• Hi Guest !

    Welcome to the 500Eboard forum.

    Since its founding in late 2008, 500Eboard has become the leading resource on the Internet for all things related to the Mercedes-Benz 500E and E500. In recent years, we have also expanded to include the 400E and E420 models, which are directly related to the 500E/E500.

    We invite you to browse and take advantage of the information and resources here on the site. If you find helpful information, please register for full membership, and you'll find even more resources available. Feel free to ask questions, and make liberal use of the "Search" function to find answers.

    We hope you will become an active contributor to the community!

    Sincerely,
    500Eboard Management

The $400 400E

Yep. Their ability to be ‘on the ball’ has REALLY fallen off, slowly, ever since I started in on the w124 game ~7years ago. Prior to this most recent update, I was only using them for things I was ordering WAY ahead, since it seemed to take WEEKS for my orders to finally show up.

I found myself being OK paying slightly more at other sites just to avoid the mess that its become. Now that the promo code is essentially ‘gone’, i see no need to ever go back. It’s a shame.
 
I've been back and forth with Naperville via phone and email all day about these bearings. First they said 111-038-09-10 did not supersede 102-038-42-10. Now they're saying they do. What I have been able to figure out for sure is that the 111-038-09-10 bearings are for sure sold as individual bearing halves, all of which will have the oil hole. They come in boxes of 2, but you do have to purchase 16 to get a full set. 16 halves in 8 boxes.

We're still trying to figure out if there's any difference between the 119-030-04-40 and 119-030-05-40 main bearings. I can't find any paint marks anywhere on my bearings or either crankshafts. Well, that's not entirely true. I think I see dots on the crank webbing, but they're so old they just look brown. In either case, I think I just have to go by measurements, so I think I'll be asking for yellow, which is code 54.

I'll update more as I get it figured out.

Incidentally, Anthony at Naperville has been very helpful once I actually got to talk to him. The issue really lies in the fact that the website is a black hole that might eventually produce parts. As frustrating as it is, I may just place future orders on the website, and then call to sort out the details shortly after. A little tedious, but better than waiting 2 weeks to see what happens.
 
Opinion time.

Earlier this afternoon I was stopped in traffic in the 400E and I got rear ended. It was super minor. Nobody was injured. 2010 Ford Focus hit my rear bumper. The black plastic insert got slightly deformed and scratched. I don't know about any deeper damage. None visible, but I'm not an expert.

It was a 16 year old kid. He was very apologetic and polite. He was also terrified what would happen if his parents found out or if insurance had to get involved. I'd have up to a year to file a police report if I needed to, so I decided not to do it initially. I have the kid's info, including his insurance.

The question is, what do I do about it? My car isn't perfect, but the bumper is visibly worse now than it was before. I'd feel bad for the kid if I went after full body shop repair prices, knowing his parents would then become involved and it would cause him an inordinate amount of trouble. I'm not wild about just eating the cost myself either though. Ths bumper wasnt flawless before, but it was on par with the rest of the car. Now it's the worst part of the car. I also don't know that the damage doesn't go deeper than just the bumper cover.

So I guess I'm looking for opinions. What would you do?
 
Oof!

If the kid was polite and up front during the whole thing, I’d try really hard to be comfortable with just covering it myself. Search for good replacement inserts on ebay etc. Chalk it up to one of those little ‘pay it forward’ events life presents us with every so often.

Not saying i’d be able to get there. But i’d try.

Additionally- how much money do you think you’d actually get out of the kids insurance without a lot of work/haggling/etc?
 
a777fan said:
Additionally- how much money do you think you’d actually get out of the kids insurance without a lot of work/haggling/etc?
Click to expand...
The car certainly wouldn't be totalled, so they'd pay whatever it costs to fix it. I'm confident I wouldn't have any trouble getting the insurance to pay. The big is question is whether I should.
 
