FYI HOW TO: Registering Euro 500E in California - Passed CARB / EPA certification

[mrindiafromuk]

Moderator edit: Moved from Off-topic to How-To section, since this question repeatedly, repeatedly, repeatedly comes up on every single BaT auction for a non-North-American-spec 036. Read this entire thread from beginning to end, @mrindiafromuk documented the journey in great detail. TLDR - plan on it taking many months of slicing through red tape, along with ±$10k in total cost.


Hi Friends

I just wanted to let you all know that my 1991 500E German model passed the EPA Certification last week on Friday 1st March 2024. I sent it to get the modifications and certification work on 3rd Jan 2024.

I got to admit I was a little anxious about sending my car to Santa Ana, the only place in CA that is doing this work for EPA.

I will be posting a video of the whole process soon when I get may car back and I have manger to register it. I will also be talking about my experience and pitfalls of buying from buying this car from Bring a Trailer.

 

[gsxr]

That is fantastic! I know the process isn't complete yet, but do you have a ballpark estimate on the total cost involved all the certifications needed?

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Just the certification process which included all the modification is estimated max to be $9,990. I will have a final invoice in a few days.

The car needed to be in good mechanical condition, The EPA place insisted I did not send a bad car.

Including a transmission rebuilt and prop shaft work with domes, leaking rear engine main seals, corroded dizy cap, Gear linkages and service with new spark plugs I spent about $7k getting the car into 100% as new driving condition. And it now drives like It came out of the showroom in 1991. BTW - All this work was not declared in the Bring A Trailer Posting and videos. Very deceptive advertising. Lying by omission.

So on top of the purchase price I have spend $17k. in addition transport an import duties was $4k. and now I face an additional $3k CA tax when I register it.

I will be into the car for $54k. But......It is perfect . Just needs my lower slabs painted and that will remove all road rash. $5k Then it becomes a queen. I will get is PPF all over and drive it every moment I can.

I love the condition of the car and I was excited by this car because it had a new engine from Mercedes 50k miles ago. Which makes it a great car for my Renntech 6.0 upgrade I plan to do. This will be my homage to the hammer. I am in current dialogue with Renntech Classic dept, planning the 6.0 build.

So this has been an unexpected cost. Originally I purchased the car from Canada thinking I would have been able to register it here in CA. This is what caught me out. If this was a Canada orignal car I would have had no issue regstering in CA. But it had been imported into Canada from germany and this is where I got caught out. I am fortunate that at this moment in my life I have been able to take on the cost.

 

[doolar]

Now that's commitment! Looking forward to seeing the car on here!

 

[duuder]

please keep us posted on the Renntech 6.0 upgrade

 

[Jlaa]

Congratulations man! Little by little you are taking on the unknown unknowns!!!

 

[RicardoD]

Mr. India, I thought you were out of your mind with this attempt but now it is time for me to praise you and your fearlessness (and financial risk) to make this happen. You are paving the way for future E500s to make their way stateside. Congratulations.

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Mr. India, I thought you were out of your mind with this attempt but now it is time for me to praise you and your fearlessness (and financial risk) to make this happen. You are paving the way for future E500s to make their way stateside. Congratulations.

Thanks a lot. I am insane for sure .

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Congratulations man! Little by little you are taking on the unknown unknowns!!!

Thanks

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Hi Peeps

Today on 3rd April the CHP (California Highway Patrol) inspected my car for a VIN verification. The officer would not verify the vin because it was not road legal. Turned out there was window tint on front passenger and driver window which was the blocker. He kindly gave me a blade to remove the tint, only then he would verify the vin.

So that got done and I went back to the DMV and they have accepted my paperwork and sent it all to DMV sacramento. Until then I will drive on temp operating permit. have to keep renewing every 2 months until the DMV finalize the registration or not. BTW the CHP recognized the emissions. final bit to this chapter is to get the plates. fingers crossed.

label and noted in the vin certification that G&K auto had done the work.

 

[natejgreene9871]

wow so basically $13,000 just in California specific emissions modifications and BS taxes? I would refuse out of principal that's just absurd.

What are they even doing? I would assume slapping on smog pumps and retarding the timing.

Can't you register your car in a different state and drive it in California? I've heard that South Dakota is a popular place to register but I don't know specifics.

Why Are There So Many South Dakota License Plates in Mexico?

