Eric's 500E Project

[600Eric]

Well my 500E showed up yesterday from Texas so it is time to get busy. As expected it definitely a little rough around the edges but at first inspection on the rack there is nothing that stood out as terribly bad and cannot be fixed. For the most part just a whole lot of deferred maintenance and repairs. However most importantly to me is she is straight, rust free and I am very happy with the condition of the paint as I think it is going to clean up extremely well. Same story with the interior. The only exception there is the headliner which sagging pretty bad and the wood is a bit weathered but that will all be coming out to be refinished too. Anyways the first task on the list this weekend is to give the car an extreme bath from top to bottom and see how it cleans up prior to start taking things apart.

 

[gsxr]

Looks great! Congrats on the good buy. Paint and interior are the two most expensive areas to fix. Mechanicals are relatively cheap if you do the work yourself and/or have connections.

BTW - I'd replace that aftermarket upper radiator hose with OE. The aftermarket ones touch the PS reservoir, OE clears properly, as seen here. It's a good maintenance item anyway... probably want a new t-stat, 90° hose, and G-05 coolant when you go through the fluid replacements.

 

[gerryvz]

Indeed, baseline all the fluids on the car. Talk to Texas993 as he has done same for his 500E over the past six months. Beautiful color ... scrape that Tejas inspection sticker off the windshield No surprise on the headliner -- the Texas heat toasted my SEC and my E500 headliners so that I had to have them both redone (to the tune of $600 each) almost a year ago. But they both look stunning now....

Looks like new air tubes and a front engine cover are in order ... you can get the cover cheaply from an 034 in a wrecking yard most likely.

Car looks good, but you see what I mean when I say that ALL of these cars are carrying $5k deferred maintenance minimum (usually $10K) to bring them up to a strong mechanical and cosmetic standard. I'd also examine and replace as necessary all soft parts under the hood ... vac lines, vac hoses, rubber, hood pad (if needed), underhood mounted rubber and foam behind grill, windshield/headlight washer hoses, the list goes on. Motor mounts... another thing to check. New Motor mount and tranny mount will make a big diff ... also check the flex discs for cracks. Chassis rubber ... bushings, tie rod and ball joint rubber boots, control arm bushings, you name it.

You've got Madera Concepts there locally, so a great solution on the wood.

Really looking forward to your project.

 

[Roma_500E]

Indeed, baseline all the fluids on the car. Talk to Texas993 as he has done same for his 500E over the past six months. Beautiful color ... scrape that Tejas inspection sticker off the windshield No surprise on the headliner -- the Texas heat toasted my SEC and my E500 headliners so that I had to have them both redone (to the tune of $600 each) almost a year ago. But they both look stunning now....

Previous owner of my 500E took a great care of it and saved all wood and interior from sun However, headliner was replaced so it looks indeed Texas heat destroys it pretty quick

Well my 500E showed up yesterday from Texas so it is time to get busy. As expected it definitely a little rough around the edges but at first inspection on the rack there is nothing that stood out as terribly bad and cannot be fixed. For the most part just a whole lot of deferred maintenance and repairs. However most importantly to me is she is straight, rust free and I am very happy with the condition of the paint as I think it is going to clean up extremely well. Same story with the interior. The only exception there is the headliner which sagging pretty bad and the wood is a bit weathered but that will all be coming out to be refinished too. Anyways the first task on the list this weekend is to give the car an extreme bath from top to bottom and see how it cleans up

Beautiful color, in fact my favorite one on W124. Wheels looks cool too (the AMG ones).

Make sure you replace both blinkers cuz the aftermarket stuff looks really cheap especially on classic MB. I also assume you are planning to instal Euro lights ? Unfortunately blinkers and headlights increase in price. :?

I would replace ALL the vacuum lines and the rubber adapters while you are there so that you forget about them .

 

[600Eric]

Thanks for the compliments guys

...Car looks good, but you see what I mean when I say that ALL of these cars are carrying $5k deferred maintenance minimum (usually $10K) to bring them up to a strong mechanical and cosmetic standard.

Amen to that. In fact I know I will blow right past $10K on this car but that is OK as I knew that going in. I just wanted a car worth putting that kind of money into it and although it does have 125K miles I think one looks like a keeper (at least so far). Therefore the question is how far will I go? I guess we will see what my stomach and checkbook can handle however n the end the car will be completely gone through top to bottom and it does need quite a lot to bring it back to the level I want. In addition everything will either be OE Benz or OEM if it is an exact match short of the star printed on it. All that said at the moment I am pretty happy with where I stand and as long as I don't get blind sided by some major mechanically I should be OK.