Beater400E,
You do what you want but let me tell you what happened to me. At one time in my life I owned a1 Ton Flatbed truck for my work as a plasterer. One night I was slowly pulling up to a red light in the left lane of the street. I was minding my own business when a car in the right lane pulled into the side of my truck. He hit me behind the cab and destroyed my under the flatbed steel toolbox. The box size was about 4'x2'x2' and sets right behind the cab and goes back right to just in front of the rear duel wheels. It was not a major accident but the tool box had to be replaced. The other driver destroyed his left fender with the hit.

The other driver was very apologetic and admitted it was his fault. He pleaded with me to not report the accident to the police. I let him talk me out of calling them and reporting the accident. So we exchanged information and I told him I would get an estimate for a new steel toolbox and call him with the estimate. The estimate was around $950.00 to replace it and paint it white to match the truck. So I called him with the information. The first thing he told me was that "I hit him and he wasn't going to pay for the damage"

Unfortunately there were no witnesses and the police were not called so there was no report taken. I was stuck for the $950.00. That was the last time I gave anybody a break in an accident.

Don't let this happen to you!

lol
 
Well, I got a really good look at everything this morning. There's no damage other than the scuffs on the impact strip. I just told the kid not to worry about it. I'll track down a new impact strip at some point. Mine wasn't perfect to begin with.
 
We finally figured everything out for my crankshaft bearings. Naperville is getting me 16 of the 111-038-09-10 rod bearings, and 5 of the 119-030-04-40-54 main bearings. They told me the main bearings are available in the US, but there isn't sufficient US inventory of the rod bearings at the moment, so it'll be a couple weeks while they get more from Germany. It's going to end up taking 3 months to get this engine together by the time it's actually done. Hopefully the local high school kids don't take the car out before I get it done.
 
gsxr said:
Any word on the difference between crank bearing part numbers?
Click to expand...
This is what I got back when I asked about that:

Anthony:
"Both the main bearing part numbers show stock---I have been looking through the footnotes and it looks like both part#’s are available but it gives me “model desgnations” for the main bearings…"

image003.png
image004.png

That's all he was able to tell me. Since my engine is a 119970, which appears in the notes for both, we're assuming they're effectively interchangeable. I ordered the 119-030-04-40-54 just because they're a few dollars less.
 
Interesting. This doesn't quite jive with what I see in the EPC, but as long as they work, it doesn't matter. Guess I should order one of each and see what the difference is when comparing side by side.

:detective:
 
gsxr said:
Interesting. This doesn't quite jive with what I see in the EPC, but as long as they work, it doesn't matter. Guess I should order one of each and see what the difference is when comparing side by side.
Click to expand...
I thought about it, but decided it wasn't worth an extra $40 to me to find out.
 
sheward said:
Look at those 6 bolt main caps. It seems the only way to break one of these blocks is to freeze it.
Click to expand...
Yup, it's a pretty stout design for such a lightweight block. The closed deck was definitely a stronger design than the later open deck. It kind of surprises me that they made that change. Granted, in normal operation it probably doesn't matter, but they had a good thing with the closed deck.
 
Well, this one might have been the worst idea of all, but I bought it anyway. $500 92 500SEL. Dragged it back from Pasco Washington today.

1000005977.jpg

1000005976.jpg

This one was advertised as having the "special presidential package with bulletproof windows!"
Yeah, it's a pile. The upper engine harness is obliterated, and then someone tore into it in a meth-fueled frenzy to try to repair it themselves.
The sellers excitedly told me how there was another wiring harness included that they were going to use to fix it. It's from a Chevy.

It does not run. It has no keys. The ignition lock cylinder has been ripped out. Supposedly it ran and drove fine before the harness became terminal.

The interior is blue, which is interesting, but it looks like bears have been living in it. The factory catalytic converters were removed at some point and replaced with a cheap universal cat. It really has nothing going for it aside from the few 92 only parts I was looking for.

I may try to repair the harness enough to make the car run just so I can assess how good or bad everything is. Then, I don't know what I'll do. This might end up being my Gambler 500 car for this year, after which I'll gut it and part it out.

Anyone need any parts off this thing?
 
Love how someone thought it was worthwhile enough to invest in B-series plates for it.