Why are there so many South Dakota License Plates in Mexico anyway? An American couple that lives in Mexico explained it like this.

kxrb.com

 

[mrindiafromuk]

wow so basically $13,000 just in California specific emissions modifications and BS taxes? I would refuse out of principal that's just absurd.

What are they even doing? I would assume slapping on smog pumps and retarding the timing.

I thought a lot about registration out of state. However we got to start with it was my choice to take this path. Being critical of myself I could have sourced a US spec car. I also learned from CHP today that they use the state wide cameras to take pictures of all number plates and use software highlight out of state cars that are not registered and flag them as cars if interest.

Living in CA is for sure expensive, on the flip side my family was a victim of the wild fires and when we needed CA to support it citizens the gov stepped up and stopped the insurance companies from using loop holes to not pay up. There are pro’s and cons for living here. I am not political but in the end I am ok with paying taxes where I can afford. It’s everyone

Can't you register your car in a different state and drive it in California? I've heard that South Dakota is a popular place to register but I don't know specifics.

Why Are There So Many South Dakota License Plates in Mexico?

Why are there so many South Dakota License Plates in Mexico anyway? An American couple that lives in Mexico explained it like this.

kxrb.com

yep I thought hard about avoiding CA taxes , but in the end I feel ok about not avoiding the taxes. I love living in CA. We were victims of the wild fires and lost everything back in 2017. California stood by us. I guess it’s a two way relationship. I appreciate a lot of people are frustrated by the cost of being on CA. I am no millionaire but I try to stay the right side of the law. Technically having a car long term on out of state plates on not legal. Being critical of myself I could have sourced a US spec car and avoided all of this . However it was my choice to source a European car. there was no detune of my car during the emission certification. It did get new cats .

I do admit it has cost me more than I expected and part of that cost was the mechanical work I needed to spend money on after buying the car . But hey I am loving the whole process and documenting it all for a YouTube episode .

 

[Jlaa]

I thought a lot about registration out of state. However we got to start with it was my choice to take this path. Being critical of myself I could have sourced a US spec car. I also learned from CHP today that they use the state wide cameras to take pictures of all number plates and use software highlight out of state cars that are not registered and flag them as cars if interest.
Living in CA is for sure expensive, on the flip side my family was a victim of the wild fires and when we needed CA to support it citizens the gov stepped up and stopped the insurance companies from using loop holes to not pay up. There are pro’s and cons for living here. I am not political but in the end I am ok with paying taxes where I can afford. It’s everyone

yep I thought hard about avoiding CA taxes , but in the end I feel ok about not avoiding the taxes. I love living in CA. We were victims of the wild fires and lost everything back in 2017. California stood by us. I guess it’s a two way relationship. I appreciate a lot of people are frustrated by the cost of being on CA. I am no millionaire but I try to stay the right side of the law. Technically having a car long term on out of state plates on not legal. Being critical of myself I could have sourced a US spec car and avoided all of this . However it was my choice to source a European car. there was no detune of my car during the emission certification. It did get new cats .
I do admit it has cost me more than I expected and part of that cost was the mechanical work I needed to spend money on after buying the car . But hey I am loving the whole process and documenting it all for a YouTube episode .

Thanks for sharing. Would it be possible to see a picture / info on the catalysts that were installed?

 

[bgalakazam]

I am importing a European spec SL320 next year when I return to the US. It is over 25 years old, considered a classic, and DOT + EPA should not apply.


What was the reason you had to do the EPA conversion? Engine? Sounds like a Commifornia thing (I lived there 13+ years fyi).

 

[gsxr]

I am importing a European spec SL320 next year when I return to the US. It is over 25 years old, considered a classic, and DOT + EPA should not apply.

What was the reason you had to do the EPA conversion? Engine? Sounds like a Commifornia thing (I lived there 13+ years fyi).

This is for California only. [Moderator edit - meaning CARB not EPA conversion]

 

[gsxr]

Thanks for sharing. Would it be possible to see a picture / info on the catalysts that were installed?

Wait, did catalysts have to be changed / replaced? This car had original factory cats that were visually in perfect condition (photos here).

 

[Jlaa]

Wait, did catalysts have to be changed / replaced? This car had original factory cats that were visually in perfect condition (photos here).

Yes here below!

….. there was no detune of my car during the emission certification. It did get new cats .

Interested to know more, here, documented for posterity, so that 500Eboard doesn’t act solely as a pointer/free advertising for a YouTube video which surely will be a broken link in the future….

