The $400 400E

[sheward]

I think FCP lists "OE supplier" as a company that supplies some parts for MB but maybe not the part in question. I've been using FCP for Audi parts and my thought is I'll use "OE supplier" parts where installation or removal is not difficult since they warranty their parts. Otherwise, genuine when available.
I agree with a777fan on just going with genuine on this. Seems to me I've read where others had early failures with something else.

 

[Beater400E]

Yeah, I ordered the MB switch. I was mostly just curious if anyone had any experience with the mysterious OE Supplier thing.

Also, I've been having impure thoughts...

 

[sheward]

Jonathan tells me these are out of stock until a minimum number of units are ordered. There's definitely one in my future.

 

[Beater400E]

Jonathan tells me these are out of stock until a minimum number of units are ordered. There's definitely one in my future.

I wonder what the minimum number is. That price seems like a great deal if they can actually do it for that.

 

[gsxr]

I wonder what the minimum number is. That price seems like a great deal if they can actually do it for that.

I believe MOQ is 25, which is quite a few... a dealer would have to fork out $25k up front and hope to slowly recoup over time.

 

[Beater400E]

I believe MOQ is 25, which is quite a few... a dealer would have to fork out $25k up front and hope to slowly recoup over time.

Oof. That's a lot.

 

[gsxr]

FCP has a genuine Mercedes switch for $63, or an "OE Supplier" switch for $34. I'm curious about the OE Supplier thing. Anyone have any idea what that really means? Is it even worth considering the OE Supplier switch, or any other non-genuine part?

I saw this last year and gambled on one to see what would arrive. It appeared to be real OEM. I don't recall seeing these available in the past, odd they are showing up in the aftermarket channel now.

Also, my temperature readout stopped working today. I recently replaced the LCD and it's been working fine, but today it just went blank. Any common things to check?

Check the sensor, there are specs in the FSM for temp / ohms. Above/below a certain amount, the display will go blank.

 

[Jlaa]

I believe MOQ is 25, which is quite a few... a dealer would have to fork out $25k up front and hope to slowly recoup over time.

This is a fascinating study on the power of interest rates w.r.t. inflation. @5thscaleracer floated the MoQ cash to buy 25+ pieces of Wavetrac last time while interest rates were near 0% and sold through those units over time.

Now, anyone who wishes to do the same (with arguable lesser demand now that some of the market demand has been satiated) now need to factor in the opportunity cost of that cash earning 5% vs. sitting in slow-moving Wavetrac inventory. @maw1124

 

[gsxr]

@Jlaa, yup... although in this case, I think your point B is the bigger concern vs point 1. Pent up demand meant moving through all 25 pretty quick - a year or less? Today, I dunno, that could take a few years. Also depends how they are advertised / marketed. offered on a worldwide platform (say, eBay) with international shipping, they could move quickly - but the price will be higher to offset eBay's cut, which will slow sales if they are $1500 (or whatever).

 

[Beater400E]

I reached out to Mammoth Racing and asked about availability. Just on the off chance that a batch had been made and we were unaware.

They confirmed that they do not have any in stock and that Wavetrac does not have an estimate on availability.

 

[Jlaa]

I’ll sell my new in box Wavetrac for EUR5000 ….

 

[Beater400E]

Looks like SRT8 differentials are reasonably affordable. I have welders and a machine shop. How hard can it be?

 

[5thscaleracer]

I believe MOQ is 25, which is quite a few... a dealer would have to fork out $25k up front and hope to slowly recoup over time.

I am doing this with the 190E 16V group as we speak my 25 units order from WT has been delivered I am sitting on 10 left.

I have 2 on wait list for 210mm diff long way to hit 25 units.

 

[5thscaleracer]

I reached out to Mammoth Racing and asked about availability. Just on the off chance that a batch had been made and we were unaware.

They confirmed that they do not have any in stock and that Wavetrac does not have an estimate on availability.

FYI i got that call... you contact Mammoth, WT will contact me because i am the dummy who would stock this stuff for them.

 

[Beater400E]

FYI i got that call... you contact Mammoth, WT will contact me because i am the dummy who would stock this stuff for them.

Good to know. Thanks. Sounds like it'll be a long time before we can get our hands on these.

 

[Beater400E]

 

[a777fan]

Emoticons aren’t enough for that mess!

 

[gsxr]

Make sure to re-install with JB Weld this time, not Bondo.

 

[Bogeyman]

Duct tape always works for me...

