it was labour, not parts.
Cheers,
Gerry
Most folks recommend the MB "gleitpaste" that GSXR mentions; however from MB this can only be purchased in large quantities that would last most all of us a full lifetime. There are sources where you can purchase smaller amounts - probably a few folks on the forum can chime in as where to get this. Perhaps Mr. Hodgman would sell it, and I think George Murphy of Performance Analysis also sells smaller (aspirin-bottle-sized) amounts via mail-order.
There are substitutes that work well, and are just as good as the Gleitpaste. Personally, I have always used the white Lubriplate grease #1200-2, which is available in small cans. My mechanic's have used that for decades with no issues, and they gave me a new can for free many years ago. I also use this for door hinges, trunk latches, door locks and the like and it works quite well. Lubriplate is commonly available at many auto supply shops. Comes in a black and silver can, 1-quart, or tubes. Just use a tiny paintbrush or other small brush to spread it; I have a small hole drilled in the top of the can and the pencil-diameter brush handle sticks out with the bristles down in the grease. This keeps them together without contaminants getting into the grease. More info here.
Sunroof work tends to be among the most time consuming and expensive non-drivetrain work out there. If you are not comfortable with it, sunroof repair and maintenance is best left to a professional Benz mechanic. It's not rocket science, per se, but there are lots of parts involved and care has to be taken in the dis- and re-assembly of things. A few years back I had a broken lift-arm on my 560SEC sunroof; I had my mechanic repair and refurb the whole roof and the cost was nearly $700. Nearly all of it was labour, not parts.
Cheers,
Gerry
Yes, 100% true... I forgot to mention this, thanks for pointing it out, Gerry! The full teardown and renewal is usually a once-per-ownership procedure. Basically when you buy the car, do this once, and never worry about it again. You can apply a dab of touch-up lube once every year or two as needed.gerryvz said:
The Gleitpaste canister (shown here) is $77 list, approx $60 wholesale, and will last a lifetime.gerryvz said:
My philosophy was, if I screw anything up while attempting DIY work, I was prepared to take it to the dealer for a BOHICA moment. It's best to have that in mind if you have never before worked on a 124 sunroof. It's also highly recommended to practice on a Pick-n-Pull car before you tackle your own pride & joy.gerryvz said:
Thanks guys - you've almost talked me out of it!
I'm curious - I understand that the rubber and felt pads will degenerate over time, but if they are in decent shape, can you not touch it up without disassembling it all in the first place? (I'm always trying to find ways to avoid hard work - so sue me).
I'm curious - I understand that the rubber and felt pads will degenerate over time, but if they are in decent shape, can you not touch it up without disassembling it all in the first place? (I'm always trying to find ways to avoid hard work - so sue me).
The problem is, you cannot access the rubber/felt pads without taking everything apart. They are attached to the angular lift arms. On every single car I've done this to, at least one or two of the felt/rubber pads were completely missing! That's less likely with a lower miles car, but should still be checked out. Ideally, you would take everything apart, clean & inspect, then if you need the pads, order as necessary. Of course that means your car could be sitting with no sunroof for a week while you're waiting on parts. Not a big deal if you have a garage/shop to work in, but if your car is parked outside, you either hope the pads are ok and don't need replacement, or buy the parts up front just in case, or end up doing the job twice.Prime said:
BTW - if you're fairly competent with DIY work, and are comfortable following the procedures in the factory manual, I'd give it a shot. If you rarely do any DIY work, either practice on a junkyard car first, or have your usual tech do the job. I'd say four hours labor is plenty. I'll be doing this job fairly soon on another 124, I guess I'll have to time how long it takes me...
Here's a brief repair how-to on fixing a broken sunroof lift/slide mechanism. I am not sure that I would do it this way (i.e. a patch job) but this is how one guy did it on a 560SEC. The SEC and the E500E sunroof mechanism is nearly identical in form and function.
http://home.comcast.net/~chwilka/repair ... n_lift.htm
Cheers,
Gerry
http://home.comcast.net/~chwilka/repair ... n_lift.htm
Cheers,
Gerry
Hey, check this out... the factory procedure is pretty much what I described above. Here's the link:
http://www.w124-zone.com/downloads/MB CD/W124/w124CD1/Program/Maintenance/94_95/7730.pdf
http://www.w124-zone.com/downloads/MB CD/W124/w124CD1/Program/Maintenance/94_95/7730.pdf
If you mean replacing the interior headliner, no, but some of the sunroof opening trim has to be removed:
http://www.w124-zone.com/downloads/MB CD/W124/w124CD2/Program/Chassis/68-430.pdf
To remove the sunroof lining, that just pops off... four snap-in clips at the front.
http://www.w124-zone.com/downloads/MB CD/W124/w124CD2/Program/Chassis/77-050.pdf
GSXR - after removing the sunroof panel I could get to the 6 square pads but not the others. Was missing two and the other few were in rough shape.