 

[gsxr]

WTH!!! New cats should NEVER have been installed unless the measured emissions were above the max limits.

What happened to the old/original cats? Were the honeycombs intact when removed?

 

[TerryA]

I am importing a European spec SL320 next year when I return to the US. It is over 25 years old, considered a classic, and DOT + EPA should not apply.

View attachment 187535
What was the reason you had to do the EPA conversion? Engine? Sounds like a Commifornia thing (I lived there 13+ years fyi).

I recently checked with my smog guy thinking I might be able to remove the CATs. He told me that my 1984 Euro 500SL still requires the CA Smog Test.

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Thanks for sharing. Would it be possible to see a picture / info on the catalysts that were installed?

Let me see , I don’t think the spec was put on my invoice but here are some pics there are some labels if you zoom in

 

[gsxr]

What was the reason given for replacing the cats with aftermarket? Save those originals!

 

[Jlaa]

Let me see , I don’t think the spec was put on my invoice but here are some pics there are some labels if you zoom in
View attachment 187551View attachment 187552View attachment 187553

Thanks for sharing! Fascinating! A bit of a shame that the original catalysts in beautiful condition were cut off instead of retaining the original fastening flanges...... but oh well. It is what it is. I tried doing a google search for "750755 catalyst" but didn't find anything. Wonder what brand that aftermarket catalyst is ....

I don't think that's a Magnaflow number ... not sure if it is a Walker number....

 

[Jlaa]

@mrindiafromuk - curious about the catalyst selection and installation --- is this something the California BAR did, or did they tell you to go to an independent shop which then installed the catalyst?

 

[gsxr]

wow so basically $13,000 just in California specific emissions modifications and BS taxes? I would refuse out of principal that's just absurd.

What are they even doing? I would assume slapping on smog pumps and retarding the timing.

Zero modifications are required, as long as no equipment was removed or modified. The emissions equipment is identical worldwide for all 124.034/.036 chassis with factory catalysts. If the HC levels were abnormally high despite the fuel/ignition systems all being in good shape, and catalysts were properly heated prior to testing, that would be the only reason to consider replacing the catalysts. This is NOT a common problem (although, some shops may try to push for repairs that aren't needed, because profit.)

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Thanks for sharing! Fascinating! A bit of a shame that the original catalysts in beautiful condition were cut off instead of retaining the original fastening flanges...... but oh well. It is what it is. I tried doing a google search for "750755 catalyst" but didn't find anything. Wonder what brand that aftermarket catalyst is ....

I don't think that's a Magnaflow number ... not sure if it is a Walker number....

 

[mrindiafromuk]

They have the cats custom made for G&k auto . That’s what the owner of G&k told me. [Moderator Edit - G & K Automotive Services | Conversion and Modification]

 

[Alphasud40]

Looking at the aftermarket cat installation I can’t help thinking they just added restrictions and a reduction of power. What’s funny and what GSXR had mentioned was proper conditioning prior to testing if testing was even performed. Not sure if they performed a true IM240 rolling dynamometer test or just a 2 part idle test. If they really wanted to help the situation installing pre-cats closer to the manifolds would be the way to do it. Instead they installed inferior catalytic converters and doubled them up. Pure nonsense IMHO. And yes the days where people in California register their cars in other states is coming to a halt. At least in metropolitan areas.

 

[gsxr]

And yes the days where people in California register their cars in other states is coming to a halt. At least in metropolitan areas.

Is CA actually cracking down on the out-of-state plate thing? This is news to me... I wonder how it's being enforced.

 

[yao500e]

Hi Friends

I just wanted to let you all know that my 1991 500E German model passed the EPA Certification last week on Friday 1st March 2024. I sent it to get the modifications and certification work on 3rd Jan 2024.

I got to admit I was a little anxious about sending my car to Santa Ana, the only place in CA that is doing this work for EPA.

I will be posting a video of the whole process soon when I get may car back and I have manger to register it. I will also be talking about my experience and pitfalls of buying from buying this car from Bring a Trailer.


View attachment 185030

beautiful 500E! congratutions on California!

 

[Alphasud40]

I have heard from people on another forum that they are starting to really enforce the out of state license plates. It’s more of a money thing. They are losing revenue.