Continuously jealous of the real estate you have for these projects!!!
 
a777fan said:
Love how someone thought it was worthwhile enough to invest in B-series plates for it.
Click to expand...
I'm not familiar with that. Is there something special about those plates?

a777fan said:
Continuously jealous of the real estate you have for these projects!!!
Click to expand...
I have a buddy with some land. He lets me park a bunch of junk at his place. He gets 40% of the blame for all this for enabling me.
 
You found ANOTHER 1992 500SEL for $500? Dang!

The Oregon car is stil llisted... what is with these Bookface sellers?

Log into Facebook

Log into Facebook to start sharing and connecting with your friends, family, and people you know.
www.facebook.com www.facebook.com

1710166251876.png
 
Beater400E said:
I'm not familiar with that. Is there something special about those plates?


I have a buddy with some land. He lets me park a bunch of junk at his place. He gets 40% of the blame for all this for enabling me.
Click to expand...
Sorry. Nothing unique about them, but a ‘B’ series 7 digit WA plate indicates a fairly recent registry, which typically points to a new owner etc who thought the car was at least road worthy at the time.
 
I'm pretty sure it will run with a good engine harness. I found a guy with two harnesses on eBay that were good aside from a couple broken connectors on the cam solenoids. Both dated 2003. Offered the guy $100 each for them and he accepted. I have a bag of 10 of those cam connector housings on the shelf, so it should be an easy fix.

The funny thing is I just sold the harness out of my 94 S500 two weeks ago. Got $400 for that. I figure I can probably repair both of these harnesses, sell one, and come out money ahead while making this car run.

If it will run and drive reasonably well, I think this thing will be my Gambler 500 car for this year.

In case any are unfamiliar with the Gambler 500, it's an event where people take crappy cars on a weekend road rally. The original premise was a $500 car doing 500 miles offroad. Things have relaxed a bit over the years and the price limit and length of the trip are not too important any more. It's mostly just about having fun in a crappy, impractical car in a group of idiots with other crappy, impractical cars. Think 24 hours of Lemons, but on dirt. And it's not actually a race.

The more impractical your car the better. People will often modify or decorate their cars in ridiculous fashion. Most people don't do a different car every year, but that's kind of tradition for me since I enjoy the build so much.

Two years ago I won the event with a 98 Chevy (Geo) Metro that had the body cut off and the fiberglass hull of a 1958 Waconda speed boat fitted over it. We named it "Probable Cause."

Last year it was a 1957 GMC pickup that we pulled out of a field and got running with a lot of work, but almost no money. We named that "The Shit Pig."

So that brings us to this year. If this car will run and drive, it's a great candidate. I think I'd probably fit some all terrain tires and maybe lift the suspension a couple inches, and cut the muffler off. Definitely disable the ASR.

The name and theme came to me earlier today while I was supposed to be paying attention in a project meeting at work. The W140 is a classic head of state kind of car. I need fender mounted flags, tinted windows, and maybe some other classic VIP paraphernalia. I'll sport a Moammar Gadhafi-esque military dress uniform with a ridiculous hat and my buddy will dress as my chauffeur. Our wives will roll their eyes.

The car will be "The DickTater."
 
I received both of my engine harnesses today. One was exactly as described. It was a W140 harness in perfect condition aside from a couple damaged connectors. I was able to swap some good connectors from my stash and install it on the car.

The second harness is not actually a W140 harness. It's a W124 400E harness. It appears to be in good shape aside from a couple broken connectors and one chafed wire that I can easily repair. I'm not really sure what to do with this harness. It's not what the seller said it was. It also doesn't have a Delphi label on it. The label appears to say "NOT ELECTRICALLY TESTED 124 543 8832."

The writing is pretty faded so it's hard to tell. The harness on my 400E is a later Delphi and is in perfect condition, so I don't really need this harness. I reached out to the seller and informed him this harness is not what he said it was. He said he pulled it from a junk yard 400SEL, so it must be a direct interchange for a W140.

I'm sure I could insist on a return and he'd take it back. For $100 I might decide to keep it instead though. I don't know.

Anyone have any thoughts or suggestions on that?

