I offered to give him $400 for it, or to sell him a used S500 transmission for $500.
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The $400 400E
- Thread starter Beater400E
- Start date
Carfax shows 230kmi... he's claiming 187kmi? $400 would be a steal as a parts car or #Beater.
$1500 is high. If he really meant $15,000... he's high.
The description doesn't inspire confidence either:
"Seller's description
Accepting Trades and might sell for right price.If your interest in the wheels lmk they 5x112, 17s, 8.5 $700 Lmk iffu got questions."
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/445297951225222/
Seller: https://www.facebook.com/blancas772
Yeah, I'm pretty sure he meant $15-20,000.
When I told him he was way off the mark on his price, this is what he said:
"dang man it hurts cause your right but I’m not going to let it go in parts, I’m hoping for someone with throw away money will buy it for the price I want, but till then I’m restoring the car slowly
"
"Also, this picture should give an idea of the nature of the seller and the care this car has received.
Now that I have the DickTater running well, it's time for the fun stuff. To give an idea of the goal here, think low buck Mad Max S Class.
I picked up a set of dirt cheap 265/70R16 all terrain tires that I'm going to mount to the stock W140 wheels. I have some wheel spacers on order that will push the tires out far enough for needed clearance on the upper ball joints up front. Obviously fender clearance will be an issue, but it's nothing some (extensive) Sawzall work won't solve.
The rear suspension is as hard as a rock, so I assume the accumulators are bad. I don't recall my S500 parts car having stiff suspension, so I think I can probably swap those over. I'll yank them out and find out.
I might consider lifting the suspension depending how things go with the wheel spacers and Sawzall. Coil spring spacers would give me a little lift. Custom brackets and spacers to lower all the suspension pick-up points would give me a bunch more if I need it, although it would be a lot of work.
One thing I'm keenly aware of is the fact that the larger tires will effectively gear up the final drive. This will affect torque and acceleration, and maybe more importantly will make the car run hotter. My plan to deal with that is first to add plenty of additional ventilation. The hood will get a few badly executed scoops and vents to help hot air escape the engine compartment.
The best option would be to swap the rear differential. I'm not sure exactly what would work there though. Dave's spreadsheet doesn't have the case numbers for the W140 cars. I'm wondering if something like an S320 diff would be a direct bolt in.
I know I'm venturing away from the $400 400E with this W140 thing, but I consider this a side quest to that whole saga, so I'll just keep it going here. Or maybe I'm just too lazy to create a new thread.
Does anyone know if something like a 3.27 or 3.45 bolt in rear diff swap exists for the W140.051?
I picked up a set of dirt cheap 265/70R16 all terrain tires that I'm going to mount to the stock W140 wheels. I have some wheel spacers on order that will push the tires out far enough for needed clearance on the upper ball joints up front. Obviously fender clearance will be an issue, but it's nothing some (extensive) Sawzall work won't solve.
The rear suspension is as hard as a rock, so I assume the accumulators are bad. I don't recall my S500 parts car having stiff suspension, so I think I can probably swap those over. I'll yank them out and find out.
I might consider lifting the suspension depending how things go with the wheel spacers and Sawzall. Coil spring spacers would give me a little lift. Custom brackets and spacers to lower all the suspension pick-up points would give me a bunch more if I need it, although it would be a lot of work.
One thing I'm keenly aware of is the fact that the larger tires will effectively gear up the final drive. This will affect torque and acceleration, and maybe more importantly will make the car run hotter. My plan to deal with that is first to add plenty of additional ventilation. The hood will get a few badly executed scoops and vents to help hot air escape the engine compartment.
The best option would be to swap the rear differential. I'm not sure exactly what would work there though. Dave's spreadsheet doesn't have the case numbers for the W140 cars. I'm wondering if something like an S320 diff would be a direct bolt in.
I know I'm venturing away from the $400 400E with this W140 thing, but I consider this a side quest to that whole saga, so I'll just keep it going here. Or maybe I'm just too lazy to create a new thread.
Does anyone know if something like a 3.27 or 3.45 bolt in rear diff swap exists for the W140.051?
See if the fan clutch is engaged on a warm day with engine temps at 90C+. If not, you can carefully tweak the bimetal spring brackets outward about 0.5mm or so to trigger engagement at a lower temp (assuming you have an OE Sachs/Horton clutch). If you tweak enough, the clutch will be engaged all the time, even when cold. The 140 clutch has a fully-enclosed plastic cage over the spring so if you botch it, the spring will be retained inside the cage. There's no such safety mechanism on the W124 clutch, which is why messing with those is high risk (will destroy both NLA clutch and NLA radiator if things go south... don't ask how I know.)