I'm hesitant to remove the arms as I didn't feel comfortable, the factory procedures seem a bit short. Where should grease be applied? Stainless rail, lower edge. Where else? Pads? Did that. How about the plastic groove on the outside rails that lift the panel. It seems to move freely, but not sure if it needs lube.
I'm hesitant to remove the arms as I didn't feel comfortable, the factory procedures seem a bit short. Where should grease be applied? Stainless rail, lower edge. Where else? Pads? Did that. How about the plastic groove on the outside rails that lift the panel. It seems to move freely, but not sure if it needs lube.
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The arms probably need to be removed in order to replace the D-shaped pads. Lube is applied to the felt pads and their channels. The FSM procedures are a bit thin. From memory, as long as you don't loosen the screws which allow adjustment (up, down, left, right, front, back) everything should go back together without needing re-alignment. However, I haven't messed with this stuff in probably 10+ years...
I am elbow deep in this job myself currently & I have a question.
Regarding the areas to apply Gleitpaste I know it needs to be liberally applied to all Felt Pads, the areas where the sliding arm moves back & forth and the cable itself.
I am wondering should Gleitpaste also be applied on top of the stainless rails? I have marked numbers on a pic I took last night. (This is prior to cleaning the old grease & grime off) I am sure paste needs to be applied to area 1.
What about areas 2, 3 & 4?
Regarding the areas to apply Gleitpaste I know it needs to be liberally applied to all Felt Pads, the areas where the sliding arm moves back & forth and the cable itself.
I am wondering should Gleitpaste also be applied on top of the stainless rails? I have marked numbers on a pic I took last night. (This is prior to cleaning the old grease & grime off) I am sure paste needs to be applied to area 1.
What about areas 2, 3 & 4?
I did the same thing about 7 years ago on my other W124 250D which has a sunroof but I was told by a friend that I made a mistake cause it collects dust and dirt. But since then, the only issue is that sometimes the roof does not close all the way with the first try.
I haven't touched it since then.
It's something that has yo be done since there is many moving parts and plastic/rubber near the rails if I am not mistaken.
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I haven't touched it since then.
It's something that has yo be done since there is many moving parts and plastic/rubber near the rails if I am not mistaken.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
this is a little goes forever, not globs of it. It is correct, too much will grab dirt to the area. Clean the area and the moving parts get a swipe of Gleitpaste. I use a curved syringe and lay a slight bead with some breaks in it, and on the lifting arms at the pivot points. Close and reopen, do it again and be done. If you are at that point, I would suggest removing the cable and cleaning/lubricating it. If it is the old style with nylon wrapped like a barber pole then replace it. The new style is better design.
Thanks guys- yes I have the later type cable. It is removed for cleaning & lubing.
I have the sunroof taken apart for a full overhaul. Namely the replacement of the felt pads as described by GVZ. I also have 2 other w124's with ailing sunroofs so theyre next!
Yes a little will go a long way. It's a shame Mb only sell it in 500g tubs at £80!
I have the sunroof taken apart for a full overhaul. Namely the replacement of the felt pads as described by GVZ. I also have 2 other w124's with ailing sunroofs so theyre next!
Yes a little will go a long way. It's a shame Mb only sell it in 500g tubs at £80!
OK my 300E-24 has bigger sunroof problems. The roof will tip up & back down again with the switch. But it will not retract at all!!
I can hear the motor running & better yet the bridge travelling inside the roof & stopping. Then moving forward again. But I can't even push the roof lid down & backwards. Has anyone attempted sunroof panel removal without the panel rolling back?
Or will I have to remove the whole sunroof Mech & headlining to get at it?
I can hear the motor running & better yet the bridge travelling inside the roof & stopping. Then moving forward again. But I can't even push the roof lid down & backwards. Has anyone attempted sunroof panel removal without the panel rolling back?
Or will I have to remove the whole sunroof Mech & headlining to get at it?
Hi All!
I'm thinking of attempting that all-important "once in a lifetime" cleaning and lubrication of the sunroof.
Back in 2009, gsxr said of the procedure:
He mentions that the special tools, which I assume are the ones MB says you need in their servicing procedure "Sun roof, clean and grease rails - 7730" are not required. I obviously don't have these, and wondering if I can get definite confirmation that if I merely take the servicing and cleaning to the point of replacing the pads, then I'm not going to find I can't get it all back together without the tools! If they aren't needed, why do MB say they are? They mention "preloading" the sun roof. What's all that about? I don't intend loosening or removing the adjustment screws.
Any advice would, as always, be gratefully received!