Aside from that, I got the good harness installed and tried to start the 500SEL. No luck. I'm guessing the fact that the original ignition switch had been ripped out and this abomination chucked in might have something to do with it.

1000006006.jpg

I extracted the entire ignition lock and switch from my 94 S500 and am hoping to install it in the 92. The trouble is, one of the wires in that dangling mess clearly shorted to ground at some point because its insulation is all burned off as far up into the harness as I can see. So I need to figure out where the other end of that wire goes and run a new wire to replace the burned one. I'm having a hard time finding a wiring schematic for a W140 ignition switch though.

Does anyone know where I might find a schematic for a W140 ignition switch?
 
Beater400E said:
Oh boy. That should be interesting. So, I got WIS. There is W140 info in there. Any tips on finding what I'm looking for?
Click to expand...
I find the WIS extremely difficult to navigate OR search.

Try this for starters... might take a while to locate the ignition switch schematic(s):

1710632789470.png
 
gsxr said:
I find the WIS extremely difficult to navigate OR search.

Try this for starters... might take a while to locate the ignition switch schematic(s):

View attachment 186103
Click to expand...
Yeah, that's what I did. What makes it extra fun is that the ignition switch is not diagramed in its entirety anywhere. I did eventually find the brown wire in the Central Locking diagram. It appears to go to the main ground behind the cluster. I'll dig around in there and see what I can find.
 
Sure enough, it joins up with the main ground bundle. Presumably someone shorted that wire to something with 12v when they did their janky ignition switch replacement and the tiny brown ground wire lost the amperage battle. I'll run a new wire to ground. That's probably the best case scenario for this.
 
Well, this is getting annoying. The wiring between the 92 and 94 is different. I have it mostly worked out, but there is a red wire with a grey stripe in the 92 that does not have an obvious partner in the 94, so I'm not sure where to put it.

I've looked through literally every single diagram in WIS for the W140. I've found every reference to the ignition switch in every diagram, and none of them show a red wire with a grey stripe. Of course, none of them show every wire to the switch in a single diagram. What a nightmare.
 
I never did figure out what that red and grey wire was for, but I decided to just wire it to position 2 and give it a shot.

It still didn't run. I tried to install the ignition switch and steering lock assembly into the car, but discovered the prior idiot had apparently pried the old one out, breaking chunks out of the steering column in the process. I'll probably end up swapping the steering column from the 94 just so I can install the ignition switch.

The shifter interlock cable is also not working correctly. I'll have to tear into the shifter to figure out why.

None of that is the cause of the no start though.
I blasted some brake clean down the throttle while cranking and the car did fire, so I figured it was likely a fuel issue.

There was fuel pressure at the rail. Hooked up my gauge and got about 55 psi. So there's fuel pressure at the rail, and we know it already had spark. At that point it's reasonable to assume the injectors weren't firing.

I checked all my wiring connections and everything looked fine. I did find a blown fuse in the base module and replaced it, but the car still wouldn't run. Pulled out the noid light set and confirmed the LH was commanding the injectors to fire.

At this point I figured the injectors were probably bad. The car has been sitting for probably a year or two. It's certainly possible that the injectors are stuck. Also, if I let the car sit for 20 minutes or so, and then tried to start it, it would fire and run for a few seconds. That seems like the injectors were probably dribbling, again supporting the idea that the injectors were bad.

So I yanked the fuel rail and swapped in the injectors from the 94 S500.

Cranked the car and it still wouldn't start. Now, in the process of swapping the injectors I obviously lost all the fuel from the rail. I didn't know how much fuel was in the car, but I suspected it was very little. I rechecked fuel pressure at this point and discovered there was now no pressure.

Ok. I figured I must have run out of gas. So I dump in 5 gallons and try again. Still no fuel pressure. I can hear the fuel pumps running, but I'm getting zero fuel. I ended up actually cracking the fuel line loose just ahead of the firewall, and there was zero fuel.

Ok, so either pumps or filter. My shop is currently full of tables covered in engine parts, so I wasn't able to pull this car in and put it on the lift. So I jack the car up to have a closer look at the fuel pumps.