TLDR: It depends.
All 140 chassis with 5.0L or larger engines have a "reinforced" 210mm differential that has completely different internals (and housing, and everything else) vs the standard 210mm diff used on 3.2L-4.2L chassis. So while you can swap to the higher numerical ratio from a 320/420, it will be a downgrade in strength/reliability. That said, if you only need it to last for 1-2kmi, the standard 210mm diff might survive. I'm not sure what other items may need to be swapped - axle shafts and input flange seem likely. My spreadsheet data is all sourced from the EPC, you could poke around in there and compare.
That's a good idea. I have 2 of them, so definitely no reason not to give that a shot.
Fair enough. I'll probably get the tires mounted up and then see just how good or bad the whole thing is. My quick math says it will have the effect of gearing up from 2.65 to about 2.15. While the 5 liter should make enough torque to deal with that, the weight of the car combined with that gear sounds like a recipe for an overheated transmission. I will most likely add a big trans cooler to help with that.
First gear start would be awfully nice too. I wonder if I could do some kind of hack job to wire up a toggle switch to override the WOT switch. I bet that would make a huge difference. These events often involve some steep off road hill climbs, so the ability to hold first gear would be a huge help.
If you don't need "automatic" FGS, just move the shifter to the B position when you want first gear on demand. It will hold 1st gear as long as the shift lever remains in B, assuming the kickdown circuit is working normally. Simple solution, no mods necessary!
Oh, right. I forgot this car is supposed to have that feature. The shift linkage is way out of adjustment, so the shifter won't get that last gear selection. If I fix that I'd assume the B position would work.
Naperville never did call me back about the main bearing and connecting rod bearing order. So I called again today. I spoke with Anthony and told him I'd requested an order cancelation and that the order never should have been sent. He said he has no record of an order cancelation request. He said that although the bearings had been NLA, they later became available, so they'd decided to fulfill the order anyway.
I told him no, that's not how that's supposed to work. He said if I ship the parts back they'll refund me. I told him that's fine, I just need him to send me a shipping label. That's where things broke down. He said they can't issue a shipping label and that I have to pay return shipping myself.
Anyone who has followed this thread for a while can probably guess where this is going.
I told him this was not my mistake and I will not pay return shipping. He said that was the only option. I explained that I can escalate the PayPal dispute for this order to PayPal for resolution, and that I will do that if they aren't going to accept responsibility for this. He said that was all he could do. That was the end of that conversation.
So, I went to PayPal and escalated the case. Not even 3 minutes later, Anthony called me back and said if I close the dispute, they'll send a shipping label. I told him I'd already escalated the case for PayPal resolution and that I no longer had the option to close the case. He just said "That's not good."
In truth, I probably would not close the case prior to an appropriate remedy anyway, but that's moot at this point. In any case, we're now just waiting for PayPal to make a decision. That can take some time, so I'm not expecting resolution any time soon.
I don't think Anthony was trying to be difficult. I think he's doing his best. He was professional through the whole exchange, but he clearly has limited options. The fact that they are part of the monster that is Autonation, and that they have little flexibility or room for common sense is not his fault. Even so, I doubt I'll do business with Naperville again.
YMMV, and this is just one experience from one guy who is often a pain in the ass for retailers. Just sharing my perspective.
I told him no, that's not how that's supposed to work. He said if I ship the parts back they'll refund me. I told him that's fine, I just need him to send me a shipping label. That's where things broke down. He said they can't issue a shipping label and that I have to pay return shipping myself.
Anyone who has followed this thread for a while can probably guess where this is going.
I told him this was not my mistake and I will not pay return shipping. He said that was the only option. I explained that I can escalate the PayPal dispute for this order to PayPal for resolution, and that I will do that if they aren't going to accept responsibility for this. He said that was all he could do. That was the end of that conversation.
So, I went to PayPal and escalated the case. Not even 3 minutes later, Anthony called me back and said if I close the dispute, they'll send a shipping label. I told him I'd already escalated the case for PayPal resolution and that I no longer had the option to close the case. He just said "That's not good."
In truth, I probably would not close the case prior to an appropriate remedy anyway, but that's moot at this point. In any case, we're now just waiting for PayPal to make a decision. That can take some time, so I'm not expecting resolution any time soon.
I don't think Anthony was trying to be difficult. I think he's doing his best. He was professional through the whole exchange, but he clearly has limited options. The fact that they are part of the monster that is Autonation, and that they have little flexibility or room for common sense is not his fault. Even so, I doubt I'll do business with Naperville again.