 

[TerryA]

@mrindiafromuk,
A Canadian 500E should have the same smog equipment and DOT specs as a US 500E. No modifications to this car should have been required. I would have thought a simple letter from Mercedes Benz USA would have sufficed the CA DMV. I would guess that CA DMV would make you prove that the car was in spec for whatever reason.

Just a question but did you ever attempt to get a CA Smog Test before you took it to G&A for modification? It’s weird how they removed the what appears to be perfectly stock CATs from your car and replaced them with new CATs when Glen’s high miler CA registered 500E has over 625K miles on the original CATs. My car 93. 500E recently passed CA Smog with 143K+ miles with flying colors.

Just speculation but maybe G&K had to show that they did something to the car to make it pass CA omissions.

These CATs look to be in great condition.

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Hello Peeps,

I had received a letter from Sacramento a few weeks ago saying I was missing some paperwork to register my 500E in CA. After a very nice call with Sacramento DMV I went back in to my local office and resubmitted the so called missing paper work, which BTW was not missing. They said they did not have the California Highway Patrol VIN Verification. It was there they just did not see it. Its happened.

In the mean time my temporary operating permit expired on 31st May. I went into the CA DMV office on Tuesday this week to renew my temporary operating permit fro another 2 months and they gave me a permit that expires end of June. Bit puzzles why. I was puzzled why so short a term on the operating permit. The DMV "Technician" told me I would hear from Sacramento before the end of June. 2 days later (today) I opened my mail box and it has happened. My CA registration of my German 500E is complete.

I can now complete my YouTube Vidoe of the whole process. Not as painful as I was led to believe. I am going to stick my neck out and say I this might be the only non usa 500E officially registered in the state of California. Would love to hear from anyone else who has managed to get their no-usa 500E registered in USA.

 

[gsxr]

Congratulations on the successful registration adventure!

What was the final, total cost for the certification / registration process in California?

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Total cost to get the car here

$ 2,900 Transport the car into CA
$ 395 Formal Port Entry Fee over 25 yrs
$ 853 import duty
$ 3,726 CA Tax and registration
$ 10,000 for EPA certification, which included supply and install of 2 CATS
$ 7,500 Mechanical work needed to make good for EPA testing including a transmission rebuild which may have not been needed for test but ot was clunky. so possible it could hve been $4k less

$17,874 total cost without mechanical repair cost. but they were needed to get the EPA done so including that $25,374.

Add $30k purchase price

The car stands me at $55,374. I guess this is a keeper until values change. Next project is 6.0 upgrade, but that might wait because I am chasing an old 2008 Ferrari V12 to turn into a project car an make a manual gated car.

However it drives and looks like a car that came out of the showroom 2 years old.

If anyone wants and advice, dont hesitate to tap me up. BTW I have not cut any corners. All legit I have not found a way to short cut the $10k EPA cost. Well, not without registering the care in another state, which I did not want to do.

I am creating a YouTube Episode to share the whole process and what is needed to be done.

 

[duuder]

sorry to say but that dollar amount spent is the definition of pain...

who do you plan on using for the 6.0? i was going that route but decided to get an art piece instead

 

[mrindiafromuk]

sorry to say but that dollar amount spent is the definition of pain...

who do you plan on using for the 6.0? i was going that route but decided to get an art piece instead

Originally it was Renntech and I still have them in mind, however I just came off a week long Rally with Ferrari and I met someone there who is big into AMGs and he is recommending someone else. I dont have details yet.

 

[gsxr]

Originally it was Renntech and I still have them in mind, however I just came off a week long Rally with Ferrari and I met someone there who is big into AMGs and he is recommending someone else. I dont have details yet.

Oooo! Is the alternate 6L builder located in USA? There are a couple of places in Germany (VÄTH comes to mind) but I have a feeling they will all be in the same overall price ballpark.

 

[Alphasud40]

I bet Jake Raby would take this on. He has experience with aluminum bore engines. I talked to him a while back about rebuilding a Porsche Cayenne engine which uses alusil bores. He was rebuilding them.

Jake Raby's The Knowledge Gruppe and Rennvision - LN Engineering

Jake Raby is bringing more than 30 years of his experience rebuilding Porsche engines to create his engine rebuild DVDs and torque spec books.

lnengineering.com

 

[mrindiafromuk]

I bet Jake Raby would take this on. He has experience with aluminum bore engines. I talked to him a while back about rebuilding a Porsche Cayenne engine which uses alusil bores. He was rebuilding them.