Oh boy. The fuel hoses in and out are rock hard AND full of multiple redneck repair splices. The pumps are dangling by the hoses and everything is disgusting.

Good news. The 94 ran fine. So I yanked the pumps, filter, and hoses out of the 94 and swapped them in.

That did it. It took probably 20 seconds of cranking and then the engine coughed and sputtered for a bit, but it did eventually wake up.

It's weird that the pumps seemed to be working at first, but not the injectors, and then the pumps apparently quit as soon as the injectors were replaced. I can't necessarily explain it, but it does now run.

It smokes quite a bit, but I suspect an Italian tune up will probably take care of that. The oil pressure gauge is pinned at zero and the oil level light and battery light are on. Engine oil level is fine and I can see oil is circulating in the top end so I'm not really worried about it. I suspect a bad oil pressure sender. The charging system is also not working. Overall though I think it will work well for the Gambler, and as a parts car.

I already pulled the LH module and swapped in a 95 module I had instead. I plan to harvest those cams for the 400E's new engine and swap in a pair of later cams. I'll do a bit of testing to be sure the charging issue is actually the alternator, but I have a couple on the shelf if that turns out to be the case.

I'll swap the steering column so I can install the ignition switch properly. I'll probably try to sort out the oil pressure sender just for peace of mind.

It was a pretty productive beater Mercedes weekend.
 
I just got a message from Naperville that neither the 119-030-05-40-54, nor the 119-030-04-40-54 main bearings are available any more. I wish I'd known that nearly two weeks ago when I spoke with them and placed the order.

So now what do I do? I could see if any of the other sizes are available, or I could just run the best of the used bearings I currently have. If I can't get new main bearings do I even worry about rod bearings?
 
Do we know if there's anyone out there who has rebuilt these engines who might be able to help identify a good option for main bearings? Even the dealers seem clueless. I've had them just regurgitate what's in EPC, but that doesn't really help. I need to find solutions, not just fragmented information and NLAs. I'm continuing to research on my own, but the majority of information I'm finding is not very helpful.

From what I can tell, 4 or the 5 main bearings for m116/117 engines are probably the same, so that could be an option. I'm also not totally sure on whether an alternate color code bearing might be an option. If the yellows aren't available, would blue or red be acceptable alternatives? Do I have to pay to have my crank reground to a more common repair size just so I can get matching bearings? I hope that's not the only solution since my crankshafts are in fine shape as is.
 
For reference, this is what I'm seeing with the original main bearings. This is one of the worst ones.

1000006019.jpg

Not all of them look like this, but some do. The worn area is about 0.0004 inches (4 ten thousandths) or 0.01mm thinner than the rest of the bearing. It looks like the top layer, which is softer than the layer below has failed.

I'm not a top tier engine builder, but I can't imagine this is acceptable wear. In any other engine I've built I'd replace the bearings for certain. Given the difficulty in sourcing new bearings, I figured I'd share this here and see if anyone doubts that these bearings need replaced.
 
Interesting. Turns out there are indeed two different M119 main bearing styles. They are different widths. My 95 open deck block has main bearings that are roughly 20.87mm wide, where the 94 closed deck block has bearings that are roughly 16.90mm wide.

From what I can tell they are interchangeable. It's really strange that the narrower bearings were used in the earlier engine given that wider bearing shells seem to fit fine in the earlier block. I would think the wider bearings would be preferable since the contact area would be much larger, meaning less pressure on each.

I also notice that the visible bearing wear is more significant in the narrower bearings. Obviously my sample size is one of each style, so take that with a grain of salt.

1000006044.jpg

Main bearing contact area on the #3 bearing for the 94 engine:

1000006045.jpg

And the 95:

1000006046.jpg

You can see the brown varnish on the sides of the bearing surface on the 94 crank. The narrower bearings did not make contact there.
 
Time for some updates. Turns out even the Glyco main bearings are a little tough to find. I tracked some down and have a set of main bearings and rod bearings on the way.

Naperville finally got back to me and let me know none of the main bearings are available any more.

I'm hoping the m117 bearings will work. They include a fit bearing with the thrust surfaces integral to the center bearing shells. I don't know if that will work with the m119 block or not.