YMMV, and this is just one experience from one guy who is often a pain in the ass for retailers. Just sharing my perspective.
Any business that use the word “can’t” for reasonable customer service I dismiss until… usually forever in my book. You are the weakest link, goodbye. 
It’s bad policy what they do, both for their customers and their staff who have to work with this. Hope that PayPal settles on a good solution!
It’s bad policy what they do, both for their customers and their staff who have to work with this. Hope that PayPal settles on a good solution!
I have a couple new items I need to troubleshoot on the 500SEL. I'll do some research on my own of course, but if anyone knows what's up, shout out the answers.
First is the headlights. When I flip the multifunction switch forward, the headlights just turn off. The high beams aren't working. The bulbs appear to be fine, and I actually just installed a brand new headlight switch since this one sounds like a pair of maracas. I haven't done any proper troubleshooting yet, but if anyone has any suggestions where to start I'm all ears.
The bigger issue is the transmission. I just took the car out for a spin and had some weird behavior. Everything seemed fine at first, but then while I was cruising at about 45 I stomped the gas and the car downshifted, but did not grab a gear. It was as if it downshifted to neutral. It went right to the rev limiter. When I lifted it immediately upshifted back into a gear. I came to a stop and tried it again and it did the same thing. I stopped a second time and turned around to return home since I thought i might be losing the trans entirely.
From that point on it was fine. I could stab it and it would downshift just fine.
I'm at a loss. The trans is not slow to engage into any gear from park. I don't notice any flare or other issues when I drive it. The transmission shifter is definitely out of adjustment. For any gear I basically have to pull the shifter back to the next position. To get reverse I have to go just shy of the neutral position in the gate. Drive is just about the 3 position on the gate. 3 is all the way down. I can't get B/2 with the current adjustment. I don't know if that shifter adjustment would have anything to do with it though.
Has anyone experienced this before? Again, I'll do some research of my own, but this is really odd.
First is the headlights. When I flip the multifunction switch forward, the headlights just turn off. The high beams aren't working. The bulbs appear to be fine, and I actually just installed a brand new headlight switch since this one sounds like a pair of maracas. I haven't done any proper troubleshooting yet, but if anyone has any suggestions where to start I'm all ears.
The bigger issue is the transmission. I just took the car out for a spin and had some weird behavior. Everything seemed fine at first, but then while I was cruising at about 45 I stomped the gas and the car downshifted, but did not grab a gear. It was as if it downshifted to neutral. It went right to the rev limiter. When I lifted it immediately upshifted back into a gear. I came to a stop and tried it again and it did the same thing. I stopped a second time and turned around to return home since I thought i might be losing the trans entirely.
From that point on it was fine. I could stab it and it would downshift just fine.
I'm at a loss. The trans is not slow to engage into any gear from park. I don't notice any flare or other issues when I drive it. The transmission shifter is definitely out of adjustment. For any gear I basically have to pull the shifter back to the next position. To get reverse I have to go just shy of the neutral position in the gate. Drive is just about the 3 position on the gate. 3 is all the way down. I can't get B/2 with the current adjustment. I don't know if that shifter adjustment would have anything to do with it though.
Has anyone experienced this before? Again, I'll do some research of my own, but this is really odd.
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@Beater400E,
When I first got my 500E about 20 years ago it had a sloppy shifter. When I had the trans serviced I had the Tech replace the shifter bushings. I believe they were all rubber but 20 years is a long time ago. I’m not sure if he replaced anything else. It’s worked perfectly ever since for about 50K miles.
When I first got my 500E about 20 years ago it had a sloppy shifter. When I had the trans serviced I had the Tech replace the shifter bushings. I believe they were all rubber but 20 years is a long time ago. I’m not sure if he replaced anything else. It’s worked perfectly ever since for about 50K miles.
Have you pulled the pan to check fluid condition, and check for friction material / swarf levels? I assume fluid level is correct (needs to be near MAX when fully hot).
Do you have a spare trans to swap if needed? Or, a spare valve body to swap for grins?
Do you have a spare trans to swap if needed? Or, a spare valve body to swap for grins?
I haven't touched the trans, other than to top off the fluid, although it wasn't fully hot when I did it and that was a while ago. I probably will drop the pan and have a look at the same time I install a trans cooler.
I do have a spare trans I could install if needed. I don't have an extra valve body though.
It sounds like adjusting the linkage and NSS, installing the cooler, and probably just changing the filter and filling with fresh fluid is the best place to start. I can swap in the other trans if I'm still having problems after that.