Jake Raby's The Knowledge Gruppe and Rennvision - LN Engineering

Jake Raby is bringing more than 30 years of his experience rebuilding Porsche engines to create his engine rebuild DVDs and torque spec books.

lnengineering.com

Where is he based

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Oooo! Is the alternate 6L builder located in USA? There are a couple of places in Germany (VÄTH comes to mind) but I have a feeling they will all be in the same overall price ballpark.

Yes I believe in California

 

[mottati]

Is CA actually cracking down on the out-of-state plate thing? This is news to me... I wonder how it's being enforced.

i've 'heard' they are where it's an obvious tax evasion situation, new gt3 rs etc. But "old cars" chp officers i've talked to can care less. There are so many cars running around california with expired plates, no plates and other so obvious issues, a montana plate is low priority on a 30 year old car.

 

[gerryvz]

I guess the @gsxr had best stay out of the PRK with his Montana plates......

 

[gsxr]

I guess the @gsxr had best stay out of the PRK with his Montana plates......

I have the MT driver license to back it up. PRK may not be amused by CA licensees with MT plates.

 

[gerryvz]

I am going to stick my neck out and say I this might be the only non usa 500E officially registered in the state of California. Would love to hear from anyone else who has managed to get their no-usa 500E registered in USA.

Christian (who is a member of this forum, and who I referred to you some months back, going through similar problem) was able to get his car registered and approved a while back. He imported his car from Europe, as well.

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Christian (who is a member of this forum, and who I referred to you some months back, going through similar problem) was able to get his car registered and approved a while back. He imported his car from Europe, as well.

@mrindiafromuk,
A Canadian 500E should have the same smog equipment and DOT specs as a US 500E. No modifications to this car should have been required. I would have thought a simple letter from Mercedes Benz USA would have sufficed the CA DMV. I would guess that CA DMV would make you prove that the car was in spec for whatever reason.

Just a question but did you ever attempt to get a CA Smog Test before you took it to G&A for modification? It’s weird how they removed the what appears to be perfectly stock CATs from your car and replaced them with new CATs when Glen’s high miler CA registered 500E has over 625K miles on the original CATs. My car 93. 500E recently passed CA Smog with 143K+ miles with flying colors.

Just speculation but maybe G&K had to show that they did something to the car to make it pass CA omissions.

These CATs look to be in great condition.

I did get in touch with Mercedes USA and Mercedes Classic division to try and get a letter. It was a dead end. I found out that it was Mercedes that lobbied for the gray market import regulations, so this is why I was getting no support from Mercedes to get a letter. I did go and get a smog check at my local station and it was way below the limits. I am not sure why the CATS were changed. Its a bit of a black box getting any meaningful information from G&K. I spoke to the owner on many occasions and every time I asked a technical question he deflected. So it is possible since they have the monopoly in CA for this work they just charge a minimum of $10k. If i think about it to hard then i start sinning up conspiracy theories. I am done with it now. Looking back I should have researched better before buying this particular car.

 

[mrindiafromuk]

@mrindiafromuk - curious about the catalyst selection and installation --- is this something the California BAR did, or did they tell you to go to an independent shop which then installed the catalyst?

I had no choice it was done by G&K

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Christian (who is a member of this forum, and who I referred to you some months back, going through similar problem) was able to get his car registered and approved a while back. He imported his car from Europe, as well.

So I did speak with Christian. @cr7777 . Some how his car slipped through and 2 years later he could not get smog and was asked to do what I did. So I don't think he was able to renew his registration.

 

[Eagle01]

I imported mine from EU and it’s about two years now. I live in Florida and the whole process was straightforward. I had to pay import tax at the port and inspected to a special DMV office.
Congratulations to Mr. India and respect!! I love you commitment!!

 

[gerryvz]

So I did speak with Christian. @cr7777 . Some how his car slipped through and 2 years later he could not get smog and was asked to do what I did. So I don't think he was able to renew his registration.

Nope, he did. I ran into his wife (my former boss at my previous job) a couple of months ago at an event in San Jose, and she (and he via text) told me they were successful. I helped them out with some stuff to get it done.

 

[mrindiafromuk]

Nope, he did. I ran into his wife (my former boss at my previous job) a couple of months ago at an event in San Jose, and she (and he via text) told me they were successful. I helped them out with some stuff to get it done.

well that’s awesome