 

[Beater400E]

I'm stripping the last few parts off this S500. Any parts in particular I need to be sure to grab? I'm particularly looking at the knock sensors. Should I pull the block and yank those sensors? Is anything from the rear diff/axles useful on the 400E?

 

[gsxr]

I'm stripping the last few parts off this S500. Any parts in particular I need to be sure to grab? I'm particularly looking at the knock sensors. Should I pull the block and yank those sensors? Is anything from the rear diff/axles useful on the 400E?

If the knock sensors are still mostly intact, it might be worth trying to extract them (NLA, of course). If they shatter when you remove the bolt, nevermind. All the rear axle stuff is totally different, useless on a 124. That diff is the "reinforced" 210 diff and nothing interchanges with the W124 diff. Antenna may be good for parts... transmission... misc engine bits.

 

[Beater400E]

The knock sensors look ok from what I can tell. I guess I'll pull them. The trans and antenna are already out on a shelf. Most of the engine bay is in boxes now.

 

[Beater400E]

The lazy way

 

[Beater400E]

Nope. The sensors were cracked and broken under the engine mount brackets. So, what are our options for new knock sensors if we need them?

 

[gsxr]

Kurth has a replacement harness that connects to the replaceable knock sensors used on 96-up M119's, that's pretty much the only option I'm aware of. Fortunately these are relatively rare failures.

 

[gerryvz]

Behind every ambitious man working on a MB rebuild / engine out project is a reliable Toyota …. standing by that man, quietly providing mundane transport.

Or Lexus IS500F ... or 4Runner ...

 

[Beater400E]

Got the S500 pushed back out. Working on getting the parts all cleaned up and stored safely. Amazingly, the heads looked fine, so those are stashed away, I'm sure never to be seen again until my estate sale.

I anticipate tearing into the 5 liter engine later this week.

I got my new headlight switch installed. I did just get a genuine MB W140 switch. Now I'm looking at a few other little details. My outside temperature is now displaying fine. I can't explain it. It did coincide with the failed headlight switch, but I don't know how those two would be connected. It's probably just intermittently failing. I'll wait for it to flake out again.

I decided to check on another minor issue today as well. My SRS light never illuminates. The bulb is good, and all bulbs are in the correct locations. That light just never illuminates.

I'm just starting to investigate it. If anyone has any suggestions for what might cause that, let me know. Otherwise I'll post up whatever I find.

 

[Beater400E]

Figured out the SRS light. Apparently when I had the center console out I'd messed with the control module and I guess I never fully reseated the wiring to the module. Pushed the connector fully in and now the light works as expected.

I also swapped back to the stock lamp out relay, so I once again have a warning light for my CHMSL. I'll probably end up adding a resistor. Just need to decide how and where I want to install it. Don't want to hack things much and I know those resistors will put out some heat, so I just need to find an appropriate home for it.

 

[Beater400E]

I decided to go ahead and order a set of the blue NGK plug wires. Summit Racing had them for $221 with free shipping. When they arrive I'll report on lengths and such.

 

[Beater400E]

I got the resistor installed for the CHMSL. I mounted it in the trunk right next to the antenna. That took care of the bulb out indicator.

I'll be tearing into the 5 liter this weekend. Hopefully there are no nasty surprises. I expect the refresh to take a few weeks, mainly because I'm sure I'll find something that will require ordering parts and then waiting on shipping.

I'm still lusting after a stick shift in this car. I know it doesn't make financial sense, but I don't care.

I'm considering purchasing a transmission in preparation, but I wanted to see if anyone had any feedback on it first. I found a 711.670 trans from a C250 CDI. It's on ebay, and would be shipped from Lithuania.

Purchase price including shipping is less than $500. That seems almost suspiciously cheap for a transmission that will have to be shipped halfway around the world, but eBay does a pretty good job of protecting buyers so... probably little risk.

Anyone have any thoughts on that particular transmission? It's a NSG-510, which I've heard is the beefiest 6 speed Mercedes ever put in a car. I'm sure a more common NSG-400 from a US spec w203 would be adequate, but considering how cheap this other trans is, I'm thinking it might be worth it to just grab this.

 

[a777fan]

Sorry if I missed it- whats the plans for the 5L? This is the engine with the damage block, right? I would figure the whole thing would be a giant paperweight at this point

 

[Beater400E]

Sorry if I missed it- whats the plans for the 5L? This is the engine with the damage block, right? I would figure the whole thing would be a giant paperweight at this point

I have two of them. The one with the broken block is in my 94 S500 parts car. I also have a nice one on a stand that came out of a 95 S500. That's the one I'm going to refresh and swap into the 400E.