Yeah, one of the bushings is shot. I have a new one, just haven't installed it yet. Even then I'm guessing the linkage will need adjusted. I doubt that explains the weird issue I saw though. I'll fix the linkage and give the transmission a service and go from there.
Check out what just arrived from Poland.
Ok, the 500SEL has given me a really stupid idea and I'm trying to decide whether or not to do it.
I have the 94 S500 just sitting around. What if I went for maximum ridiculous factor, and chopped both cars up to make a limo? I'm not talking about anything nice, of course. Basically just chop both cars roughly in half and weld them together to make a longer S Class.
Before anyone says it, I am well aware of the structural challenges of doing such a thing. If I were to do this, I'd go way overboard on the structural beef to ensure we don't have major problems. I mean, even if we do, it'll just be a better story at the end if the day, right?
I'm thinking the front of the 92 500SEL, cut off just behind the main window of the back door. So the triangle window goes away. The door gets cut right there. That door would get welded shut anyway.
Then I cut the 94 S500 either right at the b pillar, or right at the front edge of the front door glass.
Cutting at the B pillar would be easier for sure and would net me about 2.5 feet of additional length to the car. Including the front doors (most of them anyway) would give me about 5 feet of stretch.
The 5 foot stretch would look way more ridiculous since I'd have part of the windshield frame included and I'd have to figure out how to close that in.
Obviously I'd have to connect up wiring, fuel lines, hydraulic suspension lines, and exhaust, and I'd have to lengthen the driveshaft.
I'm actually seriously considering this. What could possibly go wrong?
I have the 94 S500 just sitting around. What if I went for maximum ridiculous factor, and chopped both cars up to make a limo? I'm not talking about anything nice, of course. Basically just chop both cars roughly in half and weld them together to make a longer S Class.
Before anyone says it, I am well aware of the structural challenges of doing such a thing. If I were to do this, I'd go way overboard on the structural beef to ensure we don't have major problems. I mean, even if we do, it'll just be a better story at the end if the day, right?
I'm thinking the front of the 92 500SEL, cut off just behind the main window of the back door. So the triangle window goes away. The door gets cut right there. That door would get welded shut anyway.
Then I cut the 94 S500 either right at the b pillar, or right at the front edge of the front door glass.
Cutting at the B pillar would be easier for sure and would net me about 2.5 feet of additional length to the car. Including the front doors (most of them anyway) would give me about 5 feet of stretch.
The 5 foot stretch would look way more ridiculous since I'd have part of the windshield frame included and I'd have to figure out how to close that in.
Obviously I'd have to connect up wiring, fuel lines, hydraulic suspension lines, and exhaust, and I'd have to lengthen the driveshaft.
I'm actually seriously considering this. What could possibly go wrong?
"Artist's" depiction
While I applaud the insanity & audacity... may I ask what the use case would be? Doesn't sound like it would work well for your upcoming off-road LeMons competition. And it could be quite unpleasant to navigate around town - I shudder to think of the turning circle, or attempting to use reverse gear. Increasing weight by 50%+ won't help performance either.
That said, it would surely be one of a kind, and worthy of a separate thread...
That said, it would surely be one of a kind, and worthy of a separate thread...
Oh, it would be a separate thread for sure.While I applaud the insanity & audacity... may I ask what the use case would be? Doesn't sound like it would work well for your upcoming off-road LeMons competition. And it could be quite unpleasant to navigate around town - I shudder to think of the turning circle, or attempting to use reverse gear. Increasing weight by 50%+ won't help performance either.
That said, it would surely be one of a kind, and worthy of a separate thread...
Here's the thing about the Gambler 500. It's not a competition. It's not a race. The whole concept is to take the most impractical car possible and run it through a difficult challenge. The more impractical the better.
There is a trophy, but it's more of a people's choice award given to whoever exhibits the "Gambler" spirit the best.
It's called the "Gambler" because those who are doing it properly are gambling whether they'll make it to the end or not. It's supposed to be a car that normal people would look at and say "that'll never make it."
That's the main reason to do it. To make things more difficult and ridiculous. A fully whipped W140 is a good place to start. It has no business going offroad. But stretching it into a hacked together limousine takes it to a whole other level.
As a reminder, this is the car I won the trophy in 2 years ago:
Tuesday morning I hopped in the 400E to drive to the airport and was greeted with a check engine light. I shut the car off and restarted and the light remained. I'm aware that the check engine light is almost certainly just smog pump related but with a flight to catch I elected not to risk it and drove one of my other cars instead.
When I got back in town Wednesday I scanned for codes. There were 3.