Thanks


Eric

+1 on Madera Concepts Gerry. They refinished some of my pieces on my 129 last year and they looked absolutely perfect. They are even nice guys. There is no doubt that is where this wood is headed too.

 

[600Eric]

Beautiful color, in fact my favorite one on W124. Wheels looks cool too (the AMG ones).

Make sure you replace both blinkers cuz the aftermarket stuff looks really cheap especially on classic MB. I also assume you are planning to instal Euro lights ? Unfortunately blinkers and headlights increase in price. :?

I would replace ALL the vacuum lines and the rubber adapters while you are there so that you forget about them .

Thanks 744 definitely my favorite color too. As for the headlights and corners yep they are history. Fortunately I have a brand new factory Euro set for both (I have some great resources for parts). Also I had already been buying some here and there (brakes, wheels, etc.) in anticipation of buying one of these cars so that is going help ease the pain if even just a bit when I get hit with bill for the first parts order.

 

[gerryvz]

Amen to that. In fact I know I will blow right past $10K on this car but that is OK as I knew that going in.

More than a couple of people have gotten very offended by me saying that ALL E500Es out there need $5K worth of work (likely more), but just take your rig to a good quality indy or a stealer and see how far $5K actually goes....one little job like motor mounts/transmission mount/flex discs and you're out $1,500 !!! Add new mirror boots into the mix, and perhaps getting a "woody" at Madera....well I just won't go on any more.....

The main thing is that you went in the RIGHT way. You did your homework, you were patient and talked to lots of people to get a sense for what you'd need to do, you planned it out, and you found a great "base" car in a great color combo to go forward from. You know up front generally what things are going to cost and you will do everything methodically. Textbook way to do it for all of the newbs who will be reading this in the future.

It's so rewarding to do your own work as long as you have the time ... will .. and tools. It's been fun seeing texas993 bring his 500E (and now his 560SEL) up to snuff and these are the very best kinds of stories ... especially when people document their work verbally and photographically. You have no idea how this inspires others to keep their cars in great condition, so really looking forward to your future stories !!

 

[Roma_500E]

Thanks 744 definitely my favorite color too. As for the headlights and corners yep they are history. Fortunately I have a brand new factory Euro set for both (I have some great resources for parts). Also I had already been buying some here and there (brakes, wheels, etc.) in anticipation of buying one of these cars so that is going help ease the pain if even just a bit when I get hit with bill for the first parts order.

What do you mean by factory ? take off from Euro 500E ?

Are they 036 specific or just a regular w124 lights ?

Are you planning to get back to amber blinkers or clear 94-95 ?

Keep us in the loop on your project

 

[Roma_500E]

More than a couple of people have gotten very offended by me saying that ALL E500Es out there need $5K worth of work (likely more), but just take your rig to a good quality indy or a stealer and see how far $5K actually goes....one little job like motor mounts/transmission mount/flex discs and you're out $1,500 !!! Add new mirror boots into the mix, and perhaps getting a "woody" at Madera....well I just won't go on any more.....

The main thing is that you went in the RIGHT way. You did your homework, you were patient and talked to lots of people to get a sense for what you'd need to do, you planned it out, and you found a great "base" car in a great color combo to go forward from. You know up front generally what things are going to cost and you will do everything methodically. Textbook way to do it for all of the newbs who will be reading this in the future.

It's so rewarding to do your own work as long as you have the time ... will .. and tools. It's been fun seeing texas993 bring his 500E (and now his 560SEL) up to snuff and these are the very best kinds of stories ... especially when people document their work verbally and photographically. You have no idea how this inspires others to keep their cars in great condition, so really looking forward to your future stories !!

That is true , an average 500E among car enthusiast will need up to 5000k. The so called pristine one will need at least $2000 or so. As you said flex disc is something that you may not see but may want to replace it. Rubber mirror boots are almost $600 and this is VERY minor thing for $600. Chrome parts (may want to replace due to scuffs, chips or something like that) are very expensive. Wood parts as well . List just goes on and on even for pristine car.

So I do not feel it is offensive statement.

The most horrible thing is that below average (good condition) E500E from regular owner will need at the very least $15 000 K to make it more or less in a nice shape mechanic-wise, body-wise and interior- wise.