 

[Beater400E]

I pulled the trigger on the trans. We'll see what happens.

 

[Beater400E]

It begins

 

[Beater400E]

In memoriam

 

[Beater400E]

Holy sludge

 

[gsxr]

I don't think I've ever seen that much gunk inside an M119.

 

[Beater400E]

I don't think I've ever seen that much gunk inside an M119.


View attachment 184342

Yeah, that's probably the most sludge I've ever seen in an engine. So far I don't see any excessive wear though. Cylinders look fine. Once I figure out how to get this on an engine stand without the pan on it I'll flip it over and pull bearings to inspect.

 

[Beater400E]

 

[gsxr]

Yeah, that's probably the most sludge I've ever seen in an engine. So far I don't see any excessive wear though. Cylinders look fine. Once I figure out how to get this on an engine stand without the pan on it I'll flip it over and pull bearings to inspect.

I've seen 6L engines with a hole drilled/tapped near the bottom of the block, just above the oil pan area, so it could be mounted to a stand for flipping. Why Mercedes didn't do this on all M119 blocks, I have no idea.

 

[Beater400E]

I've seen 6L engines with a hole drilled/tapped near the bottom of the block, just above the oil pan area, so it could be mounted to a stand for flipping. Why Mercedes didn't do this on all M119 blocks, I have no idea.

That's a good idea, but I came up with my own solution. There are 2 bolt holes and 2 studs on the bellhousing flange. Obviously the bolt holes are fine. The issue is the studs. They aren't long enough to go through the arms on the engine stand.



The solution was to make a couple long nuts. I just took a couple 2 inch pieces of 1/2 inch round steel and drilled and tapped them to 10x1.5mm.


Threaded those onto the studs, then slid the engine stand over the studs, and threaded bolts into the ends of the nut sleeves.

 

[Beater400E]

Bearings are actually looking great.

 

[a777fan]

Nuts. Wonder if the sludge was post the last time this was run? Can’t imagine a world where an engine with that much gunk in the oil pan wouldn’t have damage.

 

[Beater400E]

Nuts. Wonder if the sludge was post the last time this was run? Can’t imagine a world where an engine with that much gunk in the oil pan wouldn’t have damage.

I suspect this is a situation where the M119 oil capacity provides a major benefit. Even with a significant amount of sludge in the bottom of the pan, there would still be plenty of oil to circulate throughout the engine. This looks like the result of poor quality oil and VERY long intervals between oil changes.

 

[a777fan]

Agreed. Regardless of the origin. Sad to see!

 

[Beater400E]

I'm preparing another parts order to hopefully get the rest of what I'll need for the engine swap.

I replaced the engine mounts last year with some cheap no name mounts. They're still fine, but I'm considering installing something better while I have the engine out. OE mounts are shockingly expensive though. Are there any other options that are worth considering? Honestly I think I'd rather pay $100 for a pair of cheap ones every few years than $500 for a set of OE that probably won't last 5 times as long. If there's a worthwhile option in between I'd consider it.

 

[Beater400E]

For that matter, is any non-OE oil pressure switch worth considering?

 

[dreaming.haze]

I'm preparing another parts order to hopefully get the rest of what I'll need for the engine swap.

I replaced the engine mounts last year with some cheap no name mounts. They're still fine, but I'm considering installing something better while I have the engine out. OE mounts are shockingly expensive though. Are there any other options that are worth considering? Honestly I think I'd rather pay $100 for a pair of cheap ones every few years than $500 for a set of OE that probably won't last 5 times as long. If there's a worthwhile option in between I'd consider it.

Personally, I'd pay up for OE mounts. Years ago you could have had some lemforder boxed OE mounts for a discount, but that well dried up. It will never be easier to change them out with the engine swap happening.

 

[Beater400E]

Personally, I'd pay up for OE mounts. Years ago you could have had some lemforder boxed OE mounts for a discount, but that well dried up. It will never be easier to change them out with the engine swap happening.

Definitely true that it won't be easier than when the engine is already out, but that's a lot of money to sink into a $400 034. If it were an 036, I'd do it for sure, but the labor required to do it again down the road isn't so much for me to be willing to proactively spend more than I paid for the car on motor mounts.

If there isn't a less expensive option that isn't total junk, I'll just stick with what I have for now.

 

[Beater400E]

Who knows about the oil filter check valve upgrade thing? This engine is a 95, so it should have the updated check valve, right? Is there any reason to put a new check valve in it while I have it apart?