Pin 8, code 6. "A/C electromagnetic clutch (A9k1) jammed or poly-V-belt broken."
Pin 19, code 4. "Air injection inoperative."
Pin 19, code 26. "Upshift delay switchover valve, open/short circuit."
That code 26 is usually there when I scan the car. I've looked into it and haven't ever figured out what's going on there. I'm not really worried about it.
The other two are a bit more confusing. The belt is not missing or broken, the A/C clutch is fine, and the smog pump seems to work fine. I cleared the codes and started the car and it was fine.
I'm fine to consider it a fluke and move on, but I figured I'd post up here and see if anyone had seen this kind of thing before.
When I got back in town Wednesday I scanned for codes. There were 3.
Pin 8, code 6. "A/C electromagnetic clutch (A9k1) jammed or poly-V-belt broken."
Pin 19, code 4. "Air injection inoperative."
Pin 19, code 26. "Upshift delay switchover valve, open/short circuit."
That code 26 is usually there when I scan the car. I've looked into it and haven't ever figured out what's going on there. I'm not really worried about it.
The other two are a bit more confusing. The belt is not missing or broken, the A/C clutch is fine, and the smog pump seems to work fine. I cleared the codes and started the car and it was fine.
I'm fine to consider it a fluke and move on, but I figured I'd post up here and see if anyone had seen this kind of thing before.
Pin 8, code 6: At some point the engine RPM and AC compressor RPM did not match, and stored this code. Could have been caused by intermittent belt slippage. If this keeps recurring, check the belt & tensioner.
Pin 19, code 4: The DM monitors the oxygen sensor readings when the smog pump is running. If the DM doesn't sense a lean condition when expected, it will trigger this code. Could be the vacuum-operated valve, or any of the vacuum components in the system - the pump can run but if the valve doesn't open, there's no air being injected.
Pin 19, code 26: Assuming the electric switchover valve is connected and good, this means the vacuum circuit is not causing the cold-upshift delay to heat the catalysts after a cold start. Or, the vacuum chamber on the Bowden cable has failed. You can ignore this, but it's annoying if the CEL keeps turning on.
FYI - the CEL only exists in North America. ROW cars do not have it. The CEL is present to scare owners into taking their car to a mechanic if the DM watchdog suspects anything is awry with the emissions equipment. It's far more rudimentary vs OBD-2 systems. If the car seems to be running normally, don't let the CEL scare you into parking it.
Pin 19, code 4: The DM monitors the oxygen sensor readings when the smog pump is running. If the DM doesn't sense a lean condition when expected, it will trigger this code. Could be the vacuum-operated valve, or any of the vacuum components in the system - the pump can run but if the valve doesn't open, there's no air being injected.
Pin 19, code 26: Assuming the electric switchover valve is connected and good, this means the vacuum circuit is not causing the cold-upshift delay to heat the catalysts after a cold start. Or, the vacuum chamber on the Bowden cable has failed. You can ignore this, but it's annoying if the CEL keeps turning on.
FYI - the CEL only exists in North America. ROW cars do not have it. The CEL is present to scare owners into taking their car to a mechanic if the DM watchdog suspects anything is awry with the emissions equipment. It's far more rudimentary vs OBD-2 systems. If the car seems to be running normally, don't let the CEL scare you into parking it.
It's been a little bit since I've posted any updates here. Been busy with the $500 S500 limo.
My dispute with Naperville has finally reached a conclusion. As a reminder, I'd ordered bearings, but ended up asking to cancel the order. They didn't cancel the order, and instead shipped out the order more than a month later. I called and spoke with them and they told me they'd accept the return but that I had to pay return shipping.
I told them I was not willing to pay return shipping on an order I'd canceled. They stood firm on that, so I disputed through PayPal. PayPal ruled in my favor and I got a full refund. So I guess I have an extra set of bearings now.
I'd set the engine build aside while I waited for that to resolve since I wasn't sure which bearings I'd still have when it was all over. Now that it's resolved I'll be able to move forward with the build... once the S500 limo is out of the shop.
My dispute with Naperville has finally reached a conclusion. As a reminder, I'd ordered bearings, but ended up asking to cancel the order. They didn't cancel the order, and instead shipped out the order more than a month later. I called and spoke with them and they told me they'd accept the return but that I had to pay return shipping.
I told them I was not willing to pay return shipping on an order I'd canceled. They stood firm on that, so I disputed through PayPal. PayPal ruled in my favor and I got a full refund. So I guess I have an extra set of bearings now.