 

[captruff]

I have had conversations with Eric about his car and this car will be nice before all is said and done. The list to do and to replace is long, actually very long. Eric has been purchasing parts for the car well ahead of the purchase of the actual car. Here are his euro headlights and corners chillin in my office.



Jeff

 

[KarlC]

I have had conversations with Eric about his car and this car will be nice before all is said and done. The list to do and to replace is long, actually very long. Eric has been purchasing parts for the car well ahead of the purchase of the actual car. Here are his euro headlights and corners chillin in my office.



Jeff

Jeff you might want to open up the Euro headlight boxes and check carefully to make sure there is no damage, I have had the thin plastic sections break in shipping.

 

[captruff]

Jeff you might want to open up the Euro headlight boxes and check carefully to make sure there is no damage, I have had the thin plastic sections break in shipping.

Karl:

Yup I already peaked inside and we are good to go, no damage.

Jeff

 

[600Eric]

Update #01. OK car has been baselined in terms of cosmetics so I now really see what I have to work with. The good: she is straight as an arrow. The not as good: Although the paint cleaned up great she looks great from 10' away but if you get up close they are quite of few minor imperfections and wear from 22 years and 125K miles of use. I guess this is to be expected but I definitely see some re-painting in the future when I have the bumpers and lower cladding sprayed 744. Also had the headliner repaired so it is nice and tight again as it was sagging pretty bad when it showed up from Texas. As far as good news mechanically things seem to be pretty good so far. We threw our shop set of Monoblocks on it yesterday which have brand new rubber on them so I was able to take the car out and get on it pretty hard. Fortunately everything held up well and although it was probably only 30 or so miles of hard driving at the moment it appears that most of this work will be more of the deferred maintenance and upgrade type rather than actual repairs as the car ran pretty strong. Anyways here a few pretty cool pics of the wheel wells post detailing.





Once the new SA rotors come back from nickel plating and get thrown on with the rebuilt calipers these should look pretty sharp,

PS: I will also be selling the aluminum Brembos at that point if anyone is interested

 

[2phast]

Rubber mirror boots are almost $600 and this is VERY minor thing for $600.

I thought this sounded a bit off, just pulled up the boots via Parts.com. $474 for the pair.

 

[gerryvz]

I thought this sounded a bit off, just pulled up the boots via Parts.com. $474 for the pair.

Rik, he's talking list price.

Even then, $500 (with shipping) is not cheap, and well over double what they were just a couple of years ago.

Hot tip -- the early W124 mirror boots up to about 1990 are made out of a different, and more durable rubber. These earlier boots don't harden and crack like the later ones do. If you find a set in a wrecking yard, definitely grab them as they will be in much better shape than the later ones are.

Cheers,
Gerry

 

[gsxr]

Looks nice! FYI, you are missing the rubber plug for the hole in the body for the idler arm support, in the passenger front wheel well. Should be a few bucks for a new plug... keeps water and dirt from sitting inside the tube. Someone pressure-washed those inner fender wells, they are normally dirt colored, not body color! Looks pristine. Your front passenger engine encapsulation panel is partly broken, nothing critical, but could be replaced if you're aiming on a full restoration...

BTW, Rik, the mirror boots are $632/pair list price right now. Cheaper from parts.com of course, but not everyone shops there...

 

[2phast]

Rik, he's talking list price.

Even then, $500 (with shipping) is not cheap, and well over double what they were just a couple of years ago.

Hot tip -- the early W124 mirror boots up to about 1990 are made out of a different, and more durable rubber. These earlier boots don't harden and crack like the later ones do. If you find a set in a wrecking yard, definitely grab them as they will be in much better shape than the later ones are.

Cheers,
Gerry

Yes I know they are not cheap. I paid $178 a few years back.

I don't see any reason for anyone to be discussing parts replacement and using list prices. We all use other more economical resources for purchasing our parts and thus, our discussions should reflect that fact.

 

[gerryvz]

I don't see any reason for anyone to be discussing parts replacement and using list prices. We all use other more economical resources for purchasing our parts and thus, our discussions should reflect that fact.

Generally I agree, but for reference & comparison it's nice to have the list price. I know that when Dave and I quote parts prices, we generally will quote both the "list" and "discounted" (often parts.com, or AHAZ) price along with it.

 

[DerFuror]

...the mirror boots are $632/pair list price right now. Cheaper from parts.com of course, but not everyone shops there...

Holy sh*t!

I don't see any reason for anyone to be discussing parts replacement and using list prices. We all use other more economical resources for purchasing our parts and thus, our discussions should reflect that fact.