In other news, the 6 speed transmission I bought on eBay never came. The seller stopped responding to inquiries more than a month ago and never supplied any tracking info for the shipment. I've opened an item not received case, and expect to have a refund in a couple days.

As cool as it would be to get an NSG 510 trans in this car, I don't know that I'll be able to get one in the states for a reasonable price, so I'll likely have to go with an NSG 400 instead.

I received a shipment from OctoClassic today. Got a few little things, but the most interesting is the new cup holder. Check it out.

1000006069.jpg 1000006070.jpg 1000006071.jpg
1000006072.jpg 1000006073.jpg 1000006074.jpg

1000006075.jpg

The storage box does not have to be removed or disassembled to install the cup holder. It can just slide in with the box in place.

The parts are of course 3d printed. The flaps in the cup holder that support the drink are flexible rubber. The rest of the part is rigid. It seems very sturdy and well made.

I'm continuing to work on the 500SEL. The cams will be coming out today. The prior owners were apparently scared of oil changes.

1000006062.jpg

It's hard to tell from the picture, but that sludgey junk is rock hard. It's all throughout the motor. I'll be cleaning it off all the parts I touch. The plan is to yank out the intake cams to use in the 400E's 5 liter (92 5 liter cams are apparently the best) as well as the aluminum oiler tubes, and replace them with standard parts from my 94-95 stash.

I resealed the cam solenoids yesterday and I'll reassemble with new valve cover gaskets and then I'll install the best of the ignition system components I have on the shelf to replace all the factory original ignition on the car. This car has 201k miles, and the ignition system is factory. It's amazing the car runs at all.
 
Looks like the smog pump pulley bearing on the 500SEL is cooked. Is there a good source for a new bearing? I can swap the 6 rib pump from the 94 if needed, but if the correct bearing is available that might be easier.
 
gsxr said:

Engine air compressor [smog pump] bearings | M119 Engine

Hello to all the team. I was not much talkative since my registration, but spent time reading threads about that fantastic car. I own a [1992] 500E since 2003 (purchased for the birth of my son), and we have had wonderful travels with it. The last trip was to Venise (Italy) with the family...
www.500eboard.co
Click to expand...
Thanks Dave. That's exactly what I needed. I swear I did actually try to search, but the search function on the forum was giving me a server error.

Looks like that bearing is available on ebay for $13. It has been ordered.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

gerryvz
The $800 400E
Replies
0
Views
155
gerryvz
gerryvz
F
400E New Owner: or how I got fleeced and overheated on the GWB
Replies
12
Views
1,157
gsxr
gsxr
R
400e passenger side rear taillight bulb strip issue
Replies
2
Views
140
Rosenfe
R
R
92 400e catalytic converter wuestion
Replies
8
Views
634
emerydc8
emerydc8
R
Help needed for fear door panel removal 92 400e
Replies
2
Views
365
Rosenfe
R

Who has viewed this thread (Total: 31) View details

Who has watched this thread (Total: 9) View details

Similar threads

gerryvz
The $800 400E
Replies
0
Views
155
gerryvz
gerryvz
F
400E New Owner: or how I got fleeced and overheated on the GWB
Replies
12
Views
1,157
gsxr
gsxr
R
400e passenger side rear taillight bulb strip issue
Replies
2
Views
140
Rosenfe
R
R
92 400e catalytic converter wuestion
Replies
8
Views
634
emerydc8
emerydc8
R
Help needed for fear door panel removal 92 400e
Replies
2
Views
365
Rosenfe
R
L
I would like a guide to upgrade from 400e to 500e
Replies
11
Views
718
alabbasi
alabbasi
R
Who rebuilds electronic modules computers for the 400e?
Replies
10
Views
687
BRABUS124
BRABUS124
R
Got codes 5 and 6. On my 92 400e
Replies
1
Views
290
gerryvz
gerryvz
G
5.0 swap on 400E
Replies
9
Views
789
gsxr
gsxr
R
How to adjust 400e parking brake
Replies
3
Views
576
Rosenfe
R
Back
Top