I'd set the engine build aside while I waited for that to resolve since I wasn't sure which bearings I'd still have when it was all over. Now that it's resolved I'll be able to move forward with the build... once the S500 limo is out of the shop.
Oof. Sealed the deal for Naperville for me. They're dead to me. I have a hate thread going elsewhere about them (click here).
Glad it worked out but man what a PITA.
Glad it worked out but man what a PITA.
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It happened again. This time it's a 93 500SL. $500. With Evos.
This one was listed in the auto parts section of the Twin Falls craigslist. They were asking $1100 for it. It supposedly has a "leaky fuel tank."O. M. G.!!!!!!
How do you find these???!!!
It had been donated to a church and the church knew nothing about it. They were happy to see it go and to get $500.
These Evos do have some very light curb rash on a couple of the rims. Should be easily repairable. Not sure exactly which Evos they are, but I'll pull them off and find out. Pretty confident they're MB, not reproduction.
The battery is beyond dead. It actually reads negative 0.5 volts. I've never seen that before. Tossed a fresh battery in and it cranks great. No fuel pressure. I pulled the relay and jumpered the pumps and I can hear them, but still no fuel pressure. A quick shot of brake clean down the throttle and it fired. Sounds good.
So presumably I have bad fuel pumps. Any chance it's just the filter?
So presumably I have bad fuel pumps. Any chance it's just the filter?
Dam! Some people have all the luck!
I’ll reimburse you the $500.00 for the EVOs. You can keep the SL!
I honestly don't know what to do with this SL.
VIN WDBFA67E9PF075796
It has 120k miles. It's blue with a blue top and palomino interior. Nice color combo in my opinion, but it needs a complete respray. The seats have some split seams, but if the leather was properly conditioned I suspect they could be saved. The hydraulic roof does not work at the moment. At the very least it needs the latch cylinders repaired.
The really tough thing is that I know 10 or 15 years from now this car, even in this condition will absolutely be worth saving. It's definitely fixable. A total respray won't be cheap, but it would probably be worth it at that point. I'm confident I can get it running and driving well for just a few hundred dollars.
The question is what to do after that. I could certainly part it out but I don't know that this car deserves to be killed. I could sell it as is. I'm sure I'd make some money, although I don't really know what it would be worth in this condition. I could drive it as is, although I have a lot of cars and I probably wouldn't actually choose to drive this one much given the condition.
Unless I decide to try to restore this one, the wheels will get swapped. I might save them for myself, or I might sell them. Not really sure what they're worth. They're the diamond cut and clear coated style. Haven't pulled them off to check the casting numbers yet.
So what should I do? I'm definitely going to get it running and see what I truly have, but I really don't know what to do with it from there. Do I part it out, sell it as-is, or try to actually restore it?
VIN WDBFA67E9PF075796
It has 120k miles. It's blue with a blue top and palomino interior. Nice color combo in my opinion, but it needs a complete respray. The seats have some split seams, but if the leather was properly conditioned I suspect they could be saved. The hydraulic roof does not work at the moment. At the very least it needs the latch cylinders repaired.
The really tough thing is that I know 10 or 15 years from now this car, even in this condition will absolutely be worth saving. It's definitely fixable. A total respray won't be cheap, but it would probably be worth it at that point. I'm confident I can get it running and driving well for just a few hundred dollars.
The question is what to do after that. I could certainly part it out but I don't know that this car deserves to be killed. I could sell it as is. I'm sure I'd make some money, although I don't really know what it would be worth in this condition. I could drive it as is, although I have a lot of cars and I probably wouldn't actually choose to drive this one much given the condition.
Unless I decide to try to restore this one, the wheels will get swapped. I might save them for myself, or I might sell them. Not really sure what they're worth. They're the diamond cut and clear coated style. Haven't pulled them off to check the casting numbers yet.
So what should I do? I'm definitely going to get it running and see what I truly have, but I really don't know what to do with it from there. Do I part it out, sell it as-is, or try to actually restore it?
To start with I'd see if you can get it running (ideally, driving) so you can assess the needs to make it roadworthy again. How are the wiring harnesses? Limp mode? Etc, etc. In the meantime borrow parts from the other cars to limit the $$$ invested. Oh, does it only have 1 key? IIRC those IRCL key fobs are NLA.
If the finish on the wheels is good (which would be unusual) the wheels are pretty valuable. Unfortunately, it is expensive to refinish properly - they need to be machine cut on a lathe and re-cleared. Annie's can't do this, unless they have new capabilities I'm unaware of. There's only a couple places in USA that can refinish them correctly and it's NOT cheap.