It's been 10+ years since I did this... but from foggy memory, the "preload" tool is just a Vise-Grip with an extra jaw welded to it, that plugs into the rearview mirror hole. I believe this may have been required during factory assembly with a brand-new sunroof gasket, which are very tight, and take a while to 'set'. With a used gasket, there is probably no need to preload anything.
The only other tools are the little plastic adjustment gauges, and if you don't separate the brackets from the roof panel which are for adjustment/alignment, those should not be required either. You need those if you are replacing the lift arms; as noted in the photos linked above.
Bottom line - for clean & lube, if you don't loosen or remove the wrong bits, it should all go back together smoothly.
The only other tools are the little plastic adjustment gauges, and if you don't separate the brackets from the roof panel which are for adjustment/alignment, those should not be required either. You need those if you are replacing the lift arms; as noted in the photos linked above.
Bottom line - for clean & lube, if you don't loosen or remove the wrong bits, it should all go back together smoothly.
I have taken the mechanism totally apart on my 500E & it’s not a difficult task (45 minutes?). A clean up & new felts this weekend will have it back together. Dave’s Pictures are excellent for describing what bolts should not be touched etc. I printed the pictures off along with the WIS documents & carefully read & reread each stage before proceeding.
Regarding my post #25 above I do think I will have to pull the headlining & sunroof to repair my 300E-24 roof that won’t roll back. I have made a trial run on that with a spare W124 Roof I have in the garage (Everyone should have one!) This mechanism is in perfect order so most of it (If not all) will be swapped into my 300E-24 after a service & Glietpasting also. The Sunroof parts from MB are quite expensive. A A pair of slider arms for example are £350.40 from Mercedes
Regarding my post #25 above I do think I will have to pull the headlining & sunroof to repair my 300E-24 roof that won’t roll back. I have made a trial run on that with a spare W124 Roof I have in the garage (Everyone should have one!) This mechanism is in perfect order so most of it (If not all) will be swapped into my 300E-24 after a service & Glietpasting also. The Sunroof parts from MB are quite expensive. A A pair of slider arms for example are £350.40 from Mercedes
Exactly correct. If one uses the compression tool or something like it with a used sunroof gasket, the result is binding at the front and an air noise at the rear.
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For those curious – these are the MB sunroof tools which are available from Germany. I didn’t know the price until they actually got here – one was £1.60 and the other £0.20.... a pleasant surprise. (124589182100 + 124589172100)
The larger sunroof tool as pictured below (Pic courtesy of GSXR) is currently only available on back order from Germany at approx £48.00. So you can order it but god knows when it will turn up. However as discussed above it’s not needed unless you are fitting a brand new gasket.
I have went ahead & ordered a full new set of Felt Pads also for the 500E. The parts prices are exorbitant to say the least but I value my time more at this stage so they’re going in before the roof goes back together. All in all the Paste, tools + 1 set of pads will end up about £200
The larger sunroof tool as pictured below (Pic courtesy of GSXR) is currently only available on back order from Germany at approx £48.00. So you can order it but god knows when it will turn up. However as discussed above it’s not needed unless you are fitting a brand new gasket.
I have went ahead & ordered a full new set of Felt Pads also for the 500E. The parts prices are exorbitant to say the least but I value my time more at this stage so they’re going in before the roof goes back together. All in all the Paste, tools + 1 set of pads will end up about £200
What is recommended for greasing the sunroof cable? Ie- I have withdrawn the later type cable out of its sheath.
Not sure if Glietpaste is appropriate for the cable- at least the worm drive section of it anyway. Should I use synthetic grease on the cable or what is recommended?
Not sure if Glietpaste is appropriate for the cable- at least the worm drive section of it anyway. Should I use synthetic grease on the cable or what is recommended?
I'm pretty sure Gleitpaste is also used for the cable... maybe Klink or Jono can confirm?
Yes, it is.
For those curious – these are the MB sunroof tools which are available from Germany. I didn’t know the price until they actually got here – one was £1.60 and the other £0.20.... a pleasant surprise. (124589182100 + 124589172100)
View attachment 52509
The larger sunroof tool as pictured below (Pic courtesy of GSXR) is currently only available on back order from Germany at approx £48.00. So you can order it but god knows when it will turn up. However as discussed above it’s not needed unless you are fitting a brand new gasket.
View attachment 52510
I have went ahead & ordered a full new set of Felt Pads also for the 500E. The parts prices are exorbitant to say the least but I value my time more at this stage so they’re going in before the roof goes back together. All in all the Paste, tools + 1 set of pads will end up about £200
i be trying to find the parts (124589182100 + 124589172100) online but did not manage. has anyone a link to buy or to an exact drawing so I can 3d print those?
They are both available still, at least in Sweden/Denmark.