We read about it all the time in the forums; not everybody does the economical route. Retail's fo' suckas & what an ass-reaming that price is.

I can hear the stampede to the pick-a-parts already to supply the demand!

 

[Roma_500E]

Yes I know they are not cheap. I paid $178 a few years back.

I don't see any reason for anyone to be discussing parts replacement and using list prices. We all use other more economical resources for purchasing our parts and thus, our discussions should reflect that fact.

Well, in 2012 they were $150 a piece or something. I thought it is totally unreasonable and ridiculous and said that I would never ever buy them for $150 . So, whole sale price or whatever deal of $474 is anyway waaaaaay to high for these things. You can buy a set (!) of 4 decent brand new tires for the regular cars for this money.

Thanx God, previous owner had right rubber boot replaced very recently. For the left side I bought the whole mirror (!) for the $50 with the black nice and soft boot that came off 1994 car.

In addition there are people who do not have a discount or who has no idea how/where find them cheaper than dealer. In fact, for these rubber things dealer is only option. So you either "leave it or take it". Parts.com and dealer wholesale is the same .

 

[Roma_500E]

Once the new SA rotors come back from nickel plating and get thrown on with the rebuilt calipers these should look pretty sharp,

PS: I will also be selling the aluminum Brembos at that point if anyone is interested

Damn, this thing looks cleaner than mine wheel wellsI have to go and washed it with the shampoo one more time ASAP till I get it cleaner than yours

Great car ! I had exactly the same brakes and I have a set of SA brakes sitting in storage too . Still thinking if I want them or not :?

 

[gerryvz]

Parts.com and dealer wholesale is the same .

That is not correct.

Parts.com is LOWER than MBUSA wholesale in the price list. For a long time, parts.com pricing was "dealer cost + 15%" but a couple of years ago they raised it to "dealer cost + 20%" or about 30% less than MBUSA MSRP.

Dealer wholesale is [for most, but not all, parts] MSRP MINUS 20%. So generally speaking, parts.com prices are ~10+% BELOW wholesale, but ~20% ABOVE dealer cost (what dealers buy them from MBUSA at).

Make sense?

Dave can adjust/correct me a bit on the below, but it is generally correct.

You have three published prices from MBUSA on the confidential parts price list:

• MSRP = manufacturer's suggested retail price -- this is the suggested price that dealers should sell to the public at (via parts counter or service department). Many dealers discount this price a bit (for example for MBCA members) and other dealers mark it up another 10-30%, which really fleeces the customer. Also you have "matrix pricing" which can make the cost of a part more than 100% of MSRP for smaller parts and the like.
• Wholesale = generally MSRP minus 20%. This is the price that some dealers and internet sites will sell "discounted factory parts" at - for example Caliber Motors in California. I've heard of MB dealers who will sell parts at wholesale price to MBCA members too. [NOTE: Some dealers use their own 'matrixed' price for wholesale, which may be more than MBNA published wholesale pricing.]
• Dealer cost = the price that dealer service and parts departments acquire parts from MBUSA at. This is generally about 60% of the MSRP.

Parts.com is the lowest absolute seller of MB factory parts that I have ever seen. Their parts are generally in between Wholesale and Dealer cost, as I mentioned above. IMHO, anything at or below MB published wholesale price is a great deal on parts.

Cheers,
Gerry

[Minor GSXR edits to percentages above.]

 

[Roma_500E]

That is not correct.

Parts.com is LOWER than MBUSA wholesale in the price list. For a long time, parts.com pricing was "dealer cost + 15%" but a couple of years ago they raised it to "dealer cost + 20%" or about 30% less than MBUSA MSRP.

Dealer wholesale is, I believe, MSRP MINUS 20%. So generally speaking, parts.com prices are ~10+% BELOW wholesale, but ~20% ABOVE dealer cost (what dealers buy them from MBUSA at). I generally do not pay sales tax with parts.com, though I have been charged sales tax on some parts.com orders.

Make sense?

Cheers,
Gerry

Completely confused with your rocket science calculation Though got the main point.

However, in my case I do not pay tax which is 20% (discount) off + 7.65% (tax) total is 27% off. Sometimes I got at the dealer cost, no tax, no shipping charges. So I am sure it is the case with other folks here too cuz most of us have nice guys at dealers parts departments.

In case of parts.com I have to pay shipping +tax which makes it the same as dealer wholesale or even more expensive.