The upper harness appears to be original. I haven't looked for an actual date code. The engine compartment is very original. Nothing is missing or damaged from what I can tell. In a couple places I believe I do see some cracked insulation though.
I do have a couple newer harnesses I could probably use if needed.
Haven't looked at the lower harness or the ETA.
It only came with one key.
The finish is pretty good actually. No chips or delamination that I can see. There are some very light surface scratches in places that I'm sure would buff out with a little work, and of course some brake dust.
The most noticeable issue is curb rash. Pretty minor, but it's there. The left side wheels are pristine. The right rear has a tiny bit, and the right front has a bit more.
Here's the worst of it on the right front:
What that's interesting. I poured maybe 4 gallons of fuel into the SL yesterday to make sure it had something to work with. Today I got under it to swap the fuel pumps. The supply hose is badly deteriorated and looks to have been leaking. When I pulled it off the pump, fuel barely trickles out.
I'll let it sit here and puddle for a while. I imagine I'll have to replace the strainer and then do something with that fuel supply hose.
I'll have to figure out how to get the supply hose free from the strainer though. It's super tight in there and I have no idea how to get a tool to it.
I'll let it sit here and puddle for a while. I imagine I'll have to replace the strainer and then do something with that fuel supply hose.
I'll have to figure out how to get the supply hose free from the strainer though. It's super tight in there and I have no idea how to get a tool to it.
22mm crow foot for the win.
The fuel strainer was pretty much plugged solid with varnish. I think that was a factor in the death of the fuel supply hose too. The pumps were sucking on the hose to the point that it imploded and cracked.
I cut the end off the tank side of the hose and I'll just clamp some 5/8 fuel line from NAPA on there for now. Good enough to get it running short term.
The fuel strainer was pretty much plugged solid with varnish. I think that was a factor in the death of the fuel supply hose too. The pumps were sucking on the hose to the point that it imploded and cracked.
I cut the end off the tank side of the hose and I'll just clamp some 5/8 fuel line from NAPA on there for now. Good enough to get it running short term.
I replaced the strainer, fuel supply hose, pumps, and filter and the car now runs and drives. Weirdly, the fresh battery I put in yesterday was dead when I tried to start it. 10.9 volts. I assume the car is drawing power when parked, but I haven't tested it yet.
It's been at least 6 years for sure since it ran, so plenty needs attention. The power steering was almost out of fluid. Topping that up brought the steering back to life. Motor mounts are tired. The tires are a million years old and feel like they're about to come apart. The brakes are rusty. The engine made a little valve noise before it was warmed up, but after a brief drive it was quiet. The transmission feels fine in all gears. When I came back from a 2 mile drive the car did idle down low and stall right as I parked it.
The dash has SRS, seat belt, bulb out, and washer fluid lights on. The power mirror switch is broken, and the power top switch is pushed down into the console. I poked down at it and the hydraulics went to work briefly, before the right front latch cylinders puked its guts all over the passenger seat. Guess I'll leave the hard top on for tonight.
I found a lot of evidence of mice. Stuffing and acorn shells and mouse... leavings.
So it needs:
Paint
Upholstery work
Engine wiring harness
Motor mounts
Tune up
Tires
Various odds and ends
I'm still unsure what to do with it. It's pretty much what I expected. Solid at the core, but death by a thousand cuts. Great restoration candidate, but in a world where there are plenty of survivors around for reasonable money, probably not worth it. It's a fantastic parts donor. Nearly everything works.
The paint is the real killer. If it had good paint it would be worth it.
What to do...
It's been at least 6 years for sure since it ran, so plenty needs attention. The power steering was almost out of fluid. Topping that up brought the steering back to life. Motor mounts are tired. The tires are a million years old and feel like they're about to come apart. The brakes are rusty. The engine made a little valve noise before it was warmed up, but after a brief drive it was quiet. The transmission feels fine in all gears. When I came back from a 2 mile drive the car did idle down low and stall right as I parked it.
The dash has SRS, seat belt, bulb out, and washer fluid lights on. The power mirror switch is broken, and the power top switch is pushed down into the console. I poked down at it and the hydraulics went to work briefly, before the right front latch cylinders puked its guts all over the passenger seat. Guess I'll leave the hard top on for tonight.
I found a lot of evidence of mice. Stuffing and acorn shells and mouse... leavings.
So it needs:
Paint
Upholstery work
Engine wiring harness
Motor mounts
Tune up
Tires
Various odds and ends
I'm still unsure what to do with it. It's pretty much what I expected. Solid at the core, but death by a thousand cuts. Great restoration candidate, but in a world where there are plenty of survivors around for reasonable money, probably not worth it. It's a fantastic parts donor. Nearly everything works.
The paint is the real killer. If it had good paint it would be worth it.
What to do...
i struggle with the same dilemma as you. You would like to save it but you can’t save them all. I bought a 92 300SL as a donor car and it pains me to part it but the cost of making it nice again exceeds the value. With bad paint and interior plus all the deferred maintenance and repairs I would part it out. You did the same thing I just did last week. I bought a 98 320CLK just for the wheels. Part the rest and you get a free set of Fuchs in my case.
Yeah, I think what I'll do is swap a different set of wheels on it and try to sell it as is. I'd probably try to get like $2500 out of it. It's probably not worth that, but we'll see how it goes. If I don't get ant interest or offers anywhere near $2000 I'll just part it out. I think I can get a couple grand out of the parts, and what I don't sell can go in my shed as spares.
It struck me that I could do something dumb with the SL. I've been working on the $500 limo for a few weeks, and boy that's a lot of work. The thought is creeping into my head to just abandon that project, part it out and move on, and then do a mild safari build on the SL. I could bolt the big tires from the limo onto the SL and then just run it. Maybe not quite as ridiculous as the limo, but a lot less work.
I hate abandoning projects, but the limo was always just about having fun. The SL might be more fun with less work.
I hate abandoning projects, but the limo was always just about having fun. The SL might be more fun with less work.
So, the main thing I'm trying to sort with the SL at the moment is an amperage draw. It pulls 3 amps while it's parked.
I've narrowed it down to the base module at this point. When I remove the base module, the amp draw ceases. I tried swapping in another base module, but the same amp draw returned. I didn't expect it was the base module itself, but it was worth a shot.
So what draws power from the base module? I have all fuses and relays in the whole car, and most modules pulled, and I'm still drawing 3 amps with the base module connected.
I'll search the forum and see what I can find, but if anyone knows where I should start, let me know.
I've narrowed it down to the base module at this point. When I remove the base module, the amp draw ceases. I tried swapping in another base module, but the same amp draw returned. I didn't expect it was the base module itself, but it was worth a shot.
So what draws power from the base module? I have all fuses and relays in the whole car, and most modules pulled, and I'm still drawing 3 amps with the base module connected.
I'll search the forum and see what I can find, but if anyone knows where I should start, let me know.
The base module wakes up the other modules on the bus so I would be looking at inputs to the base module. Things on your +15 telling the base module to wake up.
Yeah, the thing is I can remove all the modules from the box aside from the base module, and I still have the 3 amp load.
Right. There is probably in input that is causing the module to wake. You will need to pull up the schematic for that module to see what wires to look for voltage.
I just looked at the 500E schematic and pin 15 of the base module is +15 to wake up the module. Probably a black/red wire. See if there is any voltage on this wire key off.
Does the base module consume power by itself, or is it just a power distribution point? My thought was that something downstream was drawing the power, and the BM was just the channel through which the power was supplied. That said, I've removed all other modules from the box, and I've pulled all the fuses from the BM, and the load remains, so if the BM consumes power by itself then that's definitely possible.
Since the R129 is not identical to the W124, I'm going to try to find the diagrams in the EWA and see what I can learn there.
I should add that I was also seeing the same 2-3 amp power consumption at the power soft top module and the roll bar module. Pulling those modules or fuses, AND pulling the BM kills the load. Any of those remaining connected results in the power draw.
Since the R129 is not identical to the W124, I'm going to try to find the diagrams in the EWA and see what I can learn there.
I should add that I was also seeing the same 2-3 amp power consumption at the power soft top module and the roll bar module. Pulling those modules or fuses, AND pulling the BM kills the load. Any of those remaining connected results in the power draw.
I had a very similar situation. I suspect you may have a problem at the X11/4 diagnostic connector.
Try pulling the LH module and see if the draw reduces to 0.5-1.0 amps or so. (Wait - did you already do this and the load remained?)
Read the thread linked below - X11/4 can cause all sorts of bizarre stuff.
www.500eboard.co
Try pulling the LH module and see if the draw reduces to 0.5-1.0 amps or so. (Wait - did you already do this and the load remained?)
Read the thread linked below - X11/4 can cause all sorts of bizarre stuff.
HOW-TO: Replacing the 38-pin Diagnostic Socket (X11/4) | "HOW-TO" Tutorial Articles
When I recently purchased my 500E it had a crippling Battery Drain which would totally drain it overnight. Removing all of the Fuses & Relays did not eliminate the parasitic drain. I did discover that the LH module was causing the current draw as it was not shutting down when it should be